Lampshade
Well-known member
- Joined
- Feb 3, 2002
- Posts
- 485
Welcome to Flightinfo.com
- Register now and join the discussion
- Friendliest aviation Ccmmunity on the web
- Modern site for PC's, Phones, Tablets - no 3rd party apps required
- Ask questions, help others, promote aviation
- Share the passion for aviation
- Invite everyone to Flightinfo.com and let's have fun
Congress to Hold News Conference to Announce Air Safety Improvement 2:30EST
- Thread starter Lampshade
- Start date
Welcome to Flightinfo.com
- Register now and join the discussion
- Modern secure site, no 3rd party apps required
- Invite your friends
- Share the passion of aviation
- Friendliest aviation community on the web
Nevets
Well-known member
- Joined
- Oct 22, 2007
- Posts
- 2,431
Highlights
Pilot training: ATP required 1500 hours min for hiring
Stall and upset recovery including stick pusher training
Pro standards - Pilot mentoring programs will be required
Electronic pilot record database will be required for record keeping it will go beyond the 5 years look back they have now
All Websites will be required to show which carrier will be operating the flight of the ticket you purchase
Requires the FAA to implement new rest rules. Also commissions the National Academy of Sciences to study commuting as it applies to fatigue
Pilot training: ATP required 1500 hours min for hiring
Stall and upset recovery including stick pusher training
Pro standards - Pilot mentoring programs will be required
Electronic pilot record database will be required for record keeping it will go beyond the 5 years look back they have now
All Websites will be required to show which carrier will be operating the flight of the ticket you purchase
Requires the FAA to implement new rest rules. Also commissions the National Academy of Sciences to study commuting as it applies to fatigue
Last edited:
Did you hear the comment by one of the Congressman where he had ALREADY received an e-mail from the ATA complaining about the ATP requirement? They hadn't even left the podium!
If anyone gets a linky to the new legislation, please post. I'm not entirely familiar with how to obtain it myself.
DieselDragRacer
Well-known member
- Joined
- Apr 30, 2006
- Posts
- 11,056
That doesn't require spending of tax payer money on new programs or the taxing of some required service so it was intentionally left out.
The last question of the conference "what kind of pushback do you anticipate from these changes?"
One of the three guys taking questions says the head guy in charge just received an email from the ATA who, big surprise, doesn't want this. The response from the guy answering the question basically said we are going to go ahead in a non partison way to do what is good for the safety of the flying public as if to say we dont care what the ATA has to say on this one "we dont want anymore Buffalo accident".
I'm sure this isn't the end of it but it does appear to have more push/momentum than previous attempts to get these things changed.
One of the three guys taking questions says the head guy in charge just received an email from the ATA who, big surprise, doesn't want this. The response from the guy answering the question basically said we are going to go ahead in a non partison way to do what is good for the safety of the flying public as if to say we dont care what the ATA has to say on this one "we dont want anymore Buffalo accident".
I'm sure this isn't the end of it but it does appear to have more push/momentum than previous attempts to get these things changed.
Last edited:
I thought they were going to take a serious look at 16 hr duty day and min rest! This is just crazy! Does anyone else agree that they missed the ball on this one?????
I think someone addressed this above. Not to mention you have two different groups going after the new safety rules. These guys and the FAA has already started their own meeting of the minds on proposed new rules as instructed by Babbit, the new FAA head. I think there is something like 12 meetings over the next month or so and proposals need to be on the desk by around Sep 1 if Im not mistaken.
Nevets
Well-known member
- Joined
- Oct 22, 2007
- Posts
- 2,431
I meant to say that it will require the FAA to implement new rest rules. The FAA has already begun the process anyways.
Nevets
Well-known member
- Joined
- Oct 22, 2007
- Posts
- 2,431
H.R. 3371 Summary
H.R. 3371, THE “AIRLINE SAFETY AND PILOT TRAINING IMPROVEMENT ACT OF 2009”
Pilot Training, Qualifications, Screening and Professional Development
Air Carrier Safety and Pilot Training Task Force
Establishes a Federal Aviation Administration (FAA) Task Force that will identify aviation industry best practices regarding: pilot training, pilot professional standards, and inter-carrier information sharing, mentoring and other safety-related practices.
The Task Force shall report to Congress every 180 days on air carrier progress implementing best practices, and make recommendations for legislative and regulatory action.
Implementation of National Transportation Safety Board (NTSB) Recommendations
Requires FAA to ensure that pilots are trained on stall recovery, upset recovery, and that airlines provide remedial training.
