Curious

[PGIRL]

And as far as the company proposal.... even with the bennies, the pay is STILL too low. FAR too low. So it's a big fat NO!!!


Just curious, you guys are really concerned about your pay and benefits, but have you ever stopped to think about anyone else in the company besides yourselves? I'm looking for an honest answer, not trying to start something.
Some people in the Casino make considerably less than all of you and you don't see them staging a revolt to bring down the company just because of pay and benefits. I'm not saying every single person, but you have some really skilled people here and it's shamful what they are paid. Yes, everybody knows that you all are underpaid and overworked, but have you ever considered that the rest of them are as well? That is why people from the Casino have gotten mad enough to start posting here. It's quite upsetting to them, and they would like to take your side, believe me, but quite frankly you guys have done a really good job of alienating the majority of the flight center by some of your actions. I saw a post recently where one pilot complained that he had to do it all, owner services, travel, etc. Well you know what? Do you have any kind of understanding how undermanned each department is or how high turnover is?
No one can keep up. It seems like the amount of flights have trippled and the amount of people in each department has decreased at the same rate or stayed the same. It's a do more with less kind of atmosphere. Most people try really hard, but it's increasingly difficult to keep up. Yes it's frustrating and everyone fully understands that, but some of your attitudes towards people on the other end of the phone line are something no employee should have to put up with. So before you hurl accusations and make presumptions based on your experiences and the owners, consider what is happening to people in the flight center as well and not just to yourselves. And try to show some common courtesy, huh? Everybody's in the same boat, but not everybody has a union to back them up, ok.

 

[Jim]

PMS ?????

 

[PGIRL]

PMS ?????

What a way to treat a fellow veteran, thanks man!

 

[Diesel]

PGirl- How about you become a pilot and then tell us what you think.

We are not in the same boat. We are pilots who run this company. I don't care how many years you have upstairs. Myself and my other pilots are the one's who are on the road day in and day out.

If people make less than us in the casino then that's too bad. It's Netjets Aviation not Netjets Casino. We fly the planes. Accept the fact. We all know who the people are on here that post but because i respect those in the ultra fleet i won't post it here.

Move on and don't try to push us because I will post your name and 4 digit extension number on this website.

 

[Sun Tzu]

PGirl, the majority of the pilots appreciate the casino folks and have no problem with them. This is not a fight with the non-bargaining employees. You say you are understaffed and overworked? Who's fault is that, the pilots or management. You say you are underpaid, who's fault is that, the pilots or management?

I know for a fact that owner services people start at 27k give or take some change. 2 weeks of training and some OJT is all it takes to get the position started. I'm sure it's a constant learning process until they quit or transfer out with a 50+% turnover rate. I'm sure FM's and DX's are under the same pressure.

Now let's look at a new hire pilots min requirements.

• Airline Transport Pilot Certificate
• Current FAA First Class Medical certificate
• 2500 hours total pilot time
• 500 hours fixed wing multi-engine time
• 250 hours instrument time

2 weeks of indoc, 3 weeks or more of initial type training, ground training, 1st ride, then IOE. Once you complete that you get to spend 200+ nights a year on the road away from your family. Yes, we chose the job and most of us enjoy what we do.

Do you really think you can compare what we do to what the casino staff does. I'm not belittling the job you do, just showing the differences. You will never hear me or most of the other pilots calling the casino staff names or being disrespectful. I have always been polite and friendly on the phone and in person when ever I interact with an FM or DX or ACP/CP.

 

[Some Dude]

Easy fix. If you want a raise then ask for one. If you don't get it then sorry buy that's the way it is. The company wants the best pilots in the world then they should pay us. Also, why are the pilots always rated the highest for customer satisfaction over any other department? I have many friends in the casino and I do feel sorry for them. They work hard and don't get the respect or the pay they deserve. It's the management that stinks. I have been here a long time and I've seen some great people in the casino not get what they deserve. I hope things get better for all of us.

 

[JEEPPLR]

PGirl, the majority of the pilots appreciate the casino folks and have no problem with them. This is not a fight with the non-bargaining employees. You say you are understaffed and overworked? Who's fault is that, the pilots or management. You say you are underpaid, who's fault is that, the pilots or management?

I know for a fact that owner services people start at 27k give or take some change. 2 weeks of training and some OJT is all it takes to get the position started. I'm sure it's a constant learning process until they quit or transfer out with a 50+% turnover rate. I'm sure FM's and DX's are under the same pressure.

Now let's look at a new hire pilots min requirements.

• Airline Transport Pilot Certificate
• Current FAA First Class Medical certificate
• 2500 hours total pilot time
• 500 hours fixed wing multi-engine time
• 250 hours instrument time

2 weeks of indoc, 3 weeks or more of initial type training, ground training, 1st ride, then IOE. Once you complete that you get to spend 200+ nights a year on the road away from your family. Yes, we chose the job and most of us enjoy what we do.

Do you really think you can compare what we do to what the casino staff does. I'm not belittling the job you do, just showing the differences. You will never hear me or most of the other pilots calling the casino staff names or being disrespectful. I have always been polite and friendly on the phone and in person when ever I interact with an FM or DX or ACP/CP.

There are a number of us up here that hold advanced degrees and are pilots as well. I have a 5 year degree in meteorology from OSU, I hold a private pilots license with about 300 hours when I lost my medical and I am a dispatcher. I have been involved in aviation for almost 30 years now. My dad brought home a new airplane in 1976 and I have done aviation stuff ever since. There are several other dispatchers and flight managers that have commercial licenses and some with jet time. It compares for some.

