Do USAirways FOs (190) need first class every 6 months?

[Bad-Andy]

the company decides the solution is First class for all, but six months only for F/O over 40, WTF? How can I fly SIC international with a first class that reverts to a second class the second six months of my medical and not be in violation of this ICAO rule? A first class medical is only good for six months, what about the other six months!!!

I may be misunderstanding what you wrote here (if so, sorry, and disregard). But, under 40 the First Class is valid for 1 year now -- domestic or international. The ICAO requirement doesn't have anything to do with a time period per se. It just means you have to have a 1st Class medical, with a valid period (6 months over 40, 1 year under 40).

As for the company requirements, hopefully they can explain it a little more clearly than they have so far...

 

[LaGarbage Man]

I may be misunderstanding what you wrote here (if so, sorry, and disregard). But, under 40 the First Class is valid for 1 year now -- domestic or international. The ICAO requirement doesn't have anything to do with a time period per se. It just means you have to have a 1st Class medical, with a valid period (6 months over 40, 1 year under 40).

As for the company requirements, hopefully they can explain it a little more clearly than they have so far...

Don't you have a paper due ? Get back to the books !!

 

[LittleDeuce]

!st Class Medical

Don't you have a paper due ? Get back to the books !!

Gents'

You need a 1st class medical period! If your 1st class drops down to a 2nd class, you have to go back to the doctor.

All ICAO crew members must have a current 1st class medical!

 

[Carl S.]

FOM states first class for SIC once a year(over 40/A320 fleet)! Changed about two months ago. What about the last six months that it becomes a second class?

 

[Bad-Andy]

Little Deuce,

That is where the question lies. FOM says every six months. However, if you are under 40, it stays valid as a First Class for one year. It does not drop back to a second class until the one year point. Then it is valid as a second class for an additional year. So, do we need it every six months per company policy (as Carl pointed out), or do we only need to keep it at first class privledges????

GarbageMan -- I know, I know. At least I have the intro paragraph done. Not bad 1/4 of page 1 out of 35 pages finished. I still have a day and a half to go.... :laugh:

 

[eaglesview]

USAPA has been silent on this clust f*** since the FOM has changed for F.O. medicals, but out West our e-mails to Hogg and Bular are returned with misinformation! What other US airlines require a first class medical to operate international as SIC? None. Some East F/O in Europe got popped for only having a second class medical doing IRO duties and the company decides the solution is First class for all, but six months only for F/O over 40, WTF? How can I fly SIC international with a first class that reverts to a second class the second six months of my medical and not be in violation of this ICAO rule? A first class medical is only good for six months, what about the other six months!!!

UAL for starters.

 

[Carl S.]

My friends at UAL/CAL/AMR and Jetblue say no first class medical for SIC(not IRO) international.Can anyone look it up there, I am going on second hand info and do not have the documents in front of me. Still doen't answer the fact that after six months, the plus forty pilot has a second class medical for the rest of the year and is flying international with two classes of medicals per the FOM.

 

[regionalcap]

Here is what the Delta manual says.

*Captains and type-rated First Officers 39 years old and younger (in categories utilizing relief pilots) must obtain a First Class Certificate every 12 months.

*Captains and type-rated First Officers 40 years old and older (in categories utilizing relief pilots) must obtain a First Class Certificate every 6 months.

*All other First Officers must obtain a First Class Certificate every 12 months.

 

[Bringupthebird]

From the west pilot contract:​

A. COMPANY PHYSICAL STANDARDS AND
EXAMINATIONS
1. Physical standards for Company physical examinations
shall be no more restrictive than those
standards set forth in the Federal Aviation Regulations
and the FAA’s Waiver and Special Issuance
policies as being required to maintain an FAA Medical​

Certificate as specified in Subsection 15.D.3.

​

​

​

​

​

​

1. The FAA doesn't require a First Class physical for First Officers.
2. USAPA could care less.
3. For further explanation, see para 2. above​

 

[RUhiring?]

2. USAPA could care less.

I believe you meant to say "USAPA couldn't care less."

 

[LearLove]

Little Deuce,

That is where the question lies. FOM says every six months. However, if you are under 40, it stays valid as a First Class for one year. It does not drop back to a second class until the one year point. Then it is valid as a second class for an additional year. So, do we need it every six months per company policy (as Carl pointed out), or do we only need to keep it at first class privledges????

GarbageMan -- I know, I know. At least I have the intro paragraph done. Not bad 1/4 of page 1 out of 35 pages finished. I still have a day and a half to go.... :laugh:

I haven't looked at the FOM but the CBS message that came out a few weeks ago WRT this topic said that if your under 40 you need the first class once a year.

FOM 13.3.3, page 13-15

Crew Position Requirement
Captain​

-Over age 40: 1st class physical during each 6th calendar month

-Under age 40: 1st class physical during each ​

​

12th calendar month​

First Officer Flying in an Augmented Crew

-Over age 40: 1st class physical during each ​

​

6th calendar month​

-Under age 40: 1st class physical during each ​

​

12th calendar month​

First Officer

-Over age 60: 1st class physical during each ​

​

6th calendar month.​

-Under age 60: 1st class physical during each 12th calendar month​

​

 

[JAFI]

When you fly International you have to follow the rules in that country. ICAO is a "suggestion" to a country. That country decides if and when they want to adopt all or part of an ICAO suggestion. Your company is going for the most restrictive so they can dispatch you to all the countries they operate to. If you ignore your manual you may get to experience what that countries rules are when you get ramp checked.

If you don't want to spend the night in a Mexican jail you may want to follow your manual. I don't think showing that county your union contract will help much, even if you show them the Nic award........

 

[Bad-Andy]

Lear --

Thanks. That was the clarification I was looking for. Don't have access to CatCrew or the CBS messages again, yet. Thanks for posting that.

 

[Bringupthebird]

If you don't want to spend the night in a Mexican jail you may want to follow your manual. I don't think showing that county your union contract will help much, even if you show them the Nic award........

If the company had to pay for the 1st class, then it would be somewhat of a non-issue.

I would imagine the penalty in Mexico for doing just what the east is trying to do (unsuccessfully) would result in worse consequences than a ramp check. :laugh:

 

[Bringupthebird]

2. USAPA could care less.

I believe you meant to say "USAPA couldn't care less."

If they couldn't care less that would be a DFR. Giving them the benefit of the doubt, just speaks to their ineptness at managing a union (the "representing" part, not the "eating shrimp and drinking G&T on the union expense account" part.