Continental pilots win case over small-jet flights

[inflightboi175]

DALLAS (AP) — In a victory for Continental Airlines pilots, an arbitrator ruled that the airline can't put its name on United Express flights operated from Continental's hub airports.

The pilots' union argued that its contract with the airline required that Continental pilots fly 70-seat planes carrying the airline's name.

Arbitrator Richard Bloch agreed with the union in a ruling issued Thursday.

Parent United Continental Holdings Inc., which also operates United Airlines, planned to add Continental's name or "code" to several dozen United Express flights from hubs in Houston, Newark, N.J., and Cleveland.

The union said its contract requires that planes with more than 50 seats be flown by Continental pilots, not pilots of regional carriers under contract to Continental. To pilots, that's seen as a job-protection measure.

But United, which has a separate contract with its pilots, is permitted to shift such flights to regional affiliates. Parent United Continental wanted to put Continental's code on some of those flights.

Continental spokeswoman Julie King said the company would comply with the ruling. She said some of the United Express flights could still be shifted to meet demand at Continental hubs. But the company won't be able to advertise them as Continental flights.

Meanwhile, the company and two pilots' groups are seeking a federal mediator's help in negotiating a single labor contract for United and Continental. The airlines combined as one company in October but must fly as separate airlines until federal officials let them merge fleets and operations, which is expected in late 2011.

Shares of Chicago-based United Continental fell 22 cents in after-hours trading Friday to $24.04.

http://www.abc24.com/business/story...small-jet-flights/KflzUBie-U-0M6AwORtM2g.cspx

 

[densoo]

"DALLAS (AP) — In a victory for Continental Airlines pilots,"....

That's all most people will read, and that alone was worth the fight. It will appear in hundreds of newspapers across the country.

-- It negates some small amount of advertising dollars where they try to paint the company in a positive light.

--It gets the board of directors' attention for the CEO ("I thought you said labor wasn't going to be a problem?").

-- It doesn't allow them to expand RJ flying beyond UAL's current limit nor code the flights as CO, costing them some revenue (it must, otherwise they wouldn't have fought over it).

Put together, it will incrementally improve the pilots' negotiating position. It may be a small increment, but it is something at least. More battles and more wins like this will result in a much better contract.

 

[Flopgut]

+1

It turns the tide....

 

[shmenter]

Congrats to the Continental guys. Even though Im a Skywest guy, it is sure good to see the flying stay where it belongs.

 

[BornAgainPagan]

So what? So the new United will just change the name and not use "Continental" on regional flights......which is what they were planning on anyway. It sucks, but business as usual.

 

[StopNTSing]

Well done guys! It's gonna cost all the legacy pilots some major bargaining capital to put the RJ genie back in his bottle of Scope, but hang tough on this one. Our collective futures are all riding on it. :smash:

 

[boxjockey]

Well done guys and gals!! This is a more important fight than some understand, and is another step in the right direction for a GOOD contract. Kudos!!

box

 

[contrail67]

So what? So the new United will just change the name and not use "Continental" on regional flights......which is what they were planning on anyway. It sucks, but business as usual.

They would have done that in the first place if it were that easy...

 

[bluefin]

So what? So the new United will just change the name and not use "Continental" on regional flights......which is what they were planning on anyway. It sucks, but business as usual.

Not so easy, UAL express is just about maxed out on allowable outsourced flying per UAL contract. They will not effectively be able to expand with out cutting service somewhere. So this is big, may not stop management, but it changes their plans!

 

[Snaab]

Awesome! Glad something tilted in favor of the CAL pilots contract, and that the judge saw this.

 

[Flybywire44]

Continental will have to get 70 seats! Just make sure your pilots fly them. Don't let ASA, Skywest or Mesa do your flying. Let the next generation start building seniority sooner!

 

[scoreboardII]

Finally, one good bit of news.

 

[densoo]

Continental will have to get 70 seats! Just make sure your pilots fly them.

Exactly. Funny how easy it would be for them to fly as many 70-seaters as they wanted--with mainline pilots. But they don't even want to talk about that. It's got to be outsourced, like it is some kind of Ivy League MBA mantra. A shame.

 

[Kugelblitz]

Exactly. Funny how easy it would be for them to fly as many 70-seaters as they wanted--with mainline pilots. But they don't even want to talk about that. It's got to be outsourced, like it is some kind of Ivy League MBA mantra. A shame.

Totally agree with that sentiment. Ivy League MBA's don't do anything for good business sense reasons as they say, they just do it to subvert others beneath them. We could have had this situation resolved long before it came to this, the problem is Mr. Smisek doesn't believe anyone has the right to tell one with an Ivy League MBA no.

 

[Hamfighter]

Pay and scope.

 

[ArcticFlier]

So what? So the new United will just change the name and not use "Continental" on regional flights......which is what they were planning on anyway. It sucks, but business as usual.

