Does how you did in college really matter

[pilotyip]

You have to decide on what you want to be a college graduate or a pilot. If is a pilot, you fly airplanes and build resume stuff. It will take approximately 10 years to get to a career position in aviation. You have to commit to the time frame to make it. To not fly and get a degree may be fun but it does nothing for your flying career. Now to get a degree on the side while you are flying, nothing wrong with that. However, the fallback value of a degree is greatly over rated. I have a BS and a Master's in Management, but at age 53, I was making $250/wk loading cargo. After Zantop pretended to go out of went out of business in 1997, I had been a temporary High School Chemistry Teacher up until two weeks before the cargo job came along. However, they do not teach school in the summer so I had to take the cargo job. The value of an unused degree is highly over rated. 53 year old unemployed airline pilots are not eagerly greeted in any industry that I know of, even of having a couple degrees. Of course, I did not apply for many of the "College degree preferred jobs" such as apt manager, telephone direct sales, and plumbing floor manager at Home Depot, etc. If you get a college degree you have to use, the knowledge gained in college to develop a career or the degree is useless. After getting a degree, flying an airplane is not a knowledge expanding experience; it is skill development experience. Anyone care to chime in and share their experiences on entering the non-aviation job market after being out of college 20-30 years?

 

[pilotyip]

Forged; cool logo, looks just like the one on the fender of my 66 Conv. There are many ways to get an education besides college, military, trade schools, and on-the-job. We have had a majority of our non-college 121 check airman get on with major airlines. Part 121 TJ PIC will give you the same advantage as a college degree except at five airlines. However, there is a definite basis that the only path to the cockpit is through a 4-yr degree. That does not reflect reality of who is being hired at SWA, JB and AirTran.

 

[DC8 Flyer]

Yip

I have the "reverese" for you. I didn't even know I could be a pilot coming out of high school (stupid advisors!) So I spent 3 years at State earning one degree, then found out I could be a pilot, spent another 3 years at UND earing my ratings and yet another degree. Now here I sit with a pretty good job, good QOL, ok pay, etc etc. I did it all by going to college first (twice mind you!) and I am still in a good position. If I had followed your advice (not saying it is bad, just making a point) I would most likely be a furloughed Indy Air Capt, (I hope all you Indy guys make out ok!) or a displaced Eagle Capt. I wouldn't be at any major, maybe AirTran or JB, but those I don't want to be at either. Everything happens for a reason and everyones path is different but ultimately leads to the same goal, PERSONAL SATISFACTION.

You have a good "line" for an argument about college, but I believe it is misplaced. Of course it does not take a college degree to fly an airplane, any monkey can do that, just ask Haulingthemail :nuts: . It is stupid that some airlines won't interview or hire someone without a degree or someone with X amount of hours of helo time (helicopters are worthless by the way ) but no one said life was fair. If going to school and earning a degree gives me an advantage over someone who has been flying for a year or two before me, gee lemme thinkg, what should I do? By advantage I mean landing a job because of my degree and not how many hours I spend in the pattern or doing the same FSD to MSP run for a year.

I had a chance to go to Ameriflight, AirNet, and a couple of other cargo outfits and I really think those would have hurt me in the long run. Not beause they are bad companies or the experience(s) would have been bad, but because I would have had to move my family all over the country. Having a good flying job is about a hell of a lot more than equipement, pay and days off. The biggest thing is how much of that QOL do you get to spend with your family (for us family types) and if I had taken your cookie cutter route I wouldn't have what I have today THANK GOD!

/rant over

 

[inline]

Interviewed with a major carrier in the 80s all they wanted to see was the degree certificate itself. No transcripts.

 

[buttercup]

Forged; cool logo, looks just like the one on the fender of my 66 Conv. There are many ways to get an education besides college, military, trade schools, and on-the-job. We have had a majority of our non-college 121 check airman get on with major airlines. Part 121 TJ PIC will give you the same advantage as a college degree except at five airlines. However, there is a definite basis that the only path to the cockpit is through a 4-yr degree. That does not reflect reality of who is being hired at SWA, JB and AirTran.

Too bad they didnt offer degrees in "Self Worth" or "What pilots really deserved to be paid" or "100K isnt alot of money even though Pilotyp thinks it is"!

 

[pilotyip]

As214, it is relative if you have never made $100K is a great number. I believe the real world would tend to agree with this. If you once made $200K and got used to living on it might seem not so good. Only on the pilot board would $100K be sneered at as a property wage. Few people are as lucky as pilots who love to fly airplanes and are paid to do something them love. The rest of the world would be jealous. I am perfectly content, I am doing well, I am still living my dream from 58 years ago when at 5 years old. I decided I wanted to be a pilot. Trailer says it all.

