Civil Air Patrol

[Typhoon1244]

Anybody can get on web boards like this one and claim to be anything they want. I don't know who you really are, Zeek, but you sure don't sound like an officer or a gentleman. You sound more like a "woulda/shoulda/coulda."

Okay, in light of the P.M. I received, I must apologize. I believe Zeek is a bona fide military aviator.

But he's not very polite...

 

[JediNein]

There IS an ignore feature on this website. No one has to know you are using it. . .

 

[PilotoHalcon]

The CAP is an offshoot of the USAF right? So that is maybe where the requirements of military customs and courtesies come from in the CAP. Nobody has to join the CAP. But if you do you have to play by those rules. But like in ANY organization, there are some who will abuse power. They will be dealt with eventually. I get the feeling here that there are some of us who would do away with sports in school because it is too confrontational and someone may get hurt. Well, welcome to the world. Mediocrity will not put food on your family’s table. Like the Boy scouts should never allow girls. It's just the way it is.
j
Ps, where is that ignore feature anyway?

 

[Clearsky]

He sounds more like a mentally unbalanced 15 year old. What an embarrassment to the military, if he is actually in it.

 

[Clearsky]

Yes, how could volunteer work possible be a good thing on the resume (sigh). I hope you feel better now that you've made your "attack" and also altered my original post. You appear to be a class act.

I agree with some of the negative points made in this particular discussion but I feel they are out-weighed by other positive factors. If you want to affect a constructive change why don't you contact the Air Force.

Did you have some kind of a run-in with a CAP person because the verocity of your attacks on this issue are amazing and appear a bit over the top?

In all seriousness, in what way would you improve the organization and why do you think the Air Force maintains the CAP if it's such a bad thing? Maybe they have no choice...I'm not being sarcastic here. Post something constructive, we've had enough of your useless derogatory remarks.

 

[Typhoon1244]

You all take it easy on Zeek. He was once molested by a gardener wearing green coveralls and tennis shoes...bound to make a man bitter.

So Zeek, haven't gottn any P.M.'s from you lately. Still think I know you?

 

[bobbysamd]

Volunteerism

The CAP is an offshoot of the USAF right? So that is maybe where the requirements of military customs and courtesies come from in the CAP.

That is essentially correct, although I recall the Air Force took over sponsership of CAP much after WWII.

I believe there is also a Coast Guard Auxiliary. It, too, is a volunteer organization and its members were CG-adapted uniforms.

I always listed my CAP experience on my resume. I had interviews. My apologies if this was already mentioned, but shortly after 911 the President urged Americans to volunteer their time and services. Although we as pilots naturally focus on the aviation aspects of CAP, there is lots of things available for non-pilots, including flight opportunities as navigators and observers. And, you get to wear Nomex! Seriously, there never is enough non-pilot crew available. Also, ground team is essential to the mission. Some of best and most competent people in my squadron were non-pilots who were in charge of admin.

There is something for everyone in CAP. Maybe more open-mindedness and less cynicism is in order here.

 

[d328pilot]