Sounds like that is exactly what is going to happen, unless CALPA can put a (temporary) stop to it until something more permanent will come down the 'pike.

AF

 

[Skaff]

Don't shoot the messanger... This is from Skywest's home page.


IAH Flying Update Jan. 3, 2011
IAH Flying Update 1.3.2011
As you’re aware, an arbitrator’s Dec. 30 ruling placed certain marketing restrictions on the IAH flying we will begin for United this week. Our IAH United Express operation will begin as planned tomorrow, Jan. 4, operating under the UA code and utilizing the CO SHARES program to accommodate customers in compliance with the ruling.

FAQ’s
How will this affect SkyWest?
The ruling affects the marketing of SkyWest-operated IAH flights. Most SkyWest-operated United Express flights with the CO code to and from IAH for Jan. 4 start-up will now be identified and sold solely as United flights.

What will happen with our IAH flights on January 4th?
These flights will continue as scheduled. However, during a transitional period, they will operate in SHARES (CO reservation system) as United flights. Since it is in SHARES, ground and gate handling can continue to be provided by Continental employees or a third-party ground handler.

What is SHARES?
SHARES is the CO reservation system, which will allow CO gate employees to accommodate customers on our United Express flights in IAH.

Will customers know about the change?
United is reaching out to all customers for whom they have email addresses. However, boarding passes for customers may print with the CO flight number. As a result, we expect that for a transitional period the former Continental flight number and the new United flight number will alternate for these flights on airport information screens.

Will our onboard announcements or service change?
No. Flight attendants and flight crewmembers will utilize the current script and procedures outlined in the latest TR in your manuals.

Is the IAH flight information available in both SHARES and Apollo?
Yes, as was initially planned. Following a transitional period, the flights will be hosted in United’s Apollo system. United will be providing Apollo training and IT support in advance of the change.

What changes will there be for the IAH gates operating these flights?
First, United is ensuring these flights are identified as United at departure and arrival gates using United signage. Second, stations will continue to facilitate customer check-in. Starting immediately, these flights are no longer being sold as Continental flights and will be available as United flights. However, customers will continue to check in with CO. Thus, CO agents and online check-in applications will use the underlying CO flight number for check-in customers. All customers on these flights are subject to Continental’s policies for a transitional period.

Do these steps comply with the arbitrator’s ruling?
Yes. We continue working closely with United as they complete the UA/CO integration and merge, and we will continue to ensure our crewmembers remain in a solid situation that does not compromise you as industry professionals.

How can we expect the latest information and updates regarding the IAH flying?
We will continue to keep you informed of the most current information via SkyWest Online.

 

[densoo]

Nice article. A bit over the top perhaps, but reality doesn't matter, the perception of it does. These types of analyses popping up everywhere make the public think management has lost control and make the BOD and shareholders nervous. The impact on its publicity machine and investment effort may be small, but it will be noticeable. Too bad that they chose to go this route. It didn't have to be this way.

Here are outtakes from the article:

-- "the pilots gained some additional leverage"
-- "force the airline to deal directly with the pilots"
-- "new United management thought it could be clever"
-- "apparently thought that it could just go around the rules"
-- "that door has been shut"
-- "arbitrator did not mince words: ordered to cease and desist"
-- "company now has to scramble to undo the schedule"
-- "that hurts their viability tremendously"
-- "United is going to have to negotiate the right to outsource"
-- "done nothing but damage the relationship with the pilots"
-- "United gambled and lost"
-- "the pilots are now emboldened by the arbitration ruling"
-- "it’s going to be a tough road, to say the least"

Continental-United Merger: How the Airline Emboldened Its Pilots

Integration of the newly merged Continental and United (UAL) is well underway, but pilot integration is just getting started. This past week, the pilots gained some additional leverage thanks to an arbitrator’s decision that Continental had violated the pilots’ contract with some recent scheduling moves. That’s going to force the airline to deal directly with the pilots instead of going around them on the all-important issue of outsourcing.

In this merger, both pilot groups are represented by the Air Line Pilots Association (ALPA), but the individual groups have very different work rules. From the company’s perspective, the biggest issue involves the use of outsourced pilots to fly particular routes. The pre-merger United pilots had a very liberal rule on that, and management took full advantage by contracting out an army of sub-70 seat airplanes to fly routes that United pilots used to fly. On the Continental side, the pilots have strict rules that don’t allow any jets with more than 50 seats to be outsourced. That 70-seat category has become the battleground.

The new United management started moving airplanes around and thought it could be clever by flying airplanes outsourced by United in and out of Continental hubs. Since it flew them as United and not Continental, the airline argued that it was within its rights. But the fact that the flights were sold as both United and Continental flights had the pilots crying foul.
The case went to arbitration and the pilots came out victorious. The arbitrator did not mince words:

Placing the [Continental] designator code on the [United Express] jet aircraft with a certification of fifty-one or greater seats to and from [Continental hubs] is a violation of Section 1 of the Continental/ALPA collective bargaining agreement. The Company is ordered to cease and desist advertising and placing the [Continental] code on such flights.

