declaring an emergency

[avbug]

I was kind of hoping you'd respond...thanks.

 

[Diesel]

I've held off on posting partly because reading avbug's life story is so interesting. I look back and remembered I used to be that guy. I used to be that guy kicking arse and taking names. If it was flying float planes or king air's into 1500 ft dirt strips. I was avbug. Then my world changed. The golden bullet finally got me.

In the middle of a cold winter night my boss was killed and that's when I realized I was on the ragged edge. I needed to close that chapter in my life.

I don't think you can seperate flying like avbug and then putting on a different hat and flying 121, 135, or 91. You either are that risk taker hanging it all out or your not. When the shizle hits the fan your going back to your old way of doing things. It's a life changing decision!

I went to where I work today and I had the biggest shock of my life. Checklists and discipline where now the rule not the exception. Training, CRM, and SOP's they were now my life. I was no longer thinking how is this going to affect tomorrow's flight. How can I limp this plane back home? Not anymore. It's broke it's broke.

And then one day it happened. Climbing out I hit a goose solid IFR at 200kts right through the engine. First words out of my mouth was we're declaring an emergency. Because now anything where I have to pull an emergency checklist or might affect my completing this flight safely is an emergency.

It is better to err on the side of safety and declaring an emergency than to be put number 2 behind a 150 on final just so you don't have to say those few words.

Besides I think they like driving the fire trucks around the airports.

 

[avbug]

They do like driving the trucks at the airports.

However, whatever image you might have of who you think I might be, you are mistaken; nothing I do is less than professional. I don't take chances; I don't act rashly; I don't go play cowboy, and I don't divide my flying one from the other. I approach every action deliberately and with care.

The golden whatever...the list of co-workers, friends, and associates I've known over the years who have been injured and killed is long. I have loaded a friend in an airplane and watched it burn a few minutes later. I've watched one with whom I closely worked fly through multiple powerlines ahead of me. I've dreampt of a friend and awakened to learn of his death that very night, in an airplane. No golden whatevers. That's reality. Airplanes and helicopters and flying machines are just that...machines.

In a potential "emergency," I don't grab the microphone first. I fly the airplane. That's not preference, nor technique; it's the only professional course of action. Fly first, talk later.

I calculate performance. I check weather. I check notams. I file. I strive for precision. No rolling through life with my hair on fire. I didn't do that when I was eighteen, and I don't do it now, either. I don't "kick arse." I don't "take names." I don't fly King Air's off 1,500' dirt strips. I fly plain jane every day airplanes and am fortunate to be paid to do it.

I hit a goose too...or an owl, or who knows what. Last year, late at night, above 10,000, while slowing to 250 outside Las Vegas. It smashed the radome, and made quite a racket. It went up and over the forward copilot windscreen. No golden whatever there, either. And no, I didn't declare an emergency. Didn't even know what had happened (only that something had) until I looked at it on the ground, and didn't realize the real damage until I returned the next day. There was no emergency to "declare."

I've never submitted that requesting priority is out of line; if you need it, don't ask for it, take it. You have that right. Advise ATC of your intentions.

What I have stipulated is that many pilots feel that a formal "declaration" is the holy frisbee, the great ushering of power and grace that some how changes something. It doesn't. And it isn't necessary to get help. Fly the airplane, and when able, state the problem and intentions. If calling it an emergency is the bees knees, then have at it.

 

[wiggsfly]

I've done it twice. Last April I lost an engine in a skyhawk when the crankshaft seal blew out. That was fun between the smoke, the windshield covered in oil, and a sudden brake in the clouds I had really thought I was on fire. There ain't nothin like a deadstick landing with no windshield.

The first time I was on my instrument checkride. We had takes off and I was puutting on the foggles when we blew a mag (literally came right off the engine). In that case the examiner handled everything and we made it back to the airport without much problem.

 

[Diesel]

No golden whatever there, either. And no, I didn't declare an emergency. Didn't even know what had happened (only that something had) until I looked at it on the ground, and didn't realize the real damage until I returned the next day. There was no emergency to "declare."

First of all that's a great postflight.

I'm not comparing a some thump in the night. I'm comparing a goose through the engine which shut it down.

 

[Clyde]

I was just wondering from some more experienced pilots--what are some real-life situations where you would declare an emergency. Loss of engine when in a twin. How about vacuum system failure in IMC? Thanks for the imput.

In a nutshell, anytime you feel the safety of the flight is in question and your flight needs priority.

A few years ago I declared an emergency after losing (not flaming out) an engine on a Falcon 20 during a climb during the day. Declared an emergency for two reasons: 1: I had no idea what caused it and knew I had to divert, and 2: I would be unable to comply with ATC instructions and thus risk an FAR violation.

