College Educated Pilots vs Management

[capt. megadeth]

There's a lot to be said for the security of being able to pay your bills if your eyeballs or heart go bad, too.

Agreed. I don't know why people don't get this concept....it seems like a no brainer to me.

Oh well, why should I care? I got my back up.

 

[jafo20]

When I was in college, I was really frustrated that I wasn't flying. Now, two years out, I'm in about the same spot I'd have been in if I'd never gone. So, I've come out by getting the degree.

As for quality of pilot, I'd say people who push hard to get something done have similar mentalities. People who are born into money have entirely different mind-sets.

The guys I meet who worked their ass off at the University of STATE, climbing enlisted ranks to go to O school or moving back home with mom and dad to scrape up enough dough for a multi-engine rating all tend to be decent sticks. More importantly, they usually have some integrity.

People who are the sons/daughters of admirals, have mom and dad send 'em to ERAU with a Porsche or pencil-whip their time tend to be **CENSORED****CENSORED****CENSORED****CENSORED**ty sticks. More importantly, their lack of integrity can be seen before you even talk to 'em.

I'm getting preachy. Somebody throw a rock at me.

 

[SWAnnabee]

Why don't you quit playing with your sheepskin and do a little research, "Mr. Collegiality"?

College Educated Pilots vs Management. The premise of this topic was to post opinions on whether or not the recent trends to make a college education optional in the application process could be interpreted as a desire by most airline management teams to create a pilot group less capable of dealing toe-to-toe with airline management, especially concerning contractual issues. So, while I quit "playing with my sheepskin", why don't you wipe my man-spackle out of your eyes enough to read more carefully, Mr. Jackassity.

 

[Ty Webb]

Your point was refuted in almost every way imaginable, and with multiple examples given. No one agreed with your premise. . . . except you.

Common sense says that it is wrong . . . . pilots who did not go to college presumably have more industry experience, not less, and are probably more familiar with the nuances of contracts, scheduling, rigs, "Soft Time", and the like . . .

Speaking of "Soft time" . . . . I hear most of your time is soft time . . . at least, that's what you wife told me.

 

[Ty Webb]

Does Airtran pay much attention to whether you have a degree or not?

From what I have seen, it is not part of the pre-screening process. What weight an individual interviewer puts on it, I couldn't tell you.

I think if you get the interview, and are reasonably articulate, it's probably not an issue.

 

[TexaSWA]

Good one, jacka$$. If you could comprehend English, you'd see that he offered no opinion on whether or not HE thought it was white collar, and you'd see that I offered no judgement on whether he thought it white collar or not. I just said it was up to him without attacking him one way or the other.

Now go f*** yourself.

MAGNUM,

I guess you didnt get my sarcasm. I find his remark rediculous. Even more rediculous is that he qualifies it with "because a NWA 400 pilot told me so".

I was siding with you.

 

[WillowRunVortex]

MAGNUM,

I guess you didnt get my sarcasm. I find his remark rediculous. Even more rediculous is that he qualifies it with "because a NWA 400 pilot told me so".

I was siding with you.

Well you guys keep hangin out in " Ima Doctor and I wanna be a millionair" land and we'll see where it gets ya. Personally I like to keep myself centered in REALITY.

There is a reason guys, why a pair of shoes are priced less than $100. Because anymore than that and people tend to where the ones they have until they fall off their feet. There is a reason that airfair is priced at what it is. Because anymore than that and people will drive or vacation in their back yards. Its called ,,,wait a min,,,its called ,,,its called,,,ECONOMICS<<!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!So when all you guys finally give up on the raising fares thing, maybe we may make progress elswhere. When reality finally comes around and knocks you guys flat on your A$$es you will say " Willow was right".

Oh and TexaSWA, if you really do fly for SWA, your airline is the reason all these other guys in here have so much angst. Your airline charges $39 to go from DTW to ORD. NWA charges $380

 

[WillowRunVortex]

Cool. How has arguing for less respect and less pay worked out for you so far?

Probably about the same as yours,,,the differencs is my argument is not an exercise in FUTILITY,,,plus I probably get less blue in the face as you.

 

[TexaSWA]

Well you guys keep hangin out in " Ima Doctor and I wanna be a millionair" land and we'll see where it gets ya. Personally I like to keep myself centered in REALITY.

There is a reason guys, why a pair of shoes are priced less than $100. Because anymore than that and people tend to where the ones they have until they fall off their feet. There is a reason that airfair is priced at what it is. Because anymore than that and people will drive or vacation in their back yards. Its called ,,,wait a min,,,its called ,,,its called,,,ECONOMICS<<!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!So when all you guys finally give up on the raising fares thing, maybe we may make progress elswhere. When reality finally comes around and knocks you guys flat on your A$$es you will say " Willow was right".

