DHL on CNBC

[Quasar]

http://www.cnbc.com/id/15840232?video=761048312

 

[abxdx]

http://www.cnbc.com/id/15840232?video=761048312

Should have asked the tough questions? Like, What would you like to say to the 7000 people you just put out of work.

 

[shooter]

What a piece of garbage. uke: I wonder how much DPWN paid CNBC for that farce?

You want tough questions? How about; How is it your competitors are able to continue to fly their freight? And that they have growth? Oh wait, you say you have been losing customers and oil is your red herring rather than say you have screwed up the operation to the point you feel its irreversible? Well, how did that happen? Was it the aviation operations that got you to the point of such a low customer base it is no longer affordable to fly your own packages? It's not? Well, then what have you done to correct the problem that has got you to this point? Nothing? Really? Nothing? Oh, by the way. I call BS on your "same as what the USPS does" talk. The USPS does not allow FedEx to sort their packages, only fly them. They know that if you allow your customers names and volumes known to your competitor, they just might use that to their advantage. But since you were so smart with the US operations, I am sure you know all will be fine.

They prove themselves to be dopes every time they open their mouth.

 

[shooter]

I was going to wait until the ink was on the contract with brown before jumping ship. I now recommend against that option and getting the F' OUT NOW! If you wait, you may be setting yourself up for DHL to turn the screw in you harder.

With the absolute need to have 100% focus on the UPS Aviation component and seeing that through to an accelerated execution, I have asked Dave Vernon to lead this through to implementation. ~ Ken Allen (bold added for emphasis by me)

http://www.scdigest.com/assets/On_Target/08-06-04-1.php?cid=1712

 

[shooter]

<H2>Ohio: DHL committed to UPS

Lt. Gov. Fisher says it's unlikely DHL will reconsider deal that will cost thousands of jobs at Wilmington hub.


By John Nolan
Staff Writer

Thursday, June 05, 2008
</H2>DHL's senior management is committed to following through on its plan to hire United Parcel Service to fly DHL packages domestically even though it will cost thousands of jobs at its Wilmington air freight hub, Ohio Lt. Gov. Lee Fisher said Wednesday, June 4.

"It's fair to say that they were pessimistic about the chances of being able to reconsider their decision," Fisher said by telephone after he and Gov. Ted Strickland met Wednesday with DHL executives in Columbus. "We have a huge challenge on our hands to overcome the momentum of DHL's decision to pursue an agreement with UPS."

The state will do everything it can to save the jobs, including investigating whether a DHL-UPS deal — to be finalized within three months — would violate U.S. antitrust law by reducing competition in the express package delivery market, Fisher said.

Fisher said DHL appears determined to conclude a contract with UPS, but also indicated a willingness to work with the state and Wilmington officials to find possible alternative uses for DHL's North American air freight sorting hub that could support other jobs there. How soon that would happen, or what the alternative use would be, no one has been able to say.

DHL will work with Ohio and local authorities, company spokesman Jonathan Baker said.

John Mullen, DHL's global chief executive, and Wolfgang Pordzik, its top U.S. official for governmental relations, met with Strickland and Fisher a day after meeting with Senate and House members in Washington, during what the company described as "courtesy visits."

U.S. Rep. Mike Turner, R-Centerville, said he met with Mullen and tried unsuccessfully to persuade him to reverse DHL's decision. It is unfair to Wilmington which has supported DHL, Turner said.

"The usual expectation when a company has losses is that they fire someone in the company, and not fire the town," Turner said.

DHL, which lost $900 million on its U.S. delivery operations last year, surprised state and Wilmington officials last week by announcing it would hire UPS and end the U.S. delivery work it gives to two carriers at Wilmington, ASTAR Air Cargo and ABX Air. ABX also operates the hub for DHL, along with other sorting facilities nationwide.

http://www.daytondailynews.com/n/content/oh/story/business/2008/06/04/ddn060408dhlweb.html

 

[AV80R]

... Oh, by the way. I call BS on your "same as what the USPS does" talk. The USPS does not allow FedEx to sort their packages, only fly them...

I didn't think we were supposed to sort your packages? I'm at brown and just flew with a senior captain who heard that we would only transport DHL packages that were already sorted? Is that info wrong?

I really feel sorry for you guys and hope that DHL will find some replacement routes and also for preferential interviews here at Brown IF we start hiring because of the deal - which personally I don't think we will. They'll just bring some old DC8s back from the graveyard and many over 60 guys who were actually thinking about retiring will decide to stay... You know, so the ones who have plenty get more plenty...

