Delta to Downsize ASA Flying

[KickItOut]

Longtime reader, smalltime poster.

A Delta newhire has claimed that once Delta escapes bankruptcy sometime this summer they will cut the guaranteed 80% of ASA flying in ATL by 40%.

Couldn't resist posting a sketchy rumor, sketchy source.

KickIt

 

[wms]

I think JA wants to be able to transfer the 80% departure guarantee ASA has to SKYW for negotiating power. To get DAL to agree to this he had to cave on pass priority, operational control of the ramp and ATL gate space.

Expect ASA to come to us and say now that we don't have a guarantee of flying for DAL you need to take concessions. I hope we have the spine not to give in to an empty threat, because the fact is none of the other DCI carriers have enough pilots to fly their own schedules much less ours. We'll probably feel some pain, but even without the 80% guarantee it's a threat they can't keep.

 

[~~~^~~~]

You know, it really doesn't matter IF they do it. The truth is, that they CAN. ASA is in a very perilous position with 7 other DCI carriers in ATL and zero scope.

My friends who should know something admit that they don't know anything, but things are getting very "spooky." Brian LaBreque has been spending his time in SLC.

I do not think ALPA has an answer for this problem. The cat is too far out of the bag. Would a contract make a difference? I don't know.

I expect ALPA will go down flighting, a' la' Eastern airlines. SkyWest will be the Continental of the regional world.

 

[wms]

When SKYW bought ASA we all had high hopes that things would improve because of JA's reputation as a stand-up guy. In fact, he may turn out to be Lorenzo Jr. The guys coming up in this industry who thing all the scab and alter-ego talk is yesterday's news from the 80s and that this is a new era, are gonna get a rude awakening.

 

[scarlet]

Delta Skywest and ASA Magmt teams are so STUPID !!! Go look at CAL and ExpressJet (for the most part) over the years they don't open and close bases??

Want to know when we will have a contract= when the pilots get real about making sure we are safe!!!!!! FAR you should not operate aircraft if you have the following problems IMSAFE.....

 

[XPOO]

Scarlet, dear, would you please put your daddy back on the phone. I'm having a hard time understanding you.

 

[outtahere]

Delta Skywest and ASA Magmt teams are so STUPID !!! Go look at CAL and ExpressJet (for the most part) over the years they don't open and close bases??
Want to know when we will have a contract= when the pilots get real about making sure we are safe!!!!!! FAR you should not operate aircraft if you have the following problems IMSAFE.....

Do you smoke crack? All of your posts seem to indicate the affirmitive.

 

[Headfake14]

...man, the last few rumors out there and deductive reasoning of recent events make this place more scary.

 

[surplus1]

When SKYW bought ASA we all had high hopes that things would improve because of JA's reputation as a stand-up guy.

Not picking on you but the reason we pilots get into the mess that we do is because too many of us believe that sort of nonsense.

There ARE no 'stand-up' guys in mangement; never have been; never will be. Managers don't care about people, they care only about money. You are a 'work unit' and they will buy or sell you whenever they feel like it. Lowest bid when they buy; highest bid when they sell.

They detest unions and will do whatever they can to prevent them or destroy them whenever they can. They will lie, cheat and violate contracts whenever they can get away with it. There's not a 'good buy' among them.

They have succeeded in preventing a union at SKYW because pilots choose to buy the snake oil that they sell. That's why the ASA and SKYW pilot groups are divided now. They have the upper hand because the SKYW pilots have given it to them. As long as that continues they will continue to play you against each other indefinitely.

At MSA and RAH they're now demanding 'training contracts' and pilots are foolish enough to sign them.

We are divided among ourselves and they are the winners because of it.:angryfire

 

[Oakum_Boy]

This is a new truck driver I'm cool in my uniform with backpack and Ipod career. I'm flying with total nimrods lately. They can't find good pilots anymore. Time to bail out.

 

[wms]

I learned my lesson within a month of the sale when JA started using us as a whipsaw instead of making the combined company the higher standard in aviation it could've been. So far he has been unsuccessful at destroynig the pilots, but has been very successful at degrading SKYW, inc as a whole. He will eventually be successful at lowering the bar for the pilots, but the end result will be the sacrife of SKYW's rep as an airline that's a cut above the rest. Already SKYW does not have the shining rep it used to have. Instead of breaking the mold and and leading us in a direction that could turn this company into something, we have been led into the same pit as the rest.

 

[SSDD]

Sadly,

When this whole thing started, many of us who have dealt with JA, and Skywest posted that you guys just didn't understand your adversary. Yet you insisted on numerous demands that just were not going to happen. Because you had all this "leverage". You were going to burn the place down, my MEC speaks for me. etc.

Now a lot of those hardliners have moved on, and the ones that are left are looking at crap.

 

[zawillif]

Longtime reader, smalltime poster.

A Delta newhire has claimed that once Delta escapes bankruptcy sometime this summer they will cut the guaranteed 80% of ASA flying in ATL by 40%.