Mandates the FAA to convene a multidisciplinary panel on pilot training for stick pusher operations, and then take action to implement the recommendations of the panel.
Requires the Secretary of Transportation to provide an annual report to Congress on what the agency is doing to address each open NTSB recommendation pertaining to part 121 air carriers.
Pilot Qualifications, Screening, Mentoring & Professional Development:
Requires airline pilots to hold an FAA Airline Transport Pilot license (1,500 minimum flight hours required).
Establishes comprehensive pre-employment screening of prospective pilots including an assessment of a pilot’s skills, aptitudes, airmanship and suitability for functioning in the airline’s operational environment.
Requires airlines to: establish pilot mentoring programs whereby highly experienced pilots will mentor junior pilots; create Pilot Professional Development Committees; modify training programs to accommodate new-hire pilots with different levels and types of flight experience; and provide leadership and command training to pilots in command (including complying with the “sterile cockpit rule”).
Airline Training Hour Requirements
Studies the best methods and optimal time needed in airline training programs for pilots to master necessary aircraft systems, maneuvers, and procedures; the length of time between training events including recurrent training; and the best methods to reliably evaluate mastery of systems, maneuvers and procedures.
Pilot Records Database
Creates a Pilot Records Database, within 90 days, to provide airlines with fast, electronic access to a pilot’s comprehensive record.
Information included in the database will include pilot’s licenses, aircraft ratings, check rides, Notices of Disapproval and other flight proficiency tests.
FAA will maintain the database and airlines will be able to access the database for hiring purposes only.
Fatigue
Flight and Duty Time Rule: Directs the FAA to update and implement new pilot flight and duty time rules and fatigue risk management plans within one year to more adequately track scientific research in the field of fatigue.
Fatigue Risk Management Systems: Requires air carriers, within 90 days, to create fatigue risk management systems approved by FAA to proactively mitigate pilot fatigue.
Commuting Study: Studies the impact of pilot commuting on fatigue and provides preliminary results after four months to the FAA to be considered as part of the flight and duty time rulemaking.
Voluntary Safety Programs
ASAP and FOQA: Directs the FAA to develop and implement a plan to facilitate the establishment of an Aviation Safety Action Program (ASAP) and a Flight Operational Quality Assurance (FOQA) program by all commercial airlines and their unions.
Report: Requires FAA to report on ASAP, FOQA, Line Operations Safety Audit (LOSA), and Advanced Qualification Program (AQP), which will include: an analysis of which airlines are using the programs or if they are using something comparable that achieves similar safety goals; how FAA will expand the use of the programs; and how FAA is using data from the programs as safety analysis and oversight tools for aviation safety inspectors.
Flight Schools, Flight Education and Pilot Academic Training Study
Directs the Government Accountability Office to conduct a study of: current pilot academic training requirements compared to flight education provided by accredited two- and four-year universities and foreign academic requirements; FAA’s oversight of flight schools, and student loan options available to student pilots.
Other
FAA Safety Oversight by Inspectors: Requires the Department of Transportation Inspector General to study and report to Congress on if the number and experience level of safety inspectors assigned to regional airlines is commensurate with that of mainline airlines; and whether the various data sources that inspectors need to access to perform oversight of airlines can be streamlined into one data source.
Truth in Advertising: Mandates that at the first page of an Internet website that sells airline tickets to disclose to the purchaser of each ticket the air carrier that operates each segment of the flight.
Weather Event Training Panel: Requires the FAA to convene a multidisciplinary panel on pilot training for weather events including microburst, windshear and icing conditions.
H.R. 3371, THE “AIRLINE SAFETY AND PILOT TRAINING IMPROVEMENT ACT OF 2009”
Pilot Training, Qualifications, Screening and Professional Development
Air Carrier Safety and Pilot Training Task Force
Establishes a Federal Aviation Administration (FAA) Task Force that will identify aviation industry best practices regarding: pilot training, pilot professional standards, and inter-carrier information sharing, mentoring and other safety-related practices.
The Task Force shall report to Congress every 180 days on air carrier progress implementing best practices, and make recommendations for legislative and regulatory action.
Implementation of National Transportation Safety Board (NTSB) Recommendations
Requires FAA to ensure that pilots are trained on stall recovery, upset recovery, and that airlines provide remedial training.
Mandates the FAA to convene a multidisciplinary panel on pilot training for stick pusher operations, and then take action to implement the recommendations of the panel.