Btw, until just a few weeks ago the word on the street was the Fedex would do all that flying. I read it in several papers and my friends at purple had heard similar stories... I'd like to know what went wrong in their negotiations? UPS likes to do things their own way and doesn't like to sell their services at a bargain price - we were all really surprised here when we heard about it...

 

[Big Beer Belly]

I didn't think we were supposed to sort your packages? I'm at brown and just flew with a senior captain who heard that we would only transport DHL packages that were already sorted? Is that info wrong?

I really feel sorry for you guys and hope that DHL will find some replacement routes and also for preferential interviews here at Brown IF we start hiring because of the deal - which personally I don't think we will. They'll just bring some old DC8s back from the graveyard and many over 60 guys who were actually thinking about retiring will decide to stay... You know, so the ones who have plenty get more plenty...

Btw, until just a few weeks ago the word on the street was the Fedex would do all that flying. I read it in several papers and my friends at purple had heard similar stories... I'd like to know what went wrong in their negotiations? UPS likes to do things their own way and doesn't like to sell their services at a bargain price - we were all really surprised here when we heard about it...

AV8OR,

The only way this makes sense for UPS is to use existing infrastructure (i.e., acft, sort facilities). UPS will fly DHL cans from our existing gateways via existing space on our existing acft to our existing sorts which have additional capacity. DHL pkgs will be sorted and the process reversed.

As Mullen said yesterday on CNBC, look for more of these "infrastructure sharing" arrangements around the world.

DHL is basically abandoning the US domestic market. Infrastructure is being reduced by 34%. What is left is a skeleton which they believe will be adequate to service their international origin and destination product. Even so, much of the final mile delivery will be outsourced to the USPS. This arrangement allows DHL to focus on the international market and still have a means of servicing the US "profitably" (or so the plan goes.)

You're absolutely correct that this is a HUGE departure from UPS's past business practice and was a surprise for nearly everyone. I (and others) attribute this to UPS's new CEO thinking "outside the box". Davis is not a classical UPSer in that he started his career at an aviation technology company that UPS later acquired. Perhaps his lack of brown "inbreeding" and ability to see the merits of cooperating with a rival, where appropriate, had much to do with this deal.


BBB

 

[shooter]

I think DHL will be taking UPS international once you guys fly it to DHL gatways abroad in the near future. If you watch Mullen in that CNBC video, when asked that question, he gulps a "we are not talking about that right now" response.

 

[AV80R]

I think DHL will be taking UPS international...

Do you mean we will be flying DHL stuff overseas or they will be flying ours? I doubt we will be flying DHL stuff outside North America as DHL is huge overseas and hardly need our "help." Of course, you never know in this business...


BBB - Davis come from II Morrow, correct?

 

[hvydriver]

Do you mean we will be flying DHL stuff overseas or they will be flying ours? I doubt we will be flying DHL stuff outside North America as DHL is huge overseas and hardly need our "help." Of course, you never know in this business...

They will be flying UPS freight in Europe and Asia. This deal is setting up to be much bigger than just the US. And no pilot group, even the IPA, will be able to stop it.

 

[Big Beer Belly]

I think DHL will be taking UPS international once you guys fly it to DHL gatways abroad in the near future. If you watch Mullen in that CNBC video, when asked that question, he gulps a "we are not talking about that right now" response.

Funny... I read it exactly the other way. Mullen clearly is on board with the concept of "capacity sharing", as he calls it, and left open the possibility intl DHL volume might be outsourced in the future to UPS.

Given the HUGE investments UPS is making in international infrastructure (sorts in Shanghai, Shenzen most recently), purchasing local delivery services all over Asia and branding them brown... I highly doubt UPS intends to bypass their own investments/infrastructure and outsource... but one never knows.

BBB

 

[AV80R]

They will be flying UPS freight in Europe and Asia. This deal is setting up to be much bigger than just the US. And no pilot group, even the IPA, will be able to stop it.

Ok, we'll just scrap our scope protection then...

I think that UPS needed extra volume due to the slowing economy while DHL needed extra lift to offload their money losing parts of the US business - it’s a marriage of convenience. Once the economy improves and we need the space ourselves, and/or once DHL finds a permanent solution to their 'lift equation' this marriage will be dissolved in a heart beat... Then again, tomorrow we all might be flying for Great Wall Airlines...


Off the subject - a buddy of mine who flies for SAS said he overheard a couple of DHL pilots in Europe (they spoke in German) worrying about some of their jobs going to an Indian Airline that DHL controlled...

