Delta Q1 Report more aircraft phase outs

[General Lee]

GL your softening. As things/morale improve, large numbers in hiring begins, I will miss the old F-the RJ's/regionals GL.

I don't think I ever directed it directly at the RJ pilots (except for a couple notable ones at Comair). RJs in general have been bad for the industry, because they have been allowed to replace better paying jobs. Who is at fault? Most will say mainline pilots for allowing it. I think that is correct partly, because initially mainline pilots didn't realize the affect it would have, and then the whole can of worms opened up. In BK it got worse, and then high oil started to take it's toll on RJs and the economics were truly shown. They just can't make money with high oil. As far as Comair goes, I don't think Delta ever forgot about the $1 billion they lost during the Comair strike.


Bye Bye---General Lee

 

[General Lee]

Another point about the 8-10% capacity reduction after Labor Day to Europe. If you notice what type of planes are flying out of ATL this Summer to Europe, a lot of them are A330-300s. Dublin, Barcelona, Amsterdam, and a lot of other nonstops from ATL will be A330-300s this Summer, for the first time. Those are big planes, with lots of seats, which is good when the busy Summer season is happening. After that is over, too many seats is a bad thing. If you went from an A330 to a 767, that could be an 8-10% reduction in seats. Those A330s could then be put somewhere where loads might be more full, like Hawaii or South America, or back to Asia if it starts to recover in earnest. That is another way to reduce seats by 8-10%---just throw on a smaller plane.


Bye Bye---General Lee

 

[damnflyboy]

Good luck to everyone. This is going to get ugly (again).

 

[screech]

Another point about the 8-10% capacity reduction after Labor Day to Europe. If you notice what type of planes are flying out of ATL this Summer to Europe, a lot of them are A330-300s. Dublin, Barcelona, Amsterdam, and a lot of other nonstops from ATL will be A330-300s this Summer, for the first time. Those are big planes, with lots of seats, which is good when the busy Summer season is happening. After that is over, too many seats is a bad thing. If you went from an A330 to a 767, that could be an 8-10% reduction in seats. Those A330s could then be put somewhere where loads might be more full, like Hawaii or South America, or back to Asia if it starts to recover in earnest. That is another way to reduce seats by 8-10%---just throw on a smaller plane.


Bye Bye---General Lee

Thats a good thought. I believe Delta's A330-300's are 298 seats. I flew JFK-FCO last september on the 330-300 and it went out full (100% load factor) Actually got stuck for a whole day trying to get out. The smallest equiapment those days were 767-300's. I spoke to a CS sup and according to him EVERY Delta flight went out full from JFK. his words "they're not giving away the seats either" Tel Aviv uses the 744, full. Anyway, reducing the Transatlantic to 330's from 777 and 767 from 330's is still alot of big equipment.
Maybe the 777's can run across the pond to Accra and Lagos or keep the LR's going to ICN and HKG etc...

seems like Delta fleet planning will figure it out. probably a monumental task with 9 types, plus subfleets with different ranges and weights.

 

[screech]

Also, it seems like Delta might be pushing their planes beyond their reasonable range. tried to get back from FCO to ATL, and the 330 was supposedly weight restricted. 5000 miles is well within the A330's max range but maybe they had an alternate or a runway limit.

 

[Kaman]

This is just an addendum to previously announced capacity cuts at DL. This is a report to shareholders on the status of the company after first quarter metrics were analyzed by senior management. Still, very good additional information and I think it is a good thing that DL is being proactive in their attempt to reduce capacity by retiring aircraft that are less efficient. Retiring the SAABs isn't the best thing in the world at my level, but certainly was inevitable. EAS isn't a sustainable program in the today's economic climate and airlines that are smart will re-tool their business models to adapt or continue at their peril.

 

[flyboyike]

Good luck to everyone. This is going to get ugly (again).

I hope you're wrong, but my fears tell me otherwise.

 

[bri5150]

I don't think I ever directed it directly at the RJ pilots (except for a couple notable ones at Comair). RJs in general have been bad for the industry, because they have been allowed to replace better paying jobs. Who is at fault? Most will say mainline pilots for allowing it. I think that is correct partly, because initially mainline pilots didn't realize the affect it would have, and then the whole can of worms opened up. In BK it got worse, and then high oil started to take it's toll on RJs and the economics were truly shown. They just can't make money with high oil. As far as Comair goes, I don't think Delta ever forgot about the $1 billion they lost during the Comair strike.