Remember, declaring an emergency allows you to deviate to the extent required to meet the emergency, and thus may help prevent some type of certificate action by the FAA.

 

[dash8driver]

true.. declaring doesnt give you carte blanche.. but let me break it down.

declaring: lets you deviate to the extent required to land safely

not-declaring: does not let you deviate from the FARs

end result.. while you can still be violated for something after you declare.. that not a valid argument for not declaring because what ever got you violated after you declared, would also get you violated if you didnt declare.

declare if you feel the safety of flight is compromised or if you think the monday morning qb's will think it was. delcare if you need special assistance or priority handling. declare if its one of the items your ops manual says you must declare for.

bottom line... be safe.

 

[avbug]

First of all that's a great postflight.

Yes, it was a great postflight. The radome was intact, but smashed. Delaminated throughout, it was ruined. At night, it was very difficult to detect. During a thorough daylight inspection, which I helped conduct in the morning, the damage was evident. I grounded the airplane that night, pending further inspection, and the inspection was conducted in daylight. The postflight inspection was VERY thorough.

As one who has made a living for many years working on and inspecting airframes, appliances, engines, propellers, etc, I can assure you, it was very thorough. But thanks for your concern.

declaring: lets you deviate to the extent required to land safely

not-declaring: does not let you deviate from the FARs

You sure about that, Dash8Driver? Sure?

Wrongo!

But then that's been a large part of my point, all along. You have full authority to deviate from any regulation necessary to the extent necessary to meet the needs of an inflight emergency and to attend to the safety of the flight, period.

There is no requirement to declare anything to exercise that authority. There never has been. Ever. I very much doubt there ever will be. A wives tale of sorts exists to the contrary, as you have just demonstrated.

You can, and should, and are expected to do whatever is required to meet the nature of your emergency, period. End of story.

As always, and again, you're free to use the "e" word if it makes you feel better.

I'm not comparing a some thump in the night. I'm comparing a goose through the engine which shut it down.

Loud bang, shattered radome, shut down engine, whatever. Who cares? You did what you felt was appropriate given the circumstances, as did I. In other words, nothing more than our jobs. You do what you must. In 2000, I had five engine failures in four months...not one of which resulted in a condition that warranted declaring an emergency. The individual situations could have warranted it had the circumstances been different, but they didn't. No golden bullets or bb's, or frisbees, or whatever that melodramatic golden doohickey is that has apparently helped you see the light (whatever).

Had circumstances warranted making a formal declaration of some kind on the radio, and in several of those circumstances had there been someone around to hear it or who would have cared, certainly I would have considered it. As it was, there wasn't, and I didn't. More aptly, I made the right decision given the circumstances that prevailed at that moment in time.

What you might have done under those circumstances may be entirely different...but is also entirely irrelevant, as you were not there. I was.

Each person makes the appropriate decision in real time.

Back to the original point, however, again...a formal declaration of an emergency by a pilot is not necessary to receive priority, and never has been. Further, ATC may require a report where priority is given...even though you never "declared" anything. The controller may give you priority without your asking. You may declare an emergency. You may identify your condition and state your actions. A number of scenarios, almost infinite to be sure, may occur wherein priority is given. No matter how you slice it; priority is priority. You don't get any more priority when you "declare." You don't get any more anything...it's still just priority.

Further, you aren't insulated from enforcement action if you "declare." If you cause the "emergency," you're still liable, and a formal pronouncement that it's an "emergency" doesn't alleviate you of the responsibility, nor insulate you from the consequences of your action.

Conversely, simply because you fail to "declare" an emergency, you have a full legal right, and responsibility, to exercise your authority as Pilot in Command, to deal with that emergency. You aren't protected, and you aren't liable, based on the grounds of any formal pronouncement of the "e" word. It just 'taint so.

 

[dash8driver]

You sure about that, Dash8Driver? Sure?

hahahah.. ok there stud..

yea, declaring is not technically necessary. but if you dont understand the benefits of declaring then not even your studliness will help you.

as for that being a part of your point previously, i dont see it. i see your point being that you dont feel that pax, fires or engines are worth of the e-word. that you dont declare because you dont have to, not because its a good idea or not.

 

[JAFI]

There are two parts of this issue I would like to comment on.


1. You use the word "emergency" when you determine it is an emergency and to ask for assistance from ATC and any one on the same radio freq. ( you may be asked to write a letter to the ATC facility)

2. You do what you have to do to meet the emergency (FAR 91.3 and 125/135/121 equilivants). As other actions in life, you may be called to explain your actions to the proper authority.

Always err to the safety side.

My 2 cents.

JAFI