Could this be the ASA ATR's replacement's?

[sweptback]

Then would you please leave.....Some of us are happy to be here....We don't need people like you here....especially since you are an ALPA rep.....Go find someplace where you are happy.....

I never said that I wasn't happy. Personally, I'm having a blast.

However, I don't think any regional really qualifies as a place to be right now. The majors (our customers) have said that they want to dump RJs, and fast. Airlines that once were the "place to be" (RAH for one) have rapidly expiring contracts with mainline carriers and no place to put airplanes except for creative deals like with MEH. It's no secret that we're on the downward trend of the RJ demand curve.

So where is the place to be? Probably nowhere unless you're in the top half of a seniority list. That was my point.

 

[sweptback]

JA is smarter than you.....Short term deals that involve capital in this environment aren't a good idea.....

Except that our business model is based on providing aircraft that the majors don't want (although locked up in contracts through 2020 or so), and other than that, waiting for some of the other players to go out of business so we can pick up the pieces.

You know who else had that game plan? DAL and UAL. Didn't work out too well for either.

So, what happens when our contract with DAL expires? That's the million dollar question, not when are we getting 900s or what's replacing the ATR. We need to be thinking ahead.

 

[Speedtape]

Could there be a chance that Pinnacle will be replacing ASA's ATR's for DL with their new Q400's? I guess ASA will be run over yet again.

http://www.atwonline.com/news/story.html?storyID=14287

After the ATR's leave, I doubt you will see any more Turbo-props in ATL.

 

[Cpt Oveur]

After the ATR's leave, I doubt you will see any more Turbo-props in ATL.

Delta's business model for atlanta depends on connecting to many small markets for international feeds. If RJs are not the answer, then mainline carriers will add more fuel efficient props (to be flown by low wage carriers) or just cut out those markets. The more small markets that delta cuts, the more open seats you'll see flying on these int'l flights. Turboprops will remain in Atlanta, but no reason to assume its by ASA or any other current DCI carrier.

 

[crjskipper]

delta doesnt want tp's in atl. the 700s are backfilling some of the atr stuff. 200 flying is going back up as fuel goes back down. after the atrs are gone the bleedind stops. delta wants seemless service in atl and props arent that. pinsuckle has to use or lose the options and they are rolling the dice. skywest doesnt work that way. asa will continue to be a good place to be. after the merge is done, watch for pinsuckle 200s to start getting parked as mem pulls back. sw had the same offer as they did for the 900 2 for 1 shuffle. sw said no, pin said yes.

 

[enuffalready]

Then would you please leave.....Some of us are happy to be here....We don't need people like you here....especially since you are an ALPA rep.....Go find someplace where you are happy.....

Anyone that knows me, knows I have never had any intentions to go to a major. I came to ASA because I always planned in staying in atlanta and have other income. That being said, being hired in 2001, I'm stuck between any FO schedule( not really worth $3000 per month) or shot in the dark decent captain line( not much better but at 5k or 6k, but its at least its worth showing up. My post was just me lamenting the current growth of pinnacle, etc after all our seemingly neverending contract negotiations, and the and subsequent dramtic improvement in performance, that was proceded by hollow promises.

 

[Headfake14]

I still can't believe they are finally going. It's too bad.

I remember waaaay back...a Q400 came into ATL to show off to Delta. At the time, one of the big issues was parking. If I remember correctly, the ATR has (about) a 90' span...the Q is bigger I'm sure.

2ndly...the ATR has 5000 SHP total...whereas the Q400 has 5000 SHP per engine. Thats a lot of fuel to run to CSG or MGM. The Q400 could replace the CRJ on meduim routes like GNV, MYR, GPT, ROA...ect. It will probably be a noticable fuel difference there.

Regarding demand for RJs. They hayday for the 50seater is done. Hard to make money with Jet-A costing so much. Where a 70-90...100 seat jet burns a bit more...but less per pax seat.


...is there still 'good reading' in the last two stalls in the C lounge? haha

 

[Kingzrt]

Could there be a chance that Pinnacle will be replacing ASA's ATR's for DL with their new Q400's? I guess ASA will be run over yet again.

http://www.atwonline.com/news/story.html?storyID=14287

Lets put you ASA guys at ease, the first 15 400's are Continentals, Thats it. The next 15 are for whoever wants them as stated in the article. I have a bunch of friends at ASA and i can tell you all this is not about screwing anyone. Wherever they go, however bad the pay scales are we all need to survive in this economy unfortunately alot of guys and girls are out on the street flight instructing again or traffic watching, etc.
I am not happy with the current situation in the industry like many of us, however if we were different branches of the military in IRAQ Right now there would be alot of dead Americans while the enemy still runs around.
Point is why are we fighting with each other? This is not about us singularly we are all in this as a PILOT group.

 

[jonesy]

.....

 

[Speedtape]

Delta's business model for atlanta depends on connecting to many small markets for international feeds. If RJs are not the answer, then mainline carriers will add more fuel efficient props (to be flown by low wage carriers) or just cut out those markets. The more small markets that delta cuts, the more open seats you'll see flying on these int'l flights. Turboprops will remain in Atlanta, but no reason to assume its by ASA or any other current DCI carrier.