Couldn't resist posting a sketchy rumor, sketchy source.

KickIt

Nice post KickItOut. Way to start a 5 pager.

 

[sweptback]

Sadly,

When this whole thing started, many of us who have dealt with JA, and Skywest posted that you guys just didn't understand your adversary. Yet you insisted on numerous demands that just were not going to happen. Because you had all this "leverage". You were going to burn the place down, my MEC speaks for me. etc.

Now a lot of those hardliners have moved on, and the ones that are left are looking at crap.

I don't understand what the answer is then, undercut you guys? Because that's exactly what the current Management offer on the table would do.

 

[COOPERVANE]

I don't understand what the answer is then, undercut you guys? Because that's exactly what the current Management offer on the table would do.

Pilots aren't used to unwinnable situations. Maybe there ISN'T an answer.

I'm so tired of this.

Maybe we SHOULD undercut SKW....... lower our pay scales and lower theirs in the process. Go out in a ball of fire!!!!

Now someone will post "don't let the door hit you in the a$$"

 

[wms]

Sadly,

When this whole thing started, many of us who have dealt with JA, and Skywest posted that you guys just didn't understand your adversary. Yet you insisted on numerous demands that just were not going to happen. Because you had all this "leverage". You were going to burn the place down, my MEC speaks for me. etc.

Now a lot of those hardliners have moved on, and the ones that are left are looking at crap.

We still have leverage. Other DCI carriers don't have enought pilots to fly their own schedules much less ASA's. The leverage is that supply and demand is finally on our side.

 

[CFIT]

We still have leverage. Other DCI carriers don't have enought pilots to fly their own schedules much less ASA's. The leverage is that supply and demand is finally on our side.

Don't kid yourself, you're still screwed.

Jerry has many reasons to squash ASA ALPA and from my perspective Jerry is kicking but.

The only "leverage" you may have is if (and that a big IF) SkyWest pilots vote in ALPA and then the initial contract would be drug out like ASA's for years.

So if SkyWest pilots vote in ALPA and....
If we can get a contract put together in about 4 to 5 years and....
If we can get the ASA MEC and the SkyWest MEC to colaborate on a joint contract, then....

In about 8 to 10 years we will have it made, we will be one gaint bad a$$ed group of pilots and we will be able to have everything we want.

Right up until management starts a new certificate under SkyWest Inc. and all the flying is transfered there, kind of like something that is supposed to be announced in the next 2 weeks.

 

[ASADriver]

Skywest pilots, let this be a lesson - ALPA is a waist of money. Things are going down hill fast here.

 

[ACL65PILOT]

All of these rumors are what I have been hearing too. From what it appears to be is DAL trying to make us violate the DCI contract. If that happens they can redefine our flying. Expect to see it happen. I am fairly confident it is not if but when.

 

[~~~^~~~]

I'm certainly not saying you are wrong. I have no information to the contrary. But, Delta doing something to tarnish their own brand coming out of bankruptcy does not make sense. If Delta wanted to divert flying from ASA, they have the power to do so without pushing ASA / SkyWest into non compliance. After all, Jerry and Jerry could agree to simply ink in "SkyWest" where the contract currently specifies ASA.

SkyWest invested in Delta when the chips were down and saved the company by allowing Delta to continue their relationship with their credit card vendor. I don't think Delta wants to attack SkyWest. It is not out of the realm of possibility, but I really don't think SkyWest has done anything to warrant such a change.

Further, the laws of supply and demand are catching up with the profession. SkyWest does not have 1,800 pilots to replace ASA. Again, they could eventually, but right now harming ASA would also damage SkyWest, Inc.

SkyWest has been buying back shares of its own stock lately. That means the Company (1) Does not have a better use for its cash and (2) They think the stock will probably go up. Airlines have called this wrong before (Mullin sure did at DAL) but at least at the top SkyWest is bullish on SkyWest.

Things always look horrible right before a contract. Think how bad things looked at Comair just a few weeks ago. ASA is still growing, slightly, upgrading and hiring like gangbusters.

Yes - I do firmly believe we need a contract with scope / merger protections NOW, even if we have to give on PBS, $2.00 an hour, or whatever. I plan to communicate my opinion to my representatives that we need to bargain for our survival while ensuring we will not be bargaining for our survival again. We can not count on the SkyWest pilots to fix ALPA's scope problem. We must do it ourselves. SkyWest needs pilots, we need jobs, there is common ground unless Delta simply pulls the plug. I think the plug would get pulled on Mesa before us, but no one seems to actually know anything.

I don't think Delta would be talking billion dollar contract strategy with new hire line pilots, but they might. I'm going to hope that my friend ACL65Pilot is getting incorrect info, just so I can sleep at night.

This industry is replete with examples of job stress carrying over into a lack of professionalism and safety on the flight deck. We need to stay focused during these uncertain times and not get too wound up about stuff we have no control over.