 

[shooter]

Funny... I read it exactly the other way. Mullen clearly is on board with the concept of "capacity sharing", as he calls it, and left open the possibility intl DHL volume might be outsourced in the future to UPS.

Given the HUGE investments UPS is making in international infrastructure (sorts in Shanghai, Shenzen most recently), purchasing local delivery services all over Asia and branding them brown... I highly doubt UPS intends to bypass their own investments/infrastructure and outsource... but one never knows.

BBB

And Astar thought the same when the new sort in CVG was dumped for ILN. Everyone thought the same when DHL dumped over a billion into ILN. As worker bees, we never know what these suits are thinking. All I know anymore is ask yourself if you cost more than the other guys. If you do, don't unpack. Very irrational no matter how you slice it. Another good reason for me to say goodbye to professional aviation. These guys are CRAZY! :nuts:

 

[AV80R]

... As worker bees, we never know what these suits are thinking. All I know anymore is ask yourself if you cost more than the other guys. If you do, don't unpack. Very irrational no matter how you slice it. Another good reason for me to say goodbye to professional aviation. These guys are CRAZY! :nuts:

Very true and you just never know. However, UPS just celebrated their 100 year anniversary in August of 2007 - it's a company that's absolutely paranoid about doing things ITS way and no other way! This need for control which we normally joke about might be a good thing for us in this particular instance...

 

[hvydriver]

Funny... I read it exactly the other way. Mullen clearly is on board with the concept of "capacity sharing", as he calls it, and left open the possibility intl DHL volume might be outsourced in the future to UPS.

Given the HUGE investments UPS is making in international infrastructure (sorts in Shanghai, Shenzen most recently), purchasing local delivery services all over Asia and branding them brown... I highly doubt UPS intends to bypass their own investments/infrastructure and outsource... but one never knows.

BBB

BBB,

I'm not picking on you guys. DHL has a network that rivals Purple/Brown outside of the US. Just a theory. All you have to do is look at Astar's history to know that when a big deal comes down the pike, scope isn't squat. (Not trying to stir anything up ABX guys. Just trying to illuminate to the UPS crowd that paper means nothing in a multibillion dollar deal.)

 

[shooter]

Very true and you just never know. However, UPS just celebrated their 100 year anniversary in August of 2007 - it's a company that's absolutely paranoid about doing things ITS way and no other way! This need for control which we normally joke about might be a good thing for us in this particular instance...

Oh I know, I have a few friends at UPS. The funny part is I don't think DHL understand the UPS business practices. If they think they will have a yellow jersey shadowing a UPS supervisor.....HA!......which they do to the ABX supervisors, they will be in for a surprise. I doubt UPS will even let them in the sort. :laugh:

 

[(o) (o)]

According to the guy in pilot recruitment at UPS, the guys in the pool should all be getting a call "within a couple of months". Timeframe from call to class was not disclosed.

Hope it's true.

Good luck to you!

 

[(o) (o)]

BBB,

I'm not picking on you guys. DHL has a network that rivals Purple/Brown outside of the US. Just a theory. All you have to do is look at Astar's history to know that when a big deal comes down the pike, scope isn't squat. (Not trying to stir anything up ABX guys. Just trying to illuminate to the UPS crowd that paper means nothing in a multibillion dollar deal.)

Man, you are really bitter aren't you?

Like the IPA has anything to do with this. Get off our backs.

 

[hvydriver]

Man, you are really bitter aren't you?

Like the IPA has anything to do with this. Get off our backs.

Hardly. I'm merely trying to give you guys a heads up, based on our experiences. Good luck to you.

 

[(o) (o)]

Hardly. I'm merely trying to give you guys a heads up, based on our experiences. Good luck to you.

Thanks for the doom and gloom forecast.

 

[hvydriver]

Rep. Mike Turner interview

>Just food for thought on my little globalization theory, UPS bros. Don't let your guard down, like we did.<

DHL, other firms should work out something better


Guest column: Rep. Mike Turner


Recently, DHL announced a proposed strategic alliance with UPS and the closure of its Wilmington, Ohio hub, causing the elimination of almost 8,000 Ohio jobs. Families from a nine-county area will be impacted with lost wages and needed health insurance. The Wilmington community will be the hardest hit, losing tax revenue necessary for schools and other important social services. All of this, despite DHL's promise that its acquisition of Wilmington's private airport facility would result in a state-of-the-art international package distribution center anchoring DHL's North American operations.