I had to throw my 2 cents in on CAP. CAP does have some problems but all in all, it is a wonderful organization. I joined when I was 14 years old and was in it for about 7 years. I had never flown before and I joined because I always wanted to go into the military and at 14, that was as close as I could get. I ended up getting so much more. So what did I get out of it. I got my first flight for free and knew that this was what I wanted to do. I progressed through the entire cadet program and learned a lot about leadership and communication. I got to be the commander of 2 encampments where a learned a lot about dealing with people. I got to spend a week at Columbus AFB to learn all about the AETC. I got to spend a day talking with the fomer AF chief of staff. It took me about 2 hours just to get over the awe of the 4 stars on his shoulder. I got a free two week trip to Israel where I got to meet the President of Israel who flew for the IAF and still flies in his ME-109. I got to spend the night on an Isreali air force base and watch an alert drill done by the IAF. I got a government tour of the entire country and got to fly on an Israeli c130...and that might not be a big deal to some people, but I was 17 years old....it was a big deal to me. I could go on and on about that trip. I was able to become a check pilot and I loved the look on some of the older guys came to me some 18 year old kid for a checkride. I was able to afford my flying lessons because I had a CAP instructor that understood that a 16 year old does not make that much money pumping gas at the airport after school. The CAP let me use the airplane for about 25 dollars an hour. I had grown men that respected my opinions and I was allowed to help make policy for my wing. It might only be CAP policy but it was still a big deal to me. I was able to meet people that helped me get my first job flying checks when I was 18. I got my first airline job about a year and a half later...now I am just waiting for my birthday to upgrade. I owe all of this to CAP....and the best things are that I have made some wonderful friends for life and after I got my CFI, I was able to take some of those 14 years olds up for their first flight and see how excited they were. Yes, some of the stuff they do is a little strange. There are some good groups, and some that are just an old mans flying club. But most guys have one thing in common...they love to fly. That made a huge impact on me. And yes, I will admit that the 14 year olds running around in camo does look a little strange. But I use to be one of those kids. I cant even begin to tell you how CAP impacted my life. It is a very very good program and you will never convince me otherwise. I just wish they could have taught me to spell.

 

[PilotoHalcon]

That was a darn good post. My dad spent time volunteering with the CAP years ago. Later when I was flying for the TX Guard and we were doing bucket bombing with the H60's, the CAP flew us from our home to AUS to get to work. I thought it was good of them.
When I find a position in TX after this Kuwait thing I will vollunteer my time as well. But I will not wear the tennis shoes.
And if they let me, I will wear the Warrant Officer rank
j

 

[Jeff G]

(come on this SH*t is funny)

*Yawn*. No, not really.

 

[PilotoHalcon]

Heck, I'd wear my Bermuda shorts and go topless and barefoot if I could get away with it. Standard sailing attire except for the safety harness if you venture very far on deck. Just dont want to be another freakin Lt. Col. Ya know what I mean? But it is a great organization.
j

 

[PilotoHalcon]

Yes, THAT'S funny. (I am just jealous)
j

 

[Jeff G]

OK- its not as funny as the Fact that "Jet Blue " hasn't paid any money on it leases yet- Now thats funny-

Yes, there's something hilariously funny about making fun of old men in tennis shoes. It gets funnier every time you say it.

And I'm just ROTFLMAO at the JetBlue financial scam rumor that's been making its rounds for the past couple of years. It's just a scream.

You are indeed a poet of witty utterances, zeek. A true master of the subtle shades and delicate edge of sophisticated merriment. How I envy you.

 

[Willam Barker]

I support the Civil Air Patrol - But Zeek does have a point about it being a flying club- BB

 

[trainerjet]

HOLY SH!T...

5 pages of a p!ssing contest about the CAP and Zeek giving multiple lessons on how to be a d!ck.

What entertainment!

 

[VFR on Top]

Here’s a question for those of you who have been active in the CAP cadet program. Have you ever had to counsel cadets either individually, or as a group about ignoring their peers who are ridiculing them? Had to reassure them that their involvement in CAP was something to be proud of, and the nay-sayers were losers who should be ignored? I’ll bet you have, and I’ll further venture to say that if no cadet has ever expressed these concerns to you, you may not have had as a good a rapport with the cadets as you’d like to imagine.

In eight years as a cadet and another 9 as a senior member (5 of those as a cadet unit commander), I'd have to say absolutely, unequivocally NO. CAP cadets may not be football team captains or cheerleaders, but they aren't the school chess club, either. "Band fags" indeed....what instrument did you say you play, Zeek?

A substantial number of posters here have a really mistaken impression of what CAP's cadet program is about--either that, or they base their opinion on only a year or two in the program. The Cadet Program's mission statement, pure and simple, is to develop dynamic Americans and aerospace leaders--which, by and large, we accomplish quite well with those who stick with the program long-term. It's got nothing to do with saluting or pushups (which, by the way, have been "outlawed" as a "leadership" tactic for years now), or even military uniforms--those are all simply tools to teach the larger lessons of responsible leadership. Due to many of the same ills documented here ad nauseum, CAP has a horrendous retention rate--we lose something close to 50% of 1st year cadets each year. And that's a shame, because those folks miss out on the real value to be gained from the program in later phases. But I have to tell you, I've seen some really awe-inspiring performances from some of our more senior cadets when it's their turn to step up to the plate as cadet leaders responsible for upwards of 350 of their peers at some of our larger activities.

