Compensation and professinalism

[doh]

When I started at the regionals, they said sleep or iron your shirt. I ironed the shirt. A couple of years in and I said: "Sleep? I never get to sleep!" And the shirt took care of itself. At the frac, the shirt gets pressed and I sleep. You can spin that any way you want, but if one has to go, it ain't never gonna be sleep again!

 

[dude100]

Top level managers at CJC are showing up to reccurrent classes and preaching that "Compensation has NO bearing on professionalism. Walking through the terminal you should see no difference between a Continental pilot and a CJC pilot."

What are my fellow professional pilots opinion on this?

Easy! If you value your job your probably well compensated. Hence, you can afford dry cleaning and a nice vehicle with air conditioning to get to work in. This managment crap about professionalism and compensation is just an excuse not to pay up. The RAS is NOT your friend but only a washington lobby group to keep up with public airline image and pilot rates low.

 

[Amish RakeFight]

Your not a professional unless you're paid like a professional. Otherwise, you're just a hack undercutter.

Being professional has NOTHING to do with the size of your salary. It's an attitude reflected in your day to day performance from the moment you wake up until you retire for the day. A true professional would execute their duites to the fullest and most ethical extent. It involves judgment, knowledge, discipline, grooming, ettiquette, tradition, etc. among many other things outside the scope of ones salary.

Perhaps this is why there's such a gross lack of it. No one knows what professionalism really entails.

 

[btrthn5n5]

Being professional has NOTHING to do with the size of your salary. It's an attitude reflected in your day to day performance from the moment you wake up until you retire for the day. A true professional would execute their duites to the fullest and most ethical extent. It involves judgment, knowledge, discipline, grooming, ettiquette, tradition, etc. among many other things outside the scope of ones salary.

Perhaps this is why there's such a gross lack of it. No one knows what professionalism really entails.

True!

Being a professional is independent of salary. Judgment, knowledge, discipline, ettiquette, and proffeciency are all a mark of a professional.

The argument comes in when you say that a professional appearance is independent of salary, it is not. Unfortunately, to look good... dry cleaned shirt, shined shoes, new pants. etc... a tad bit of income is required. So are work rules that allow for you to keep yourself "in a proper way".

If I'm making $16000 a year and only have 9 hours at the hotel while I'm at work, and two days a week when I'm not at work you can bet that my shirt will be wrinkled (I can't iron while I'm sleeping), my hair will be long (the paycheck has to stretch 4 weeks for a cut instead of every 2), and I'm going to buy food instead of shoe shine. It doesn't mean I'm not a professional pilot, and has no indication of my skill in the cockpit, it just shows that don't get paid a fair wage.

 

[WayBack]

-Next time I am at work I will have to get a sweet baseball cap, don that sucker and turn it backwards.

-Seen two MESA guys doing that last week. This is one trend that needs to catch on everywhere!

It seems to be a new tread of SWA pilots as well, but they wear the baseball cap forward. I seem to see this in LAS the most.

 

[SpauldingSmails]

Being professional has NOTHING to do with the size of your salary. It's an attitude reflected in your day to day performance from the moment you wake up until you retire for the day. A true professional would execute their duites to the fullest and most ethical extent. It involves judgment, knowledge, discipline, grooming, ettiquette, tradition, etc. among many other things outside the scope of ones salary.

Perhaps this is why there's such a gross lack of it. No one knows what professionalism really entails.

As an extreme example of the above, one the flight attendants I've worked with donates all of his paycheck to charity. He's independently wealthy and bored, so he does the job essentially for fun. His FA paycheck is a meager sum to begin with, and being that he donates all of it, he makes essentially nothing. Yet, this man is probably one of the most professional and competent FA's at our company. He doesn't need the job in the least, yet his actions would never portray this truth.

 

[QOL_is_great:)]

Been there, done that and it's easy to look professional

True!

Being a professional is independent of salary. Judgment, knowledge, discipline, ettiquette, and proffeciency are all a mark of a professional.

The argument comes in when you say that a professional appearance is independent of salary, it is not. Unfortunately, to look good... dry cleaned shirt, shined shoes, new pants. etc... a tad bit of income is required. So are work rules that allow for you to keep yourself "in a proper way".

If I'm making $16000 a year and only have 9 hours at the hotel while I'm at work, and two days a week when I'm not at work you can bet that my shirt will be wrinkled (I can't iron while I'm sleeping), my hair will be long (the paycheck has to stretch 4 weeks for a cut instead of every 2), and I'm going to buy food instead of shoe shine. It doesn't mean I'm not a professional pilot, and has no indication of my skill in the cockpit, it just shows that don't get paid a fair wage.

You need to find a another job if those conditions exist for ya.