Unexpectedly, DHL appears to be abandoning its North American air operations and is ready to become merely a customer of UPS. After investing billions of dollars in acquiring, building, and operating a U.S. distribution system, DHL's surprising retreat raises serious questions about whether the real story is being told.

Rewind to just five years ago and you will find DHL operating at the Cincinnati-Northern Kentucky airport, Emery Worldwide operating at the Dayton airport, and Airborne Express operating in Wilmington. These three facilities were located in Southwest Ohio to take advantage of our central location and great workforce. Reportedly, Emery and Airborne operated profitably with DHL operating with minimal losses.

With DHL's acquisition of Airborne and UPS's acquisition of Emery, the facilities at the Cincinnati and Dayton airports sit idle. If the UPS-DHL transaction moves forward, all of these consolidations will result in a combined job loss of more than 10,000 for Southwest Ohio.


Five years ago, if UPS and DHL had announced the formation of a strategic alliance that would include the acquisition of Emery and Airborne and the consolidation of all four companies' U.S. operations, antitrust alarms would be blaring. Certainly, this new transaction needs to be viewed in light of the possibility that the acquisitions of Emery and Airborne were steps one and two of a stepped transaction. Perhaps, the UPS-DHL combination is step three.


But the review of this transaction should not stop there. Senior DHL officials acknowledged that the UPS-DHL strategic alliance in the U.S. market may include UPS-DHL's Asian and European operations in the future.

Currently, Wilmington's air hub is operated by DHL and its partner airlines ASTAR and ABX. DHL has reported increasing losses from its North American operations, which are projected to exceed $1 billion this year. ASTAR and ABX have indicated that savings can be found to lower DHL's costs. But it appears DHL is not interested in listening to either company's cost-cutting plans. If these jobs in Wilmington are to be saved, clearly ASTAR and ABX need to step forward with a viable plan that can counter UPS's offer, and DHL needs to listen.


Because of the thousands of jobs at risk for Ohio, and the serious questions of the market impact of a UPS/DHL combination, the entire Ohio congressional delegation, including both senators, sent a letter to the Justice Department requesting an antitrust investigation into this deal. Ohio Gov. Ted Strickland is similarly pursuing an antitrust review of the UPS/DHL combination.


But all of this should be unnecessary. If DHL lived up to its promises to Ohio and to the town of Wilmington, we could all be focusing on how to make DHL more successful. Wilmington's past support for DHL should count for something. The surrounding community accepted DHL's vision of a global company operating in their backyards and understands that DHL must curtail its losses. However, usually when a company is losing money they fire someone, not a whole town.


Rep. Mike Turner, R-Dayton, represents Ohio's 3rd District in the U.S. House.

 

[shooter]

ASTAR and ABX have indicated that savings can be found to lower DHL's costs. But it appears DHL is not interested in listening to either company's cost-cutting plans. If these jobs in Wilmington are to be saved, clearly ASTAR and ABX need to step forward with a viable plan that can counter UPS's offer, and DHL needs to listen.

DHL listen? Now thats finding the humor in tragedy.

 

[hvydriver]

Yeah, I didn't bother highlighting that Shooter, 'cause it would seem this deal is potentially much, much larger than just the appearance of DHL bailing out of the US. Looks to me like they might have figured out how to skirt anti-trust issues. "We're not selling out, we're just using xyz to move our material."

 

[shooter]

I agree, hvy.

 

[Browntothebone]

>Just food for thought on my little globalization theory, UPS bros. Don't let your guard down, like we did.<

DHL, other firms should work out something better


Guest column: Rep. Mike Turner


Recently, DHL announced a proposed strategic alliance with UPS and the closure of its Wilmington, Ohio hub, causing the elimination of almost 8,000 Ohio jobs. Families from a nine-county area will be impacted with lost wages and needed health insurance. The Wilmington community will be the hardest hit, losing tax revenue necessary for schools and other important social services. All of this, despite DHL's promise that its acquisition of Wilmington's private airport facility would result in a state-of-the-art international package distribution center anchoring DHL's North American operations.


Unexpectedly, DHL appears to be abandoning its North American air operations and is ready to become merely a customer of UPS. After investing billions of dollars in acquiring, building, and operating a U.S. distribution system, DHL's surprising retreat raises serious questions about whether the real story is being told.

Rewind to just five years ago and you will find DHL operating at the Cincinnati-Northern Kentucky airport, Emery Worldwide operating at the Dayton airport, and Airborne Express operating in Wilmington. These three facilities were located in Southwest Ohio to take advantage of our central location and great workforce. Reportedly, Emery and Airborne operated profitably with DHL operating with minimal losses.