Oh and TexaSWA, if you really do fly for SWA, your airline is the reason all these other guys in here have so much angst. Your airline charges $39 to go from DTW to ORD. NWA charges $380

nevermind...

 

[B6Driver]

Name one airline that has ever used a fighter acft in its operation and then I might agree with you. How you view your training and the effort you put into it is a personal issue and seeing both military and civilian trained pilots I can safely say that both groups equally have their good and bad pilots.
Make no mistake though, we are labor.

 

[stonewall]

MAGNUM,

I guess you didnt get my sarcasm. I find his remark rediculous. Even more rediculous is that he qualifies it with "because a NWA 400 pilot told me so".

I was siding with you.

I sincerely apologize. Sometimes you can never tell with people on this website...

 

[semperfido]

shoot from the hip and ask questions later- ooorah

s/f

 

[YGBSM]

Probably about the same as yours,,,the differencs is my argument is not an exercise in FUTILITY,,,plus I probably get less blue in the face as you.

When I get blue in the face I'll let you know. I'm rare, but I like my flying job just fine the way it is.

I don't, however, go out of my way to let my employers know that I don't think I'm worth what they're paying me. Be sure and let us know how that works out for you.

 

[WillowRunVortex]

I'm rare, but I like my flying job just fine the way it is.

Exactly,,,lets all ride the ship down. Lets play chicken and see who flinches first. NWA is doing that right now,,,not with the pilots though. That company is flirting with BK over distrust not figures ,,,they could probably stay out. Someones gotta give,,,who's got more options, us or upper management? Trust me they will and have let companys die and then move on to Burger King.

 

[YGBSM]

I'm rare, but I like my flying job just fine the way it is.
QUOTE]

Exactly,,,lets all ride the ship down. Someones gotta give,,,who's got more options, us or upper management? Trust me they will and have let companys die and then move on to Burger King.

Might be time to switch jobs then, huh?

Reduce pay to $40K a year and keep it there and see how many pilots worth a sh*t stick around. Have fun putting your mom on that flight.

That's economics too.

 

[WillowRunVortex]

Name one airline that has ever used a fighter acft in its operation and then I might agree with you. How you view your training and the effort you put into it is a personal issue and seeing both military and civilian trained pilots I can safely say that both groups equally have their good and bad pilots.
Make no mistake though, we are labor.

B6, could you PLEASE impart on these guys why you agree that we are labor,,, no-one seems to get it in here. When I fly everyone I fly with agree's.

 

[YGBSM]

B6, could you PLEASE impart on these guys why you agree that we are labor,,, no-one seems to get it in here. When I fly everyone I fly with agree's.

No argument with that. We're labor.

And since you seem to be actively seeking to work more for less, knock yourself out.

 

[WillowRunVortex]

Might be time to switch jobs then, huh?

Reduce pay to $40K a year and keep it there and see how many pilots worth a sh*t stick around. Have fun putting your mom on that flight.

That's economics too.

So there I was...
Final approach one engine on fire, shooting an approach down to Cat II mins, my captain is dead... Took a bird strike right in the face... Tower clears me to land but reminds me that landing in a tornado is not a good idea...
"Darn the tornado I have to get this thing on the ground!" I can hear the screams from behind me... all 50 pax are in some stage of panic!
Sound familiar... I don't understand how you can think some pilots could be overpaid. The amount of training and skill to pilot a modern jet from ATL to ORD is unimaginable.
You also have to remeber the top physical condition you have to stay in to keep your medical. I don't know about the rest of the pilots on this board but I train with Lance Armstrong on my days off just to meet the medical requirements.
Don't get me started on schedule... Just last week I only had three days off... That means that I was working for four days. Try and find a doctor or a CEO who is gone for that amount of time. Good luck!
Oh and speaking of responsability. Sure a CEO has to answer to hundreds of share holders or decide to layoff 100,000 workers... I along with a captain am responsible for 50 passengers... on a full flight. One screw up... just one little thing like pushing the push to talk at the wrong time and everyone dies.
YOU WANT ME ON THAT WALL.... YOU NEED ME ON THAT WALL

Originally posted by 'Crash Pad'

 

[Yudso]

Just for the record: College degree does not make one a more qualified pilot.

If we are not laborers, then why do we need the collective threat of work actions to negotiate pay and quality of life issues. The fact that anyone of us is easily replaceable, requires all of us to stand up and fight for what we deserve. Doctors and lawyers can demand individual premiums based on individual skills. That is part of what makes them "white collar". Pilots are "supposedly" held up to a unified standard, which unfortunately makes us replaceable. The element that is missing from our equation is a uniform respect for our profession and eachother. Unity.

P.S. RJDC proponents keep moving, there is nothing to see here.

 

[semperfido]

airline pilot=union=seniority # = labor