I say bullsh*t since I have been there in those conditions you wrote and one finds a way to look professional. I didn't dry clean my shirts. I washed them and ironed them ALL. Wash and iron the shirts BEFORE the trip while watching TV and they're good. It only takes fives minutes to iron the shirt on the road. A good shine takes only five minutes which can be done before one leaves for work. Haircut for under ten bucks (even in today's world) once a month. Polish costs under $2, so less then a bag of chips. Not taking these steps and having self-pride doesn't mean you or anyone else is less professional in the cockpit, but the perception it presents is that you are. It's about self-pride bro. If someome is making $16K and is still buying food with their own dime then shame on them. They should be hitting their local food bank, WIC and food stamps because they are intitled to that support.

 

[CX880]

You need to find a another job if those conditions exist for ya.

I say bullsh*t since I have been there in those conditions you wrote and one finds a way to look professional. I didn't dry clean my shirts. I washed them and ironed them ALL. Wash and iron the shirts BEFORE the trip while watching TV and they're good. It only takes fives minutes to iron the shirt on the road. A good shine takes only five minutes which can be done before one leaves for work. Haircut for under ten bucks (even in today's world) once a month. Polish costs under $2, so less then a bag of chips. Not taking these steps and having self-pride doesn't mean you or anyone else is less professional in the cockpit, but the perception it presents is that you are. It's about self-pride bro. If someome is making $16K and is still buying food with their own dime then shame on them. They should be hitting their local food bank, WIC and food stamps because they are intitled to that support.

YEA Dude! As you are washing you dirty shirts on that bathroom sink at your hotel, just look at the mirror, and with the biggest pride tell yourself that I don't need money because I'm a f'cking professional baby!

 

[KPTO]

So executive bonuses must be kept in order to continue and attract high caliber managers. I mean how else might one pay for a 2000.00 dollar suit? So when I am told that compensation has nothing to do with being a professional in one's field I wholeheartedly agree. Because as we have seen during this last economic malaise executives have proven themselves ethical and honest.

 

[CopilotDoug]

With that kind of pay, what kind of "professionals" were CJC Managers hoping to attract ? This is like buying a Yugo and bitching that it's nothing like a BMW.

 

[WayBack]

With that kind of pay, what kind of "professionals" were CJC Managers hoping to attract ? This is like buying a Yugo and bitching that it's nothing like a BMW.

Nothing but the finest!

 

[QOL_is_great:)]

YEA Dude! As you are washing you dirty shirts on that bathroom sink at your hotel, just look at the mirror, and with the biggest pride tell yourself that I don't need money because I'm a f'cking professional baby!

Reread what I said and you'll notice that I NEVER said I wash shirts in a hotel bathroom. I washed my shirts in a washing machine butthead. I also ironed my shirts too. The military showed my how to have pride in myself, the uniform I wear and the job I perform.

I now dryclean them due to a nice six figure salary and I don't spend the time to wash them. I will iron them on the road still once out of the dragbag. I still shine my own shoes too. You even own a pair of shoes that deserve a shine?

I can look at myself in the mirror when I head out from home, the hotel room to my plane or that airliner I may take to get to another plane and know I look like a professional aviator and perform as such too. Do you fit the bill as well?

Based on your response it leads me to believe you are one of the guys who doesn't care what the paying public thinks of how you look. Continue to look like sh*t and you'll be treated as such. You must be one of the slobs in the terminal that give me something to laugh at and snicker. So, if you fit the mold then continue to provide me and other pax a laugh. I'll be easy to spot cause I am one of the clean and pressed looking pilots. If your not then disregard and encourage the slobs we see to clean up their act.

 

[Amish RakeFight]

At the end of the day, the only person whose opinion matters is the person in the mirror. Your attire is a representation of many things; not just the caliber your fashion sense. If you don't want to project a professional appearance, then don't. Just don't claim to be a bonifide professional. That's fair enough. Everyone has an off-day, apparel-wise, but a professional will strive for consistency in every facet of his occupational life. Ensuring that a shirt is pressed or shoes shined is not that big of a deal. Perhaps some pilots come from families/backgrounds which rarely got dressed up for formal occasions and aren't comfortable or experienced at maintaining a polished image. Some just aren't used to keeping a tidy appearance. I've heard some outlandish stories of the attire worn to some interviews. Perhaps these are the typical offenders.

 

[LanceAir]

As an extreme example of the above, one the flight attendants I've worked with donates all of his paycheck to charity. He's independently wealthy and bored, so he does the job essentially for fun. His FA paycheck is a meager sum to begin with, and being that he donates all of it, he makes essentially nothing. Yet, this man is probably one of the most professional and competent FA's at our company. He doesn't need the job in the least, yet his actions would never portray this truth.

