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Delta Connection Pilots - Shot Across The Bow

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Delta RFP's flying every Tuesday, with pilot contract gutting by the DCI carriers on Wednesdays.
 
As others have said, the only way we can stop this is by educating the CFI's and prospective pilots. They are the true problem. All the lowball airlines keep expanding, guess who's feeding that? THe low time people who don't understand what they're getting into, and don't care at first unless they have a quick upgrade or can fly a jet. THat's the weak link for us pilots, and that's the only way to stop the downward spiral (or else just wait for economics and supply and demand to find a balance, which may not be in our favor). The passengers in general couldn't care less, as long as their tickets are cheap and planes aren't crashing.
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I attended a UND seminar in the early 90's where they told us how bad it was and how we probably wouldn't even make it to the majors. Apparently their honest advice fell on deaf ears as I pursued it anyway.

Aviation has always been about "paying dues." Start small, get experience, move on to bigger and better. The difference is that the rj's could be both the first and last stop on that progression.
 
Medeco said:
You missed the point of the ad, but that is not surprising.

These pilot groups are saying shame on you(company) for asking for paycuts(Comair) and for suggesting we(ASA) have a "Zero-net-gain" contract after four years of negotiations.

But nevermind, your to shortsighted to see things for what they are.

Medeco
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the ad itself was quite misleading. Pilots quitting at an alarming rate? So what attrition is good for everyone. Also there are still plenty of people to fill the job for now. On time performance has little to do with pilots quitting. It has more to do with wx, mx, etc. In fact I have never had a cancellation due to no crewmember. Had a couple delays but not many. They also did not post what pilots make after the first year. They just threw 19k a year out there as an arbitrary number without telling people that is only for the first year. Basically the ad was a waste of time. If anything it will make people think what a bunch of fools going to work for that little, that is their problem not mine. Also I highly doubt the boardroom cares. The public is used to labor unrest by now.

Also saying it is unfair about how the ASA contract is going is futile. Everyone agreed to work under the terms of the RLA. Like it or not it is the law of the land and probably not going anywhere soon. It is essential to the transportation industry not to have work stoppages except under extreme circumstances. You have all entrusted your right to strike to the NMB. They will let you strike when all other options have been exhausted. Four years is a long time but there is no set period to allow a strike. There is no law stating when a contract has to be done under the RLA. Basically the ad seems like complaining for terms we all agreed to work under (except comair, that part I can see having an ad for).
 
Flyer1015 said:
The irony that is so blatantly obvious... I love it!
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I get the irony, I still felt the need to say it, and I'm sure he chuckles to himself at home or the hotel room when he gets reponses like mine.

It still doesnt change the fact that the person behind the computer of "Scott Hall" is a moron.

Medeco
 
HelloNewman said:
Basically the ad was a waste of time. If anything it will make people think what a bunch of fools going to work for that little, that is their problem not mine. Also I highly doubt the boardroom cares. The public is used to labor unrest by now.
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Oh ok. Well don't tell that to all the pissed off passengers in Atlanta the other day who thought all the cancelled flights were for the labor shortage mentioned in the ad. You know, since all the gate agents hand out free copies of the McPaper. It seems someone cared and I'm sure Delta got plenty of phone calls.
 
HelloNewman said:
Also saying it is unfair about how the ASA contract is going is futile. Everyone agreed to work under the terms of the RLA. Like it or not it is the law of the land and probably not going anywhere soon. It is essential to the transportation industry not to have work stoppages except under extreme circumstances. You have all entrusted your right to strike to the NMB. They will let you strike when all other options have been exhausted. Four years is a long time but there is no set period to allow a strike. There is no law stating when a contract has to be done under the RLA. Basically the ad seems like complaining for terms we all agreed to work under (except comair, that part I can see having an ad for).
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Tell us oh wise one, how long have you been in this industry? On what basis should we listen to and believe any of the crap you spew? Please tell us, because right now, just about everyone here, and apparently quite a few at Skywest who say they know you think you're a total joke.
 
HelloNewman said:
the ad itself was quite misleading. Pilots quitting at an alarming rate? So what attrition is good for everyone. Also there are still plenty of people to fill the job for now. On time performance has little to do with pilots quitting. It has more to do with wx, mx, etc. In fact I have never had a cancellation due to no crewmember. Had a couple delays but not many. They also did not post what pilots make after the first year. They just threw 19k a year out there as an arbitrary number without telling people that is only for the first year. Basically the ad was a waste of time. If anything it will make people think what a bunch of fools going to work for that little, that is their problem not mine. Also I highly doubt the boardroom cares. The public is used to labor unrest by now.

Also saying it is unfair about how the ASA contract is going is futile. Everyone agreed to work under the terms of the RLA. Like it or not it is the law of the land and probably not going anywhere soon. It is essential to the transportation industry not to have work stoppages except under extreme circumstances. You have all entrusted your right to strike to the NMB. They will let you strike when all other options have been exhausted. Four years is a long time but there is no set period to allow a strike. There is no law stating when a contract has to be done under the RLA. Basically the ad seems like complaining for terms we all agreed to work under (except comair, that part I can see having an ad for).
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Sound like mid-level airline management peon drivel to me....
 