The company now has to scramble to undo the schedule that it has built using those airplanes and it has to go back to the table to work more closely with the pilots. It apparently thought that it could just go around the rules that were negotiated with the Continental pilots, but that door has been shut.

The company can still technically fly the flights under the United name, but it can’t sell them as Continental, and that hurts their viability tremendously. So now, United is going to have to negotiate the right to outsource airplanes with the Continental pilots.

You would think that the spirit of the rules would have been enough for the new United management. Even if United had found a loophole that would have technically allowed it to fly the flights, that effort has done nothing but damage the relationship with the pilots during a time when you would think the airline would want to build the relationship up.

So United gambled and lost, damaging its relationship with the pilots. At the same time, the pilots are now emboldened by the arbitration ruling. Management is going to have to accept this loss and now work to mend fences if it hopes to develop any kind of good working relationship. If not, it’s going to be a tough road, to say the least, toward outsourcing 70 seat airplanes.

http://www.bnet.com/blog/airline-bu...er-how-the-airline-emboldened-its-pilots/3125

 

[Super Monkey]

Don't shoot the messanger... This is from Skywest's home page.


IAH Flying Update Jan. 3, 2011
IAH Flying Update 1.3.2011
As you’re aware, an arbitrator’s Dec. 30 ruling placed certain marketing restrictions on the IAH flying we will begin for United this week. Our IAH United Express operation will begin as planned tomorrow, Jan. 4, operating under the UA code and utilizing the CO SHARES program to accommodate customers in compliance with the ruling.

FAQ’s
How will this affect SkyWest?
The ruling affects the marketing of SkyWest-operated IAH flights. Most SkyWest-operated United Express flights with the CO code to and from IAH for Jan. 4 start-up will now be identified and sold solely as United flights.

What will happen with our IAH flights on January 4th?
These flights will continue as scheduled. However, during a transitional period, they will operate in SHARES (CO reservation system) as United flights. Since it is in SHARES, ground and gate handling can continue to be provided by Continental employees or a third-party ground handler.

What is SHARES?
SHARES is the CO reservation system, which will allow CO gate employees to accommodate customers on our United Express flights in IAH.

Will customers know about the change?
United is reaching out to all customers for whom they have email addresses. However, boarding passes for customers may print with the CO flight number. As a result, we expect that for a transitional period the former Continental flight number and the new United flight number will alternate for these flights on airport information screens.

Will our onboard announcements or service change?
No. Flight attendants and flight crewmembers will utilize the current script and procedures outlined in the latest TR in your manuals.

Is the IAH flight information available in both SHARES and Apollo?
Yes, as was initially planned. Following a transitional period, the flights will be hosted in United’s Apollo system. United will be providing Apollo training and IT support in advance of the change.

What changes will there be for the IAH gates operating these flights?
First, United is ensuring these flights are identified as United at departure and arrival gates using United signage. Second, stations will continue to facilitate customer check-in. Starting immediately, these flights are no longer being sold as Continental flights and will be available as United flights. However, customers will continue to check in with CO. Thus, CO agents and online check-in applications will use the underlying CO flight number for check-in customers. All customers on these flights are subject to Continental’s policies for a transitional period.

Do these steps comply with the arbitrator’s ruling?
Yes. We continue working closely with United as they complete the UA/CO integration and merge, and we will continue to ensure our crewmembers remain in a solid situation that does not compromise you as industry professionals.

How can we expect the latest information and updates regarding the IAH flying?
We will continue to keep you informed of the most current information via SkyWest Online.

I really miss working for SkyWest at times. Not necessarily for the pay, although I'm 4th year pay here at CAL and haven't even made what I made at SkyW at 5 year pay, but for their honesty and open communication.

On the other hand, the CAL pilots may have won the battle but not the war. Keep fighting brethren!!!

 

[whymeworry?]

I think management is sowing the seeds of a strike or legal job action down the road. This will only lean the NMB to release ALPA sooner than later. The pilots are unified on this, from young to old. And the UAL guys are 10x more militant after what they've been through over the past 10 yrs. They learned the hard way on outsourcing and they won't be fooled twice. They are going to be the real Achilles heal for the new management team, more so that the CAL pilots. But the CAL pilots are pretty pissed nonetheless.

What a waste of energy. Smisek is losing focus on the real enemy, the competition, and instead stirring the hornets nest with skilled labor. This guy is so disconnected from reality its almost breathtaking.

This is reckless mismanagement on the part of the exec team. You can't build a global business in today's world by always waring with your best employees.