 

[pilotyip]

DC-8, can not help it. I have to stand up my helo heros. Someone has to figure out why non helo guys and uninformed management knuckleheads don't view a multi-crew Captain time in an advanced IFR helo like the H-60, H-46, H-53 or H-47 as not real flight time. However, PIC in a VFR only C-150 in the traffic pattern is the breakfast of champions for an airline career. We have hired many military rotor heads and I have never been disappointed with their performance in training or on-line. Why are most management and insurance company’s sooooo out of touch with reality? Ops I am sorry I was management bashing again.

 

[atpcliff]

Hi!

Everything matters, in one way or another.

Say you're at a party, and you're supposed to meet a certain girl, and end up marrying her, having a family, etc. However, you know deep down that you don't really want to meet her, because you know how hard it's been in the past to get along with her, and you dread the thought of spending this whole life with her.

So, your subconscious intentionally pushes you to drink so much and do something stupid, so you break your arm and have to go to the hospital, missing your meeting with the woman scheduled to be your wife.

You go through this life a different way, and you're so relieved you didn't have to deal with that woman. Then, you die, and you find out what you did. GREAT! Instead of getting away with something, you find out you have to go back and try all over again to meet the woman, marry her, etc.

The more you try and resist your "density" (Back To The Future), the worse it gets each time.

So, the moral of the story? Be a man, face your fears, and try your best. In the end of this life, you'll be much more satisfied.

Good luck to you!

cliff
YIP

PS-Groundhog Day is a great movie!

 

[pilotyip]

cliff, you have been up too long, what did you say?

 

[Guitar Guy]

I haven't been asked much about my degree, which is in aeronautical engineering, in any interview I've had. Boeing probably asked a bit but AA didn't ask anything about it that I recall. AA was more interested in my Boeing background. When I took the plunge and started my flying career, neither the commuter I flew for nor NetJets asked much about my degree.

As for "going to college vs. flying for living", I'm very glad to have the background that I do. The years I spent at my desk, while not as fun as flying, did give me a world of background that I wouldn't have had otherwise.

 

[CaptainMark]

Pilot Careers
Qualifications

Typical qualifications for consideration as a FedEx pilot.

• Commercial Pilot Certificate with Multi-engine and Instrument rating (without limitations)
• Current ATP Certificate or written
• Current FE Turbojet Rating or written (FEX or Basic/turbojet)
• Must pass FAA mandated drug screen
• Recency and type of experience is considered
• Meet requirements for and currently hold First Class Medical certification
• College Degree from an accredited college or university
• Eligibility for rapid visa issuance, issued by offices in the United States to fly to any FedEx destination.
• Ability to obtain clearance from United States Postal Service for handling or access to U.S. mail, which includes FBI fingerprint check, and candidate must have resided in the United States for the last five consecutive years (except for U.S. military assignments)
• Eligibility for issuance of US Security Clearance
• 1500 hours total fixed-wing time as pilot-in-command (PIC) or second-in-command in multi-engine turbo-prop A/C or jet A/C or combination thereof, including a minimum of 1000 hours total fixed-wing pilot-in-command in multi-engine turbo prop A/C or jet A/C or combination thereof.
  Note: PIC for this purpose is defined as Captain/Aircraft Commander of record, not simply the sole manipulator of the controls.
  Note: FedEx considers only pilot time in fixed wing aircraft toward minimum qualifications. This does not include simulator, helicopter, flight engineer, bombardier, navigator, RIO, EWO, WSO, NFO, or Special Crew.
• All certificates and ratings required to be U.S.A. FAA issued

there it is in black and white...get it!

 

[pilotyip]

Yes FedEx is one of the college degree only airlines out there. But I think there is better change of college degree pilot being turned down by FedEx than there is of a non-degreed guy being turned down by JB, SWA, or AirTran. Some airlines do not let the absence of a degree stand in the way of hiring the right pilot. FedEx in its early days could have cared less about a college degree, I know a guy who went there in 1975 he was a NavCad.

 

[CaptainMark]

the only reason i posted that was to show that the degree is used to dwindle down the list of applicants..i have flown with guys at a previous job were were awesome aviators and did not go to college...i also know many guys that don't have college and are working other places..now if there was a shortage obviously that would be one of the quals that might disappear...but it is a requirement and if you have the means to get one ..you should..that's all

 

[800Dog]

Yes FedEx is one of the college degree only airlines out there. But I think there is better change of college degree pilot being turned down by FedEx than there is of a non-degreed guy being turned down by JB, SWA, or AirTran.

What? I am in the wrong line of work!

 

[SiuDude]

So...I'm pretty much in charrrrrge of this jet now!

Capt'n Sink Rate, is that you?