comair growth

[JI Gone OH]

How long ago were you looking to get a new contract?

People like 180 don't care about getting a contract signed, because the General already has him hired on at mainline...

 

[DGdaPilot]

This is all dumb. Have some of you naysayers even heard Fred speak? If he does even half of what he says, he'll be quite a leader. Ask any Comair pilot about the APU situation and other various changes.....

 

[Nindiri]

I wouldn't put too much faith in what either Fred or Skip tells you. Fred may improve your APU situation (what's wrong with them anyway?), but he isn't doing it for the pilots.

 

[180ToTheMarker]

The thing that bothers me most about the CMR freeze is not the moving around of airplanes, its the precedent that has been set. Now anytime an airline wants to buy new equipment, the employees (pilots) will be expected to help finance the order. I can see it now: "well we would like to get X number of airplanes but we need to be more competetive in the market...blah blah blah...therefore we need the pilots to freeze their pay, take concessions, etc..."

 

[chperplt]

Now anytime an airline wants to buy new equipment, the employees (pilots) will be expected to help finance the order. I can see it now: "well we would like to get X number of airplanes but we need to be more competetive in the market...blah blah blah...therefore we need the pilots to freeze their pay, take concessions, etc..."

In times like these, yes... that is the precedent that has been set. BUT the CMR pilots didn't set this precedent. They were the last ones to take a freeze, cut, or anything of the like.

The company that ultimately pays your bills is losing a ton of money if you haven't noticed. In order to continue service and fight off the competition, something needs to be done. The Delta guys lost 30+% of their salary. How much have the Northwest guys lost? How about the AA guys??? How much have they lost to help the survivability of their employer?

What happened at CMR was no different. The company came to the pilots (All other groups had been pay frozen for over a year) and asked them for help. In exchange for their help, the company offered certain fleet guarantees... Call it anything you want, but the pilots helped the company out. No different that what the DAL, AA, & NW pilots have done.

 

[180ToTheMarker]

Call it anything you want, but the pilots helped the company out. No different that what the DAL, AA, & NW pilots have done.

Actually, it is different. Comair was/is making money (according to DAL). That makes the CMR pilots the first to take concessions to help out a profitable company.

 

[180ToTheMarker]

And another thing, two years ago the ASA pilots were told to extend our contract for two years to get more airplanes. We told mgmt to pound sand and we still got 25 new airframes. Thats another reason why so many ASA guys are upset about this....we feel you would have gotten the growth anyway. Freddie scared you guys and you bought into it.

 

[chperplt]

Actually, it is different. Comair was/is making money

You are either really ignorant or just really need a reason to place blame...

I'll make it as basic as I can for you.... Delta owns ASA and CMR.. Both CMR and ASA can be profitable entities. BUT..... As long as Delta is losing money, the profit those companies make is immaterial. Until both CMR and ASA provide Delta a profit equal to, or greater than the loss that DAL incurs, the company as a whole is losing money.

The fact that you refused to extend your contract 2 additional years in also immaterial. That truth is, you have extended your contract unwillingly and for probably a lot more than 2 years. You got 25 more airplanes without agreeing to what has happened anyway. You do see that, don't you?

 

[180ToTheMarker]

You are either really ignorant or just really need a reason to place blame...

Um, yes...

You didn't fly OH58's in Alabama did you?

 

[chperplt]

You didn't fly OH58's in Alabama did you?

That's where the Army Aviation Training Center is located....So YUP.. I flew them in Alabama for a little while.

 

[General Lee]

People like 180 don't care about getting a contract signed, because the General already has him hired on at mainline...

A lot faster than you bud. Thanks to your generosity as a pilot group in general, we will probably be looking at ASA pilots before you. They were nice enough not to set up road blocks to help our furloughed pilots. But, you knew that.


Bye Bye--General Lee

 

[jehtplane]

180

I don't think Fred is bending over the CMR pilots anymore than Skip is bending your pilot groups happy ass over.

How long ago were you looking to get a new contract? Don't blame the CMR group for taking care of themselves. They held out as long as they could for you guys to get your contract done in the hopes that they wouldn't have to take a freeze.

If anyone has failed anyone, it is the ASA pilots who failed the CMR pilots. You guys failed to get your contract done and now you blame CMR instead of yourselves...or heaven sakes your management team.

Are you f'in kidding me??????????? What the he!! did you just smoke you pansy A$$? You have got to be the biggest MORON ON THE PLANET!!!!!!!!!!! BARNONE!!!!!!!!!!!

 

[chperplt]

Are you f'in kidding me??????????? What the he!! did you just smoke you pansy A$$? You have got to be the biggest MORON ON THE PLANET!!!!!!!!!!! BARNONE!!!!!!!!!!!

Why thank you sir... And your exemplary use of the English language tells us everything we need to know about you.

By the way... ASS isn't a censored word.. As in you can lick my ASS.

 

[Otto]

A lot faster than you bud. Thanks to your generosity as a pilot group in general, we will probably be looking at ASA pilots before you. They were nice enough not to set up road blocks to help our furloughed pilots. But, you knew that.