With DHL's acquisition of Airborne and UPS's acquisition of Emery, the facilities at the Cincinnati and Dayton airports sit idle. If the UPS-DHL transaction moves forward, all of these consolidations will result in a combined job loss of more than 10,000 for Southwest Ohio.


Five years ago, if UPS and DHL had announced the formation of a strategic alliance that would include the acquisition of Emery and Airborne and the consolidation of all four companies' U.S. operations, antitrust alarms would be blaring. Certainly, this new transaction needs to be viewed in light of the possibility that the acquisitions of Emery and Airborne were steps one and two of a stepped transaction. Perhaps, the UPS-DHL combination is step three.


But the review of this transaction should not stop there. Senior DHL officials acknowledged that the UPS-DHL strategic alliance in the U.S. market may include UPS-DHL's Asian and European operations in the future.

Currently, Wilmington's air hub is operated by DHL and its partner airlines ASTAR and ABX. DHL has reported increasing losses from its North American operations, which are projected to exceed $1 billion this year. ASTAR and ABX have indicated that savings can be found to lower DHL's costs. But it appears DHL is not interested in listening to either company's cost-cutting plans. If these jobs in Wilmington are to be saved, clearly ASTAR and ABX need to step forward with a viable plan that can counter UPS's offer, and DHL needs to listen.


Because of the thousands of jobs at risk for Ohio, and the serious questions of the market impact of a UPS/DHL combination, the entire Ohio congressional delegation, including both senators, sent a letter to the Justice Department requesting an antitrust investigation into this deal. Ohio Gov. Ted Strickland is similarly pursuing an antitrust review of the UPS/DHL combination.


But all of this should be unnecessary. If DHL lived up to its promises to Ohio and to the town of Wilmington, we could all be focusing on how to make DHL more successful. Wilmington's past support for DHL should count for something. The surrounding community accepted DHL's vision of a global company operating in their backyards and understands that DHL must curtail its losses. However, usually when a company is losing money they fire someone, not a whole town.


Rep. Mike Turner, R-Dayton, represents Ohio's 3rd District in the U.S. House.

I can see UPS making a similar deal with DHL with UPS flying DHL volume worldwide or even UPS purchasing DHL from DP.
All existing international UPS routes must be flown by IPA crews. There are strict limits on how UPS can utilize subcontactors or common carriage.

 

[hvydriver]

I can see UPS making a similar deal with DHL with UPS flying DHL volume worldwide or even UPS purchasing DHL from DP.
All existing international UPS routes must be flown by IPA crews. There are strict limits on how UPS can utilize subcontactors or common carriage.

Brown, I agree. DHLAirways (now Astar) had similar provisions in our former CBA. Some guys on here think I have a bitter disposition toward UPS because of our fates with DHL. Nothing is further from the truth. When multi-billion dollar deals are on the line, contracts can and will be exploited. Learn from us, and don't let it be repeated is all I'm saying here. DP might consider selling DHL to UPS, but that's a pretty big gamble to take with your careers. A mutually beneficial alliance is much more likely as I doubt DPWN wants to give up DHL International. Too much money being made there. Just beware, that's all, ok? This country will be down to 2 good paying airlines after we and ABX are gone. Purple and Brown. That's a situation that we don't need.

 

[penguin22]

Five years ago, if UPS and DHL had announced the formation of a strategic alliance that would include the acquisition of Emery and Airborne and the consolidation of all four companies' U.S. operations, antitrust alarms would be blaring. Certainly, this new transaction needs to be viewed in light of the possibility that the acquisitions of Emery and Airborne were steps one and two of a stepped transaction. Perhaps, the UPS-DHL combination is step three.

Pretty interesting stuff here.

Question for Astar guys: Was the new CVG hub built before or after DPWN bought out DHL?
If it was already in the works before DPWN, then you can begin to look back on all the stupid decisions DHL has made since DPWN took over and they begin to make some sense.
When they bought out Airborne the new CVG hub wasn't big enough, so that forced a temporary move up to ILN until the rest of the plan could be played out in a couple years

 

[hvydriver]

Penguin,

If I recall correctly, we were in the new hub before the Germans bought DHL. We'd been planning some slow growth then bang, bang, Germans buy DHL, spin us off, and we're in the cornfield.

 

[penguin22]

Rep Turner might be on to something here

 

[hvydriver]

Hope so. We'll see. I've got a bad feeling about this....