What I would like you to take from this post is no one up here has any control over the out come of the union contract talks. Please stop taking out your frustrations on us. The flight managers are only doing their jobs when they call you, filing a union grievance against them only galvanizes opinion against you up here. Please also remember, it only takes one pilot to be an ass to ruin it for everyone. I know the same works for us up here, I for one treat you with the same respect you give me. No one has any right to belittle others the way some have been doing. Just because we don’t fly the planes does not make us less of a person. The people up here fear for our jobs, how we are going to pay the house payment, how to get health insurance if we are laid off, the same thing you are. Don’t think you are better than we are just because we work in the casino.

 

[PGIRL]

Question for ya Sun Tzu.
I noticed your acft experience on the 135's.
Were you at Grand Forks, MacDill, McConnell, Fairchild, Mildenhall or Kadena?

 

[FamilyGuy]

Move on and don't try to push us because I will post your name and 4 digit extension number on this website.

Real classy threat there Diesel. Is that officially sanctioned by the union?

 

[Diesel]

Nope it's santioned by me. Why should you and she be able to post crap in full anomity.

What goes around comes around.

 

[HiSpeedFlyer]

The sad thing is, the casino people who have posted here have taken it personally, and no feel threatened by us, and it all has snowballed into something that is enveoping us all at NetJets. Again, the short time I have been here, you folks have been doing a fine job. But, flaming the pilot group is going to get a flurry of responses, 'cause its high tension time here.


Sit back, take a deep breath, and think for a minute.

This is our fight, and its now getting to the point of being nasty. However, as much as some of you want everyone to believe.. We havent picked a fight with the employees of our company! 4 years is a long time to be without a contract, and it is waaaaaayyy overdue. Its like a squad of marines recieves small arms fire, and them calls in a fire mission from a artillery battery. Overwhelming firepower to swat the fly buzzing around our heads. That is the way I see our reactions to your posts. So, I see several options for you folks,

Keep doing your job and stop instigating us here.

join the fight and help us discreetly by understanding us.

Listen to the disinformation being spewed forth at the home office and join there side of view, and keep annoying us here.

Its simple..... Choose #1 or #2, and the company (who is watching) sees support for us go up, and adds pressure to them.
Choose #3, the fight is prolonged with increased morale to management from your support, and our lives get nastier.

Thats how I see it, and I always tell it how it is.

AS FOR THE PILOTS HERE....

Dont give them ammunition... like I have stated berfore...




HSF.. pissin' the pretty people off 8 at a time !!!!!!!!

 

[FAcFriend]

Everybody's in the same boat, but not everybody has a union to back them up, ok. -Pgirl


Form a union for the flight center. It can be done. I think the local IBT will help you.

 

[Sun Tzu]

Jeepplr, I have never taken any frustrations out on the casino folks. Reread my post to Pgirl again. I was only pointing out differences, and answering her post about pay issues. I am sure there are some very intelligent and qualified(if not over qualified) people working in CMH. The fact that you have 300 hours of flying time is great, and I'm sure you understand the job better than someone without any time. The fact is, if I had a DX cert it wouldnt make me any more qualified to do my job than you with flying time as a Dispatcher.

I believe my post was respectful to you and all the other "team" members in CMH. What I read from your post, was frustration and a bit of contempt towards the pilots for fighting for a fair wage for what we do. I have no idea what a Dispatcher or Flight Manager makes in CMH, but I hope it is a fair market wage if not higher for what you folks do. This company could once again be the "ELITE" experience they say it is. I really hope I can make Netjets my career for the next 10 or so years. It is all up to the people in management making the decisions whether Netjets can return to its once favored position of being an elite experience. Pilots, FA's, DX's, FM's can only do so much to fix a broken plan day in and day out before it falls apart. We have some incredible talent here and I would hate to see management not take advantage of it.

With all due respect!

 

[gern_blanston]

Easy fix. If you want a raise then ask for one. If you don't get it then sorry buy that's the way it is.

Is that aimed at casino employees or pilots?

 

[TurboJetCpt]

Is that aimed at casino employees or pilots?

That's the way it is WITHOUT a union. So guess who that's for...

 

[dsptchrnja]

Why should you and she be able to post crap in full anomity.

For the same reason you do. It is her right in a forum like this, same as you. If you violate that right there will be consequences to you - not her. You start naming names of people in the FC and I will personally see to it that the moderators of this forum take action on you. Remember what comes around goes around, right?

Are you really that threatened by a young girl's opinions? Or are you just trying to validate the union thug image?

 

[Hogprint]

Why Do You Need To Strike?

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Originally posted by PGirl

"Why do you guys need to strike? You break enough planes everyday just to p*ss people off here at NJ that you don't need to strike. I for one am sick of it. Just fly your freaking plane and shut up."

---------------------------------------------------------------------------
You post two or three flamers like this, but now you want to be taken seriously?

Come on y'all. Step up to the plate and add something worthwhile to the dialogue.

Pot shots from both camps only cheapen and debase what we all would like to see accomplished. A great work environ and a company we can be proud to tell people we work for.

 

[Diesel]

Go read the rules and get back to me. Nowhere it says you can't name names on flightinfo.

Union thug image? ummmm if that's what you think IBT 1108 is then I'm sorry you feel that way.

I've apologized to you for my remarks but now i see you think us pilots are just trying to bully the company with our thug image.

Whatever.

 

[dsptchrnja]

Nowhere it says you can't name names on flightinfo.

Really? No where? Did you look? Or did you just make up that assertion hoping no one else would look?

Guess you missed this part when you registered:

"- No personal information about others or members of the forums, except by Webmaster/Moderator exception, may be posted."

 

[Diesel]

actually your right i did make the assumption nobody would look.

Good catch