Requires the Secretary of Transportation to provide an annual report to Congress on what the agency is doing to address each open NTSB recommendation pertaining to part 121 air carriers.
Pilot Qualifications, Screening, Mentoring & Professional Development:
Requires airline pilots to hold an FAA Airline Transport Pilot license (1,500 minimum flight hours required).
Establishes comprehensive pre-employment screening of prospective pilots including an assessment of a pilot’s skills, aptitudes, airmanship and suitability for functioning in the airline’s operational environment.
Requires airlines to: establish pilot mentoring programs whereby highly experienced pilots will mentor junior pilots; create Pilot Professional Development Committees; modify training programs to accommodate new-hire pilots with different levels and types of flight experience; and provide leadership and command training to pilots in command (including complying with the “sterile cockpit rule”).
Airline Training Hour Requirements
Studies the best methods and optimal time needed in airline training programs for pilots to master necessary aircraft systems, maneuvers, and procedures; the length of time between training events including recurrent training; and the best methods to reliably evaluate mastery of systems, maneuvers and procedures.
Pilot Records Database
Creates a Pilot Records Database, within 90 days, to provide airlines with fast, electronic access to a pilot’s comprehensive record.
Information included in the database will include pilot’s licenses, aircraft ratings, check rides, Notices of Disapproval and other flight proficiency tests.
FAA will maintain the database and airlines will be able to access the database for hiring purposes only.
Fatigue
Flight and Duty Time Rule: Directs the FAA to update and implement new pilot flight and duty time rules and fatigue risk management plans within one year to more adequately track scientific research in the field of fatigue.
Fatigue Risk Management Systems: Requires air carriers, within 90 days, to create fatigue risk management systems approved by FAA to proactively mitigate pilot fatigue.
Commuting Study: Studies the impact of pilot commuting on fatigue and provides preliminary results after four months to the FAA to be considered as part of the flight and duty time rulemaking.
Voluntary Safety Programs
ASAP and FOQA: Directs the FAA to develop and implement a plan to facilitate the establishment of an Aviation Safety Action Program (ASAP) and a Flight Operational Quality Assurance (FOQA) program by all commercial airlines and their unions.
Report: Requires FAA to report on ASAP, FOQA, Line Operations Safety Audit (LOSA), and Advanced Qualification Program (AQP), which will include: an analysis of which airlines are using the programs or if they are using something comparable that achieves similar safety goals; how FAA will expand the use of the programs; and how FAA is using data from the programs as safety analysis and oversight tools for aviation safety inspectors.
Flight Schools, Flight Education and Pilot Academic Training Study
Directs the Government Accountability Office to conduct a study of: current pilot academic training requirements compared to flight education provided by accredited two- and four-year universities and foreign academic requirements; FAA’s oversight of flight schools, and student loan options available to student pilots.
Other
FAA Safety Oversight by Inspectors: Requires the Department of Transportation Inspector General to study and report to Congress on if the number and experience level of safety inspectors assigned to regional airlines is commensurate with that of mainline airlines; and whether the various data sources that inspectors need to access to perform oversight of airlines can be streamlined into one data source.
Truth in Advertising: Mandates that at the first page of an Internet website that sells airline tickets to disclose to the purchaser of each ticket the air carrier that operates each segment of the flight.
Weather Event Training Panel: Requires the FAA to convene a multidisciplinary panel on pilot training for weather events including microburst, windshear and icing conditions.
Last edited:
Thanks.........where did you get that? Did you get it off a government website or through personal contacts?
Nevets
Well-known member
- Joined
- Oct 22, 2007
- Posts
- 2,431
I got it from the House Subcommittee on Aviation website.
great, thanks.
Singlecoil
I don't reMember
- Joined
- Jul 26, 2002
- Posts
- 1,273
I like it. Sim rides for applicants. I thought it was stupid when airlines started doing away with that.
NavinRJohnson
Registered Gorer
- Joined
- Jul 7, 2004
- Posts
- 144
joevollers
rockingthenotsofreeworld
- Joined
- Dec 3, 2004
- Posts
- 205
DontFeedTheBear
Well-known member
- Joined
- May 14, 2003
- Posts
- 272
Lear70
JAFFO
- Joined
- Oct 17, 2003
- Posts
- 7,487
AirTran doesn't do a sim ride, either.
You can go to www.congress.gov or www.senate.gov and both sites will link you to the http://thomas.loc.gov site where you can search all legislation, including all the changes it went through during the process (adding riders, removing and changing language, etc). You can even search by keyword within the system which is a very cool feature for finding exactly what you need.