Dog chasing tail?

 

[btrthn5n5]

Reread what I said and you'll notice that I NEVER said I wash shirts in a hotel bathroom. I washed my shirts in a washing machine butthead. I also ironed my shirts too. The military showed my how to have pride in myself, the uniform I wear and the job I perform.

I now dryclean them due to a nice six figure salary and I don't spend the time to wash them. I will iron them on the road still once out of the dragbag. I still shine my own shoes too. You even own a pair of shoes that deserve a shine?

I can look at myself in the mirror when I head out from home, the hotel room to my plane or that airliner I may take to get to another plane and know I look like a professional aviator and perform as such too. Do you fit the bill as well?

Based on your response it leads me to believe you are one of the guys who doesn't care what the paying public thinks of how you look. Continue to look like sh*t and you'll be treated as such. You must be one of the slobs in the terminal that give me something to laugh at and snicker. So, if you fit the mold then continue to provide me and other pax a laugh. I'll be easy to spot cause I am one of the clean and pressed looking pilots. If your not then disregard and encourage the slobs we see to clean up their act.

I'm a professional... I look and act like one. But people can't expect me to dress like you... until I have a cushy six figure income.

I pay five dollars for an all day bus pass... I look at the bus driver and I think he is a professional bus driver. He isn't dressed to the nines and I don't expect him to be... I PAID $5!!!

If the flying public wants to question how I look... they can PAY UP!! If you want a suave, shined pilot on top of the fact that he or she won't kill you with lack of skill... PAY UP!!

Don't expect me to pose like I have a nice six figure salary for the "public's" peace of mind. I'll do my job. Safely and effeciently... but don't question how I look because I get paid crap!!

 

[QOL_is_great:)]

I'm a professional... I look and act like one. But people can't expect me to dress like you... until I have a cushy six figure income.

I pay five dollars for an all day bus pass... I look at the bus driver and I think he is a professional bus driver. He isn't dressed to the nines and I don't expect him to be... I PAID $5!!!

If the flying public wants to question how I look... they can PAY UP!! If you want a suave, shined pilot on top of the fact that he or she won't kill you with lack of skill... PAY UP!!

Don't expect me to pose like I have a nice six figure salary for the "public's" peace of mind. I'll do my job. Safely and effeciently... but don't question how I look because I get paid crap!!

You still failed and missed my point slick. I looked sharp when I made only chump-change as a regional FO pilot. It can be done if a person wants to make it happen; it's that simple. Good back and reread my post.
Now for your post in red, above, I won't question how a pilot looks the way they do; I will laugh and snicker with the rest of the pax that comment to me.
You will not convince me that a person can not look sharper when I lived it myself. I view them as lazy and having an excuse when it's possible to do it. Again, if they are making only $16K then they should take advantage of gov't. help and use food stamps with WIC too.
That would be classic to see an airline pilot go shopping for food while in his/her uniform and then pay with food stamps. It would send a message.

 

[flynryan15]

Top level managers at CJC are showing up to reccurrent classes and preaching that "Compensation has NO bearing on professionalism. Walking through the terminal you should see no difference between a Continental pilot and a CJC pilot."

What are my fellow professional pilots opinion on this?

Why didn't you just tell them when Chuck Colgan Jr. dresses like a professional then you will too? When Chucky has a shirt without coffee stains, tie that fits, nose hairs that aren't long and thick enough to make a Hitler Mustache, matching jacket and pants, a shave that doesn't look like it was done by a drunk with a piece of broken glass, and neck hair that doesn't grow up and out of his collar, then you will visit the dry cleaner!

 

[CopilotDoug]

Based on your response it leads me to believe you are one of the guys who doesn't care what the paying public thinks of how you look.

When the flying public shows up to the gate in their PJ's and a garbage bag wrapped in duct tape as a suitcase...does that opinion carry much merit?

 

[ex j-41]

Top level managers at CJC are showing up to reccurrent classes and preaching that "Compensation has NO bearing on professionalism. Walking through the terminal you should see no difference between a Continental pilot and a CJC pilot."

What are my fellow professional pilots opinion on this?

When people can't afford to eat properly it will affect their appearance. When people don't get a good nights rest it will also affect their appearance.
Reminds me of the Toyota Camry commercial. So many people will buy a car because it's like a camry. So why don't they just buy a camry? Same thing here. If you want a professional pilot then pay for one.
You can put lipstick on a pig....

 

[lookin4better]

Keep on wearing hats backwards in uniform, calling each other bro...etc... we need some people to stay in regionals.... its easier for the ones who remain professional to move on.... the rest can stay in the regionals for life..... perception is reality ...cheers!