CJC pilots! Get ready for Managements anti union memo madness!

suupah

Well-known member
Joined
Jan 31, 2004
Posts
1,779
Total Time
859
Managers are required to follow a script


Typically, management staff will be trained to follow a script that has
by professional “union avoidance” consultants. We will receive written
communications from management that will also follow that script, which
used at dozens of other airlines.
Knowing that certain themes are part of management’s standard playbook,
as Colgan pilots to get the facts and keep our eyes on our goal.
Generally, management scripts fall under six general themes:


1. Unions have no power to get you anything more than what management
2. You’re wasting your money paying union dues.
3. Things will get worse when there is an outsider here.
4. Signing an Authorization for Representation Election card is legally
5. Things aren’t so bad, and if they are, give us a chance to fix it.
6. ALPA pilot groups have had problems at other carriers.
 

suupah

Well-known member
Joined
Jan 31, 2004
Posts
1,779
Total Time
859
MANAGEMENT THEME #1:

Unions have no power.


The Facts:
By uniting and gaining the legal right to negotiate, ALPA pilot groups have won improvements when their airlines were profitable, and prevented unnecessary concessions when things were bad. By uniting and

gaining ALPA representation, we will too.

The Script: “We don't have to agree to what you want in a contract.”
-Having a say in our pay, benefits, work rules and future is good for us and for our airline.

-By law, management must bargain in good faith with an ALPA pilot group.

-When our carrier is healthy, collective bargaining ensures that we share in the prosperity we help create. If our carrier hits economic turbulence, we’ll be in a better position to negotiate over how to make adjustments in the best way for pilots and
the company.
-At FedEx, pilots are the only unionized employee group, and management followed the script against pilot unity for years. The FedEx pilots joined ALPA and were able to negotiate a contract significantly better that the one which had been negotiated by
an independent union before the FedEx pilots joined ALPA.




 
Last edited:

suupah

Well-known member
Joined
Jan 31, 2004
Posts
1,779
Total Time
859
The Script:
“You will start from ground zero in negotiations and have to bargain back

everything you have.”

“There are no guarantees—you may gain or lose when negotiating.”


-Under the RLA, the company can change working conditions if there is no union, up
to the point that the first contract is negotiated and in effect. However, it is illegal to
make changes that are designed to punish or retaliate against pilots for joining a
union.
-Once we have a union, we will have the right to negotiate over any changes in wages and working conditions. It is the only protection for what we have and the only way to improve on what management chooses to give us—or take away from us.

-We have no guarantees now. With a union, we are guaranteed a voice in decisions that affect our lives.

-As a pilot group, we will decide what to negotiate and what to accept. Our unity, along with the backing, expertise, and experience of all of ALPA, will determine what we achieve in each contract.

The Script:



“Management retains the right to run things the way it wants.”

-When we form a union, the law requires management to negotiate all changes in our pay, benefits and working conditions. That gives us a lot of say about our work lives and our future. With a union contract, management can’t change things that are spelled out in the collective bargaining agreement without negotiating and reaching
agreement with us on the changes. If the company violates the contract, we have a legal process to enforce the contract and deal with the violation.

-Only through union representation can we achieve the legal right to bargain and a collectively bargained and enforceable contract.

-Until we organize, we are “at-will” employees, meaning we can be disciplined or fired at any time for any reason. If you think about it, each of us really is on permanent probation until we unite as an ALPA pilot group and negotiate a contract.


 
Last edited:

pilotyip

Well-known member
Joined
Nov 26, 2001
Posts
13,629
Total Time
14000
that is their job, the final decision will be made by secret ballot
 

CA1900

Big Member
Joined
Mar 17, 2002
Posts
5,436
Total Time
11000+
Don't forget my favorite myth from the first CommutAir ALPA campaign:

Voting in a union will force the company out of business!


That's a crock, and you guys know it. But expect them to use that tactic. Also expect them to hire these people, at CommutAir did:

http://www.fordharrison.com/showarea.aspx?Show=546
 

PCL_128

Well-known member
Joined
Nov 21, 2002
Posts
15,296
Total Time
5000+
Joined
Apr 15, 2004
Posts
4,872
Total Time
4
see PFT-128, personal attacks are not nice.
 