For argument's sake, based on your logic, how do you explain flying 757's and narrow-bodies from ATL to Savannah, Charleston, BHM, JAX, and many other cities that even a Bandit could reach?

 

[ohplease!]

For argument's sake, based on your logic, how do you explain flying 757's and narrow-bodies from ATL to Savannah, Charleston, BHM, JAX, and many other cities that even a Bandit could reach?

ummm, because those cities can support that much lift?...maybe?.....duh.

 

[DoinTime]

sw had the same offer as they did for the 900 2 for 1 shuffle. sw said no, pin said yes.

PCL is not trading in 2 50-seaters for these FreedomAir -900s. In fact they start getting returned to Delta in less than 3 months. PCLs fleet projection 8 months from now is 124 -200s and 16 -900s.

Lets put you ASA guys at ease, the first 15 400's are Continentals, Thats it. The next 15 are for whoever wants them as stated in the article.

Just to clarify there has been no announcement of ANY additional commitments on Q-400s at Colgan. The ATW article says no such thing in any kind of conclusive way and it was just Trenary's way of getting everyone excited to distract you from your Union drive. Read the article carefully and you will see that it doesn't say anything. Continental is currently not interested in more Qs and nobody else is for that matter either. The order books reflect that.

 

[Cpt Oveur]

For argument's sake, based on your logic, how do you explain flying 757's and narrow-bodies from ATL to Savannah, Charleston, BHM, JAX, and many other cities that even a Bandit could reach?

I said small markets, I did not comment on their proximity to Atlanta. The metropolitan area of SAV has over 300,000 residents, Greater Jacksonville has a population of abuot 1.3 million, Birmingham: over 1 million, and Charleston: over 600,000. These numbers are not for city limits, but metropolitan areas.

Yes, a bandit or even a cessna 182 could fly to any of these cities, but even you would concede that there are other large cities that are somewhat close to Altanta. What about Dothan or Macon, they're close by? Still, look farther away, LEX, TUL, BTR, TYS, ORF, or MYR. All these are close to other hubs than they are atlanta, and most of these see all or a majority of regional service vs mainline.

 

[777forever]

I don't understand why many feel ASA is being left out of all the "GROWTH".

What growth have we missed on? 7 900s? Whoo, now that's alot of growth! Pinnacle can have the planes.

We just need to sit back and wait because nothing new is going to happen until the merger is complete.

And as far as ASA not being the place to be, I don't know about you, but in this economic environment I am extremely happy to be at a company that has over a billion in the bank, a long history of treating their employees well, and has a new President that has raised an airline WELL above expectations.

Over and out....

 

[SilverandSore]

And as far as ASA not being the place to be, I don't know about you, but in this economic environment I am extremely happy to be at a company that has over a billion in the bank, a long history of treating their employees well, and has a new President that has raised an airline WELL above expectations.

Over and out....

Oh for F's sake, there you go, spewing logic again. Come on man, these guys won't be happy unless they're not flying and picking up paychecks twice a month, which, coincidentally, is exactly what I'm doing this month...

 

[JumpersAway]

ASA not the place to be? Then where IS the place to be?

Incidently, I talked to one of the several former ASA FO newhires that left us soon after training for Pinnicle. Remember when they were offering a signing bonus, quick upgrade, and recruiting right out of the parking lot of Flight Safety? He has yet to get his bonus, his upgrade ain't lookin' so good, and his second year pay is much lower than what he would be making at ASA. Ooops.......

 

[McNugent]

Incidently, I talked to one of the several former ASA FO newhires that left us soon after training for Pinnicle. Remember when they were offering a signing bonus, quick upgrade, and recruiting right out of the parking lot of Flight Safety? He has yet to get his bonus, his upgrade ain't lookin' so good, and his second year pay is much lower than what he would be making at ASA. Ooops.......

But he gets to fly a big CRJ 900!!! I hear those things have 2 FMS's

 

[777forever]

But he gets to fly a big CRJ 900!!! I hear those things have 2 FMS's

IF he's senior enough to bid it. They only have like 9 of those things flying around. Chances are he's flying around the 200s for 21 bucks and hr. At least he gets to look forward to $24 next year

 

[USCtrojan]

I don't understand why many feel ASA is being left out of all the "GROWTH".

What growth have we missed on? 7 900s? Whoo, now that's alot of growth! Pinnacle can have the planes.

We just need to sit back and wait because nothing new is going to happen until the merger is complete.

And as far as ASA not being the place to be, I don't know about you, but in this economic environment I am extremely happy to be at a company that has over a billion in the bank, a long history of treating their employees well, and has a new President that has raised an airline WELL above expectations.

Over and out....

Great post 777. I couldn't agree more. I wish some of the blowhards, wouldn't blow so hard. It's getting annoying, as the economic environment isn't so hot right now. It will come back. I believe we are bottoming right now. Hopefully next year we see some mild growth with 2010 being a great year!

Trojan

 

[TOOL CRIB]

IF he's senior enough to bid it. They only have like 9 of those things flying around. Chances are he's flying around the 200s for 21 bucks and hr. At least he gets to look forward to $24 next year

Those are "senior" PCL pilots making all those horrible landings in ATL?? Sheesh!