Bye Bye---General Lee

Honesly, I am not trying to rip into the General here, but check this out. First, the discussion is about how mainline pilots are "partly" to blame for regional growth with lower paying jobs. Then, at the end of the discussion, there is talk about how Comair got screwed because they were trying to get better wages. How could a regional pilot possibly do more to right the situation? I say mainline pilots are FULLY to blame (unless you are putting management in the blame game because they brought the idea up to begin with).

 

[RJLoser]

Also, it seems like Delta might be pushing their planes beyond their reasonable range. tried to get back from FCO to ATL, and the 330 was supposedly weight restricted. 5000 miles is well within the A330's max range but maybe they had an alternate or a runway limit.

Cargo boots pax sometimes.

 

[General Lee]

Thats a good thought. I believe Delta's A330-300's are 298 seats. I flew JFK-FCO last september on the 330-300 and it went out full (100% load factor) Actually got stuck for a whole day trying to get out. The smallest equiapment those days were 767-300's. I spoke to a CS sup and according to him EVERY Delta flight went out full from JFK. his words "they're not giving away the seats either" Tel Aviv uses the 744, full. Anyway, reducing the Transatlantic to 330's from 777 and 767 from 330's is still alot of big equipment.
Maybe the 777's can run across the pond to Accra and Lagos or keep the LR's going to ICN and HKG etc...

seems like Delta fleet planning will figure it out. probably a monumental task with 9 types, plus subfleets with different ranges and weights.

You're right, it might be tough to figure out what goes where, but apparently the guys in "route planning" were extremely excited (only they would be) about the prospect of having more types. They liked the challenge of finding the right route for the right sized plane. Look at ATL now, there are DC9s and A319s all over the place, and those are smaller than DL's previous smallest airplane domestically, the MD88 (DL did get 10 737-700s, but most do Central America and a few domestic). I think they are replacing the 777 to Lagos this Summer with an A332, and moving planes around again to find the correct one for capacity. Those guys in Route Planning enjoy their jobs, I hear, and now they have more to work with.


Bye Bye---General Lee

 

[General Lee]

Honesly, I am not trying to rip into the General here, but check this out. First, the discussion is about how mainline pilots are "partly" to blame for regional growth with lower paying jobs. Then, at the end of the discussion, there is talk about how Comair got screwed because they were trying to get better wages. How could a regional pilot possibly do more to right the situation? I say mainline pilots are FULLY to blame (unless you are putting management in the blame game because they brought the idea up to begin with).

Not in Delta's eyes. They never forgot the CVG strike, and how it pretty much shut the place down, costing $1 billion. After that, Delta started moving regionals to different hubs, to ensure a hub doesn't close with one strike. I could see why the Comair pilots wanted more money, everyone does. I also didn't agree how their MEC Chair wanted to trade more 70 seat RJs for allowing furloughed Delta pilots to go to the bottom of their list, even though Delta owned Comair. So, I am not too unhappy about watching Comair shrink.


Bye Bye--General Lee

 

[General Lee]

Also, it seems like Delta might be pushing their planes beyond their reasonable range. tried to get back from FCO to ATL, and the 330 was supposedly weight restricted. 5000 miles is well within the A330's max range but maybe they had an alternate or a runway limit.

Were you on the jumpseat? If you were, you would be counted as crew, and I don't think they can bump crew. If you were a non-rev in the back, then they could bump you. And the other poster was correct, cargo sometimes bumps non-revs. Next time, always go for the jumpseat, unless you have family you don't want to leave behind.


Bye Bye--General Lee

 

[flyboyike]

So, I am not too unhappy about watching Comair shrink.

That's OK, it seems everybody secretly (and in some cases not secretly) enjoys watching someone else shrink. I'm OK with that, I figure some day maybe I'll get to enjoy somebody else' "significant shrinkage".

Or not.

 

[SizzleChest]

Here's some more for you... first 8 of them now an additional 6..... equals 14!

http://finance.yahoo.com/news/Republic-Airways-Amends-Delta-bw-4067732598.html?x=0&.v=1

 

[twobits]

I guess we will have to watch Delta shrink too now - what you wish on others, you normally get right back (directed to GL). I bet Delta will be down to 9000 pilots by the end of 2013. Republic will be taking Delta flying, and competing with Delta at the same time. Comair will be down to 50 airplanes. ASA will rid itself of all it's 50 seaters; and quite a few pilots...... and General Lee will still be wasting his life away posting on this message board; offering his opinions to those that are naive enough to listen to him. What a sad and pathetic existence - I kind of feel bad for the guy.