DAL AE's, Junior Bases

[filejw]

I think you are wrong and will see many more pilots retire at 60. There is a substantial pension penalty to leave before 60, but not much financial advantage to stay past. Our frozen pension will help move our older pilots out the door.

Not as much as you think. Most senior NWA guys are Green Book and their DP is based on narrow body pay. Take my case, when I get to 60 in 2012 the pay on my eq will be 231$ with the international override. With minimal effort i can see making 220/240 per year on what is basically a part time job of 9 to 11 days a month . My DP retirement will be about 120$ per year. The penalty you speak of is minuscule and considering I wouldn't have had any employee contribution to my retirement for the last 6 years like say some friends in other profession I am thinking of staying...

 

[Noserider76]

Your pilot group is going to be displacing tons of DAL pilots out of our equipment and making us take huge pay cuts as a result, and you still complain. You all got a much bigger pay raise, better work rules, access to higher paying equipment, and on top of it all you get to keep your pension, with DAL funding it, and still not enough.

Hey Jet,

I sympathize with what you're saying but I don't believe it was the SLI or NW pilots that are to blame. I think it probably turned out as fairly as it could. There could have been some fences on bases and equipment but would that have been effective with the moves the company has planned?

The problem is the much different demographics, bases, and equipment at the two companies. The day this merger was announced the writing was on the wall that the NW guys would move to bigger equipment closer to home ASAP. I don't blame them. Things would have been different base and equipment-wise with a UA merger but would it have been painful in a different way? Probably.

For me it looks like an indefinite delay on upgrading on the 75 at this particular warm weather base. We now have to share the great deal we've had and just hope for a better long-term career. Either way it's out of our control and in our best interests to see the group come together. Hope it works out OK for you. Cheers.

 

[nonstop]

I usually don't post much but here it goes. I am on the bottom of the seniority list and was wondering how jr CVG is. It is my home so I would like to stop commuting to DTW. Yes bitter Dal guy(jetjockey) I will be getting a better lifestyle if I get CVG but in 10 years I was supposed to be halfway up the list now I will only be 1/4 of the way up. My % on the list 10 years will be hurt. I am not complaining I am dealing with it. If I can get CVG after SOC I would like it. I don't think that is screwing over any Delta pilots. So back to my point is there a chance to get CVG? I am down in the real low 12000s

Check out the NWA ALPA page, goto the merger link and look at the DAL and NWA proposed seniority lists. Those lists include base as well as position (well at least 1 of them did, not sure which I looked at DAL or NWA). You can cross reference the arbitrated list and see where guys junior to you fall. From what I saw there were junior guys in every base so I imagine you'll be able to hold it.

 

[Helos2Galaxy]

CVG is senior as it has shrunk a bit. I am a 24% from the bottom (both lists) and can barely hold 757/767

 

[Full of LUV]

Why don't you move?

I usually don't post much but here it goes. I am on the bottom of the seniority list and was wondering how jr CVG is. It is my home so I would like to stop commuting to DTW. Yes bitter Dal guy(jetjockey) I will be getting a better lifestyle if I get CVG but in 10 years I was supposed to be halfway up the list now I will only be 1/4 of the way up. My % on the list 10 years will be hurt. I am not complaining I am dealing with it. If I can get CVG after SOC I would like it. I don't think that is screwing over any Delta pilots. So back to my point is there a chance to get CVG? I am down in the real low 12000s

Why don't you just move to DTW, I've heard you can get a great deal on a house there right now!

 

[Who Dey]

Thanks for the input guys. I will check out the ALPA website. As far as moving how could I give up the Bengals for the Lions. The Bengals are far superior. 1 win and a tie vs 0 wins come on.

 

[maxblast72]

Thanks for the input guys. I will check out the ALPA website. As far as moving how could I give up the Bengals for the Lions. The Bengals are far superior. 1 win and a tie vs 0 wins come on.

Who Dey? We Dey. Sorry couldn't resist.

Go Steelers.

 

[regionalcap]

Look, we are at the point that whining and complaining is not going to do any good. The best thing that we can do is work together. The arbitrator has ruled. DONE. OVER. FINISHED. MOVE ON. We are one company now. Let's make it the best and we will all profit.

 

[cocknbull]

I usually don't post much but here it goes. I am on the bottom of the seniority list and was wondering how jr CVG is. It is my home so I would like to stop commuting to DTW. Yes bitter Dal guy(jetjockey) I will be getting a better lifestyle if I get CVG but in 10 years I was supposed to be halfway up the list now I will only be 1/4 of the way up. My % on the list 10 years will be hurt. I am not complaining I am dealing with it. If I can get CVG after SOC I would like it. I don't think that is screwing over any Delta pilots. So back to my point is there a chance to get CVG? I am down in the real low 12000s

With all of the displacements going on don't count on seniority being of any value in regards to backfill into open psoitions in CVG. For some reason the union allows people being displaced priority for seats created by movement rather than senior pilots.

 

[DAL737FO]

With all of the displacements going on don't count on seniority being of any value in regards to backfill into open psoitions in CVG. For some reason the union allows people being displaced priority for seats created by movement rather than senior pilots.[/quote]

This is a false statement. Just like when the company opened the CVG ER base the AE is run first followed by the displacement bid. If the person on the displacement bid is senior to someone that got the bid via the AE then they bump them out. Seniority is still king. The problem comes from a bid that is mostly displacements. Then the displaced pilot can bump someone out of category if they are senior enough to bump that person. Now if there was no AE for that slot you don't get looked at if you had an AE bid preference in for the same category if you are not being displaced. I know this is clear as mud but I can give an example if you still don't understand.

With the amount of aircraft movement the company is talking about in the near future, everyone better have their displacement bids up to date.

 

[Going2Baja]

Sorry not to know the lingo - But what is an "AE" and how is it used? Also - With no fences, when will a new bid come out for a system wide bid? Or will it?

Baja.

 

[ACL65PILOT]

My guess is that if the company knows when the SOC will be handed down, the next AE or the one after that could be for both sides.

 

[Helos2Galaxy]

AE stands for Advance Entitlement. It is a bid and can include forward (vacancies) or rearward movement (displacements).

You can call it a "system" bid if you wish but that's not really what it is. It's to fill vacancies or move people back in surplusses.

Pertaining to the second question, prior to SOC or single certificate which is when NWA no longer exists even as the Delta subsidary it is now, any displacements/vacancies will be kept on respective fence sides. After the SOC which is scheduled for late Fall 2009, and NWA or DAL bubba can bid to the other side, based upon needs of Delta, with the exception of 747-400s (NWA) and Delta (777s). One cannot cross the fence on/off those jets for 5 years from SOC.

I am not sure whether those big jet fences apply to Captains only or both CA's and F/Os.

 

[michael707767]

The problem is the much different demographics, bases, and equipment at the two companies. The day this merger was announced the writing was on the wall that the NW guys would move to bigger equipment closer to home ASAP. I don't blame them.

Yeah, while the NWA lawyers were arguing about their Super Premium Widebodies, we should have been arguing about our Super Premium Bases.

It's ironic. I think Delta pilots in the middle of the list would have been better off with the NWA proposal......DOH with 10 year fences.

 

[nwaredtail]

Yeah, while the NWA lawyers were arguing about their Super Premium Widebodies, we should have been arguing about our Super Premium Bases.

It's ironic. I think Delta pilots in the middle of the list would have been better off with the NWA proposal......DOH with 10 year fences.

DAL pilots would have been better off with either proposal vs. original DAL, I guess I was talking to myself.

And you are correct. There are hundreds of DAL pilots that would have done better with NWA's DOH list.