Bye Bye--General Lee

Please!!! Is anyone here as entertained as I am about the general's delusions of power over the hiring process at Delta? General, do you really believe your fellow former F-14/F-15/C-5 drivers at Delta give a rat's a$$ about some squabble with Comair? Do you think they will give ASA pilots priority over their squadron buds coming out of the military? Keep on going though...it's very amusing. I just feel sorry for the ASA pilots who are duped into believing they will be rewarded for kissing all this widget tail.

 

[180ToTheMarker]

I just feel sorry for the ASA pilots who are duped into believing they will be rewarded for kissing all this widget tail.

Trying to help out a furloughed brother is not kissing widget tail. It was the right thing to do.

 

[twobits]

hmmm...... i thought this was old news. Comair hires Delta pilots now. They did before as well, however, it was Comair's holding currently called Delta Air Elite. This should really be a mute point, but it it continues to waste people's time and divides us. Getting that job at Delta should probably be the last thing on people's minds right now (it ain't happening anytime soon, sorry to dissapoint you) and finding ways to make the company survive and thrive should be first.

 

[Plug]

Wrong again, Texx. The issue was with resigning seniority. Comair's policy has always been that pilots must give up their number at their current employer prior to being offered a job at Comair. I had to do it, as did the other 1800 pilots here. That created heartburn with some of the Delta boys, as they felt as though they were for some reason above having to do that. Comair, Inc. was simply enforcing Comair policy. Quit blaming JC, the RJDC, and the "unruly" Comair pilot group, because you [and so many others] are barking up the wrong tree. The pilot shortages you speak of would have been a secondary consequence had they not been required to give up their seniority, and Comair, Inc. was smart enough to recognize that. It's not rocket science.....

OK, you had to resign your number, probably not too concerned about getting re-called at JI, business ain't too good over there and it hadn't been since before 9/11, oh wait they don't exist anymore. So your seniority at JI is nill just like all other JI pilots.

Next.......

So you're saying that the CMR pilots were concerned about CMR's well-being should they hire DAL pilots and allow them to retain their re-call rights? These same concerned CMR pilots felt this way just 2 years after nearly burning CMR down with an 89 day strike.

BS ALERT!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Now what really happened, JC, with a majority of the CMR MEC, attempted to strike a deal with the DAL MEC to change the scope clause to be more inclusive of CMR. The DAL MEC said no and JC and the boys said "well, okay, we won't go out of my way to do anything..." (these are not word for word statements but a brief summary of what happened over the course of time)

So the "I'm looking out for the best interest of CMR.." line is crap, you know and most others know it, the CMR MEC was trying to get something in return for their consent in hiring furloughs from the DAL MEC and the DAL MEC wouldn't play ball.

 

[Plug]

The CMR airplane with the hand prints on it is now dubbed the "Hand Job".

The ASA airplane with Stone Mountain on it is either "Pimpel Jet", "Landfill Jet", or "Slider 3". ;-)

The ASA airplane with "the pretty flowers on it", well I won't go there....

Next......

Some one from CMR brought up the ASA contact and that they got tired of waiting for us to negotiate a new deal, about how long did you guys negotiate before the strike? 'Bout 3 1/2 years, right? Yeah it'll be 3 years for us in Sept. Thanks for the supportive sticker, a$$!

For you to actually sit there and say the ASA pilots are to blame, you would have to be a mental midget. We did nothing, did not change our current agreement, the pace of negotiations we simply let DAL make the decision as to where the airplanes are to go (referring to the RFP). We initially got 25 (4 of which have now been converted to -700's), the 7 airplanes Skywest were to get are now coming to ASA (now up to 32 new airplanes), we are giving up 10 airplanes in our current fleet so that CMR can comply with your new agreement and will eventually get 12 GECAS birds (total is 34 airplanes). Now, 6 of those new jets from Canada have been put off until next year in the hopes of getting the financing to convert them to -700's, but still 34 airplanes in total will be delivered to ASA from 12/04 to 12/06 all the while we the pilots didn't do Jack Squat for the company.

So you keep telling yourself that you were helping the company with your pay freeze that was a drop in the bucket and really doesn't make a difference to the CMR budget, but keep telling yourself you helped. What you really did was confirm management's theory that we young regional pilots sport wood over the possibility to fly bigger airplanes. They have been trying to exploit this for some time because they knew it was there. They knew it was there no thanks to the RJDC with respect to scope limits. They knew that if a following formed for a lawsuit to loosen scope language so that more bigger airplanes can be flown then they could exploit that and get a concession from the pilots. Way to go, you keep blaming us ASA pilots, we clearly are the problem! I dub you "Indesposable Douche Bag!"

 

[chperplt]

Some of you guys have anger problems... Might want to take care of that before you drop dead.

 

[JI Gone OH]

A lot faster than you bud. Thanks to your generosity as a pilot group in general, we will probably be looking at ASA pilots before you. They were nice enough not to set up road blocks to help our furloughed pilots. But, you knew that.


Bye Bye--General Lee

D*mned if we do, d*mned if we don't... Can't win with you, can we?