Last edited:

pilotyip

Well-known member
Joined
Nov 26, 2001
Posts
13,629
Total Time
14000
Rrality, reality, reality, something you would not understand

So your job as a manager is to lie, mislead, and misrepresent? Thanks for finally clearing that up.
Those are your words. I have gone through this process; there was nothing but facts. Also our pilots won, they got as much or if not more than they could have with representation. The company's dislike of unions put them in the Toyota mode. That is be ahead of the industry and offer so much that you will not have to deal with the union drive again. However in the end it put us out of business, Being the leader of your segment is very expensive and in the long run we could not afford it. The company took the high road and elected to not do it at all if it could not do it right. I am a union realist, as a former ALPA and Teamster member I have seen what unions can and can not do. They can not make a silk purse out of a pig’s ear in the on-demand business.
 
Last edited:

IslandDriver

Well-known member
Joined
Aug 22, 2005
Posts
257
Total Time
8000
I was at CJC and now work for a Union Carrier. The carrier I work for is alot better in many ways for sure...and by all means would be considered by most as a step up...but there are many things that I got from management at CJC that I will never see here....even with a union.

I am happy where I am now but I do see where a union is not always needed. Even more so with only 500 pilots.

Ask you friends at Penucle....they may not tell you straight out but they have a union and overall they do not have it "better".

As long as you still have a good management you will do better without the union. Look at who is in mid level management...Honan, Baxter, Barrett, Bandavanis, Et Al. They are pilot's management. Those are the people you have to deal with if you have "trouble" they are all fair and have the pilots in mind...a union would actually hurt you if you have to dance on their carpet.

Just my opinion...my 6 years at CJC were great...even without a union....I know things "Change" but they do not change as much as you think.
 

DoinTime

Well-known member
Joined
Nov 27, 2001
Posts
2,523
Total Time
6000+
my 6 years at CJC were great
It was great being one of America's worst paid pilots?
 

Grimper

Active member
Joined
May 8, 2005
Posts
37
Total Time
1500+
CJC pilots I'm nether for nor against ALPA, IBT, or no union but be clear what ever you decide will affect your work environment. Each of the three choices have pros and cons so do your resurch and make an informed dession. No matter what you decide make sure to vote or you will be allowing others to vote for you. With the state of the world right now you could be at Colgan for a while so it is worth your time to figure out what will be best for your self and your pilot group.
 

vectorvictor

Well-known member
Joined
Oct 28, 2006
Posts
355
Total Time
Lifer
CJC pilots I'm nether for nor against ALPA, IBT, or no union but be clear what ever you decide will affect your work environment. Each of the three choices have pros and cons so do your resurch and make an informed dession. No matter what you decide make sure to vote or you will be allowing others to vote for you. With the state of the world right now you could be at Colgan for a while so it is worth your time to figure out what will be best for your self and your pilot group.

Are you kidding? Thanks for the voice of reason.

LOL
 

DoinTime

Well-known member
Joined
Nov 27, 2001
Posts
2,523
Total Time
6000+
Although to be fair, Pinnacle should be somewhere in there for 'worst paid pilots.'
I don't think you'll ever find someone from PCL saying "my six years at the 'knuckle' were great." To do so would be proof that you were drunk on the kool-aid the whole time.
 

Snaab

Well-known member
Joined
Oct 6, 2005
Posts
372
Total Time
7k
Look at who is in mid level management...Honan, Baxter, Barrett, Bandavanis, Et Al. They are pilot's management. Those are the people you have to deal with if you have "trouble" they are all fair and have the pilots in mind...a union would actually hurt you if you have to dance on their carpet.

Not sure when you left, but things have changed. They have jobs to do and take the company line these days. I think many pilots that have been here a few years feel the "Colgan Air Family" is no more, and that they are on their own. This is very disconcerting for us, especially seeing how hard a great many people do work day-in and day-out.
 

LanceAir

I'm a Registered User
Joined
Apr 11, 2006
Posts
125
Total Time
> 250
Agreed, even good guys that are fresh off the line have become management henchmen, and instead of sticking up for their fellow pilots, they have been cracking skulls...
 

30West

NARF!
Joined
Feb 16, 2006
Posts
533
Total Time
@8000
Agreed, even good guys that are fresh off the line have become management henchmen, and instead of sticking up for their fellow pilots, they have been cracking skulls...

....when skulls need to be cracked, yes.
Don't count these folks out. There are many more pilots that still have jobs here because of them, not in spite of.
 
Last edited:
Top