I liked the part on the bottom where ALPA is blaming Delta. Don't DCI carriers have their own MEC's. Do they not negotiate their own contracts?
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Yes, you are missing something. The DCI carriers indeed have their own MEC's, but they are negotiating their contracts with Delta -- hence the blame being put on...Delta.

Comair management has repeated countless times that they just can't budge in negotiations because Delta gave them a hard and fast number to attain. BTW, Comair is owned by...you guessed it...Delta.

Everybody else is competing for the flying being handed out by...Delta. Delta hands out the flying to those who will do it cheapest. Thus, any contract negotiated by an individual MEC must either be substandard or relinquish flying. Who set it up that way? Delta.

Any more questions?
 
HelloNewman said:
Wow guess that is how pilots with a different opinon are treated. They are labeled management or whatever else you come up with. Yet another reason the ALPA drive will fail.
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That, and your ignorant rant about engine failures in the Aspen thread give you away. Back to your 9-5 cubicle, you loser.
 
Medeco said:
I get the irony, I still felt the need to say it, and I'm sure he chuckles to himself at home or the hotel room when he gets reponses like mine.

It still doesnt change the fact that the person behind the computer of "Scott Hall" is a moron.

Medeco
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I agree he is a moron, but for different reasons than you do. Are you aware that he is pulling your leg? He is one of the union morons trying to make Scott look bad. You aren't too bright are you?
 
If you are forced to fly with inexperienced pilots, write them up and send them back to the training department, preferably at an out station. Ask yourself if you became incapacitated could your FO get the plane back on the ground safely alone, if you have any doubts about your FO's ability then you already have your answer. Safety is always your first duty, don't compromise it, don't carry someone, fly safe. You are a line pilot not a check airman, it is not your job, but it is your ticket. You may even believe that the young pilot will eventualy be a good competent crew member with additional training and experience, which the training department will provide either online or in the sim. This is their job and they are authorized to do it.Fly safe.
 
ASADriver said:
I agree he is a moron, but for different reasons than you do. Are you aware that he is pulling your leg? He is one of the union morons trying to make Scott look bad. You aren't too bright are you?
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Oh my god, you must be kidding me! I was SURE that was the real scott hall! I'm so disappointed!!! :rolleyes:

Seriously though, yeah it's hilarious. And according to the real Scott Hall, he thinks its funny too. So back off, ASAdrivel. This won't win you a promotion, or the coveted spot under BL's desk.
 
John Pennekamp said:
Oh my god, you must be kidding me! I was SURE that was the real scott hall! I'm so disappointed!!! :rolleyes:

Seriously though, yeah it's hilarious. And according to the real Scott Hall, he thinks its funny too. So back off, ASAdrivel. This won't win you a promotion, or the coveted spot under BL's desk.
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He is definitely NOT scott hall.
 
Would have been great if copies of the ad were distributed to all those passengers standing around concourses C & D. I mean there were a ton of PO'd people up there! Maybe BL should have been passing out some of those stale xmas cookies! Even better make copies for the seat pockets!

STRIKE ASA - The ASA Division of Skywest Inc!
 
ASARJMan said:
Would have been great if copies of the ad were distributed to all those passengers standing around concourses C & D. I mean there were a ton of PO'd people up there! Maybe BL should have been passing out some of those stale xmas cookies! Even better make copies for the seat pockets!

STRIKE ASA - The ASA Division of Skywest Inc!
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They were. The gate hands out the USA Today every morning! Pax were reading it at the gate, then bitching out the gate agents for their flight getting cannceled due to the "pilot shortage"!
 
Aw man, that be a beautiful thing. Wonder if ASA will cancel their USA Today subscriptions now?

STRIKE ASA!
RELEASE US Mr. Mediator Man!
 
flyer172r said:
No, it won't. All it will mean is that the airlines will lower their minimums even lower than they already are.
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I've been told that ASA can't fill classes now at 600/100 minimums. That is part of the reason that they are cancelling so many flights. The other part is that many people who already work there are bailing to go to Big Delta or the fractionals.

You'd think that might make them want to settle the contract.

Of course, if completion factor falls below a certain level, DAL can probably reject the DCI contract and replace ASA with Skywest. Maybe that is JA's secret plan.
 
blueridge71 said:
Of course, if completion factor falls below a certain level, DAL can probably reject the DCI contract and replace ASA with Skywest. Maybe that is JA's secret plan.
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That Jerry Atkin guy is pretty smart. This whole time I thought incompetent management at ASA was the problem. Evidentally, it's the solution!
 
Last edited:
1 Feb 07
ASA wuz cnx'ing flights and handing out copies of USA Today... not knowing the full page ad wuz there.... That is poetic..... Bouyyyyyyyyyyy
 

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