A question for everyone here wondering about the significance of that last statement: when in your career, if ever, do you expect to have supervisory responsibility for that many people, even briefly? For you captains: you've got a great deal of knowledge and experience in flying airplanes, and have a huge amount of responsibility for lives and equipment, but what the he11 do you really know about leadership? How to brow-beat your FO? Or how to get an FA to refill your coffee before it's cold? Sure, we do it in a controlled training environment, but I doubt if a great many of you could handle what some of our 20-year-old cadets have on that score.

As for objections to CAP and your tax dollars, the federally appropriated funds CAP receives are almost entirely for operations and maintenance for what is the world's largest fleet of single-engine Cessnas, and are but a fraction of the money that would be spent if the missions we perform had to be accomplished by USAF resources. Cries that CAP shouldn't receive your tax dollars are simply penny-wise and pound-foolish.

All this to say that pretty much everyone but Zeek has valid points--and that like every organization, from your neighborhood cub scout den to a fighter squadron aboard USS Stennis to the boardroom at United, CAP has its strengths and weaknesses. CAP suffers horribly from many of the ills adequately documented here--from the security guard wearing oak leaves to the pint-sized prepubescent drowning in his uniform, to stunning embarrassments brought on by the national "leadership"--but in the aggregate, CAP remains a worthwhile organization performing worthwhile missions for our communities and our country.

For those of you with nothing but negative things to say about CAP: if your glass is so half-empty that you cannot acknowledge the sacrifices of time, effort and money that CAP's volunteers expend for your benefit without disparaging them as "wannabees" with uniform fetishes and whatnot, perhaps you need to take a long hard look in the mirror and deal with your own issues before worrying about someone else's.

 

[bobbysamd]

CAP

Dynamite post, VFR on Top.

I recall that the cadets in our CAP squadron were heads and shoulders above their peers in high school ROTC. Something I found very curious because ROTC was course in which they enrolled and were graded.

 

[V-1]

I'm sure there are good and bad pilots at the CAP. From my experience, most of these guys spend all their time on the ground preaching to everyone about safety, then they get in their Cessnas and proceed to scare the he11 out of anyone flying within ten miles of them.

I can't even begin to list some of the bone-headed things I've seen the pilots of one CAP group do. My adrenaline glands would go into overdrive when I'd hear "CAP flight XXX" check on with center, using the same frequency I was on.

Then there was that twelve year old, dressed in his uniform, drunk on his power, who barked at me, his voice cracking from puberty, to get behind some invisible line because I was too close to an aircraft on display at an airshow in Muskogee, Oklahoma. I couldn't decide if I should be amused or humiliated.

Sky Nazis...that's what we called them.

I'm sure some units are better than others.

 

[MetroSheriff]

Has anybody seen my Nomex flight suit and white tennis shoes?- we have to launch the "Ready Alert 5" - there seems to be a missing puppy in the neighborhood-- "Listen here Cadet- this is the supreme commander- I don't care if you are only in third grade and your bed time is 7:00 pm (1900 hrs for the CAP)- you need to get out of your jammies and run down to the Air Field to wash the windscreens of the "Ready Alert 5" - And when I see you - you better be in full dress uniform (flight suit and tennis shoes) and render me the proper military respect - - I don't care if I am only the school janitor- (by day) - tonight I am the Supreme Commander- - Cadet don't back talk- this is a red alert- I hope this doesn't come out of Oskosh fly in budget- to hell with the budget - there's a puppy out there- Saddle up boyz - were goin flyin!

ROFLMAO!!!!!!!!!!!

Zeek, if nothing else, you have a terrific sense of humor.

 

[MetroSheriff]

*Yawn*. No, not really.

Yes, it really is.