DALPA Conflict of Interest

[FBN0223]

I do not see how 20 years from now trumps the "here and now." He should get no less than status quo.

Yeah let's forget the future and ALL of our career expectations and just live in the here and now.

 

[MCDU]

FBN0223. I am with you man. You and me and many others. We know where you are coming from. Delta and AWA should have merged.

Peace

M

 

[PeanuckleCRJ]

Funny, I did not know NWA was the only airline that practiced such nonsense. How do you do seniority at Delta? Last four of your SS# perhaps?

MCDU is a USair crybaby.

 

[PuffDriver]

There's our problem. In your mind, the solution revolves solely around you and keeping some sort of your fictional seniority contrived by unreasonable ideas. I understand how you don't want to be shoved in DC-9 or be a junior widebody FO but to make all of the planets align and your seniority dreams come true, you are willing to completely throw another group under the bus. Newsflash: It's not all about you.

Things for you to consider:
1) It's not just where you are NOW, but where you will be in on the seniority list in five, ten, or twenty years from now. In my case, I would be retiring in the top 4% of NWA pilots. I would be willing to sacrifice a few percentage points, but when you drop 1500 Delta guys in front of me who are junior, I'd be lucky to retire in the top 20%.
You, Sir, talk about career expectations. Mine were to retire a B747-400 Captain not a B767ER FO.

2) Hitting a home run on the SLI for either group is disastrous. Want to see a "happy" place go to a not so "happy" place. DALPA's proposal would accomplish that quite well.

3) We are retiring more pilots than you. Once again you get to move up the list on retirements that should have been solely ours. And once again you're welcome.

Strictly DOH may not be the best. I'll sacrifice 100 numbers or so, sort of throwing you guys a bone, but not 1500.

good luck

There is no fiction involved here. It is indeed reality.

1) If you are talking about timeframes of 20 years, then your career expectation is NOT retiring as a 747-400 captain. Drama, while dramatic, does not really serve useful discussion rationale and will be met with a whaaa, whhaaa. Whatever career expectation you had, it changed the day that the merger was announced. Nonetheless, the mediators will attempt to cushion that blow.

2) I actually believe that both groups hit a home run. We managed to find a way through a merger during THE single most tumultuous time in airline history. We WILL see airlines go out of business next year if not this year. One or more of them will be a legacy carrier. Many will be national airlines. We can place bets on these another time, but each pilot group have given themselves the best chance for survival via this merger.

As far as the seniority list goes, "home run" will be in the eye of the beholder. I have a feeling that nothing would considered a home run in the eyes of NWA pilots. Believe it or not, I can see the argument for DOH with the appropriate protections for Delta pilots. The likelihood of the arbitrators accepting DOH, even with protections, is nil IMO. The list will look similar to what the Delta pilots have proposed with probably some tweaking, if any. The real question is will NWA pilots accept the decision, or pull a coupe to burn the place down despite their face?

3) You retirements peak soon, ours later. You conveniently leave out that Delta pilots will be retiring as well. Surely you comprehend that you will be able to cash in on OUR retirements as well. When do we become 1 group for real, no crossies counted? My guess is sooner than later. Quite frankly, they nullify each other out over the course of the next few years, as the PAM model shows, and your extra compensation makes up for it.

My advice is brace yourself, you will probably sacrifice somewhere between 100 and 1500 numbers. If I were to guess, it will be in the neighborhood of 1300.

 

[Fly4hire]

The likelihood of the arbitrators accepting DOH, even with protections, is nil IMO. The list will look similar to what the Delta pilots have proposed with probably some tweaking, if any.

My advice is brace yourself, .

I suggest you might want to follow your own advice :bawling:

 

[FBN0223]

deleted

 

[FBN0223]

Never mind. We'll see in November.

 

[ACL65PILOT]

And with that the thread will die.

Fact is I agree with what he states. We are trying like h e double hockey sticks to get this merger done and finalized before one of our fellow majors goes T.U. All bets are off if we cannot.

So on to the next thing.
Are you guys ready to learn our convoluted way of flying airplanes?

 

[licorice]

There's our problem. In your mind, the solution revolves solely around you and keeping some sort of your fictional seniority contrived by unreasonable ideas.
Absolutely nothing fictional about it. Is it a contrived unreasonable idea that I can hold 767-400 capt. by STOVEPIPE, as a dec. 1985 hire? and am now a senior 767ER international capt.....is that fictional, my friend? Remarkably, I actually find myself in the cockpit of a 767-300ER each week, flying to Europe. Is it a dream? Is it a fiction that I have been doing this now for 3 years? Is it a pipe-dream that I could reasonably expect to continue to do so and might even advance further when Delta buys more 777s? Is it fictional that my equivalent date of hire at NW can only hold mid-seniority A-320 capt. via STOVEPIPE? Neither of those scenarios are fictional...they are reality,--cold, hard facts. As facts, they are indisputable, and therefor, neutral...those are, afterall, "just the facts"--they are my neutral expectations. Is it a neutral expectation on the part of your dec. 1985 hire to jump to a widebody international capt. position just because of a merger? No, I, and most reasonable people would consider that an unreasonable expectation....

 

[ACL65PILOT]

Well I might be wrong. Well isn't awesome.