As far as I can tell, they're going to be pushing for the House vote on this by the beginning of September, sending it to the Senate, vote by the beginning of October, hopefully signed by the President by Halloween, if not Thanksgiving.
You can go to www.congress.gov or www.senate.gov and both sites will link you to the http://thomas.loc.gov site where you can search all legislation, including all the changes it went through during the process (adding riders, removing and changing language, etc). You can even search by keyword within the system which is a very cool feature for finding exactly what you need.
As far as I can tell, they're going to be pushing for the House vote on this by the beginning of September, sending it to the Senate, vote by the beginning of October, hopefully signed by the President by Halloween, if not Thanksgiving.
Thanks for those links if that was directed at my previous question.
It doesn't say sim ride. Basically, it says "Access the person's aviation experience". Doesn't say use a sim, this is left to interpretation.
Not saying it's good or bad, just saying that it doesn't sound to me to make a simulator mandatory.
DAL does some phycho test, I'm sure they will justify that.
SWA does a situational interview (like an Emergency procedure "stand-up")
This rule will change nothing.
The only rule that will require management to get a work around it the ATP requirement. They will find a way.
This legislation will pass because it changes nothing. Standard ops for our legislature. A whole lot of hot air which amounts to nothing.
And wow, a year to implement crew rest changes. This is asking for a lawsuit. The Government acknowledges there is something potentially unsafe regarding airline rest requirements, but then allows this to go on for another year.
I've never understood how the military and the FAA are both run by the government, but as far as flying, they have different rules.
Duty time should be 12 hours max, and minimum rest should be 12 hours after a duty day. Simple.
This will change nothing as it stands. The FAA changes which might get implemented some day were the only real hope.
Not saying it's good or bad, just saying that it doesn't sound to me to make a simulator mandatory.
DAL does some phycho test, I'm sure they will justify that.
SWA does a situational interview (like an Emergency procedure "stand-up")
This rule will change nothing.
The only rule that will require management to get a work around it the ATP requirement. They will find a way.
This legislation will pass because it changes nothing. Standard ops for our legislature. A whole lot of hot air which amounts to nothing.
And wow, a year to implement crew rest changes. This is asking for a lawsuit. The Government acknowledges there is something potentially unsafe regarding airline rest requirements, but then allows this to go on for another year.
I've never understood how the military and the FAA are both run by the government, but as far as flying, they have different rules.
Duty time should be 12 hours max, and minimum rest should be 12 hours after a duty day. Simple.
This will change nothing as it stands. The FAA changes which might get implemented some day were the only real hope.
Nevets
Well-known member
- Joined
- Oct 22, 2007
- Posts
- 2,431
Actually, the summary says (emphasis added by me):
Establishes comprehensive pre-employment screening of prospective pilots including an assessment of a pilot’s skills, aptitudes, airmanship and suitability for functioning in the airline’s operational environment.
Its going to depend on the actual language of the bill, the intent of the language, how its ultimately interpreted, and what the regulations promulgated from the law is written, and how those regulations are interpreted, etc, etc.
You can read the rest of the summary here:
http://transportation.house.gov/Med...t/Airline Safety and Pilot Training Intro.pdf
Last edited:
JetMonkey
It's ok, I speak Jive
- Joined
- May 20, 2004
- Posts
- 582
It's better this way. You don't want congress making the rest rule changes, what the hell do they know about it? Nothing. There giving it to the FAA to make the right changes as it should be. More than likely they'll take care of all those duty hour regs and such that everyone wants. Hey I'm furloughed too and want to go back just as bad as the next guy out on the street, and so I'm glad the FAA is handling this and not the other way around. Tougher rest rules will require more staffing. If they implement new rules by the beginning of next summer, then the airlines will be forced to recall and have everyone trained BEFORE the rule is in place.
Nevets
Well-known member
- Joined
- Oct 22, 2007
- Posts
- 2,431
H.R.3371
Airline Safety and Pilot Training Improvement Act of 2009
http://thomas.loc.gov/cgi-bin/query/...1Q9hrow:e1162:
Airline Safety and Pilot Training Improvement Act of 2009
http://thomas.loc.gov/cgi-bin/query/...1Q9hrow:e1162:
Share this page
Latest resources
-
-
-
-
-
AC 90-89C - Amateur-Built Aircraft and Ultralight Flight Testing HandbookAmateur-Built Aircraft and Ultralight Flight Testing Handbook
- Neal
- Updated:
