Cherry Air slides one of the Runway

[pilotyip]

well can not trust Tony C

Do not PM Tony C; anything said to him in private will be posted as a public comment. In defense of my PM to him, I was informing him about the company's way it sells trips, we are not a scheduled air carrier, we are on-demand, we do not call in air crews to fly until we have trip booked, we are very conservative on where and when we will fly, it is part of our safety program. Our flight followers routinely tell sales it does not look like we can make that trip and sales turns the trip down. Attached is the PM I sent to Tony C.
"It worked like this, sales calls flight following and says can we sell a trip out of AOH tonight, flight follower checked the conditions and said I don't think we can do the trip. Sales was not sure of the trip, so they did not book it and let someone else take it."
Not only did he post a PM for public info, he editorialized it and added stuff that was not said in the PM

 

[TxPilot0878]

Take a look!

The other posts presented by Pilotyip happen to revolve around misfortune and bad luck Xfr8dog, and their inability to have Pilotyips forsight!!

Tex

 

[banned username 2]

Re: Welcome 80for80

R U a college grad? Not that you need to be to be a pilot, but your composition skills have been obviously polished in some institute of higher learning, one of those degrees that advances your aviation career by opening doors, PM Falcon Capt he knows all about that stuff.

Yeah, you'd better go to college or you'll end up as some washed out, 60 something flying for some rat a$$ed freight company for peanuts... PM PilotYIP, he knows all about that stuff.

Did I just say that out loud?!?!?

 

[TonyC]

Re: well can not trust Tony C

Do not PM Tony C; anything said to him in private will be posted as a public comment. In defense of my PM to him, I was informing him about the company's way it sells trips, we are not a scheduled air carrier, we are on-demand, we do not call in air crews to fly until we have trip booked, we are very conservative on where and when we will fly, it is part of our safety program. Our flight followers routinely tell sales it does not look like we can make that trip and sales turns the trip down. Attached is the PM I sent to Tony C.
"It worked like this, sales calls flight following and says can we sell a trip out of AOH tonight, flight follower checked the conditions and said I don't think we can do the trip. Sales was not sure of the trip, so they did not book it and let someone else take it."
Not only did he post a PM for public info, he editorialized it and added stuff that was not said in the PM

pilotyip:

I indulged you by reading one PM about this topic, and now I've endured another.

You were correct in asserting that I didn't understand the situation. Not knowing you personally, or the company or type of business that you're in, I did not understand the DECISION that was made to NOT take the flight. The way you described the dispatcher involvement in the decision added to the confusion I had. The way you worded the situation, it might lead a casual observer (including me) to think your dispatcher had absolute authority to send a crew or NOT, and the aircrew didn't participate in the dispatch decision. What is a more accurate description of the situation, as you helped clarify in your first PM, is that the decision-making process never got to the level of involving the crew. That is, the dispatcher rejected the trip from the start. I think I accurately reflected that process when I took the liberty of rewording your explanation of your company's actions - - that is, dispatchers decided NOT to take the trip. When you suggested that the pilots had no part in the decision-making process, you implied (or maybe we just incorrectly inferred) that you were talking about a DISPATCH decision, when in fact you were talking about a SALES decision.

Had the Sales department accepted the flight, I assure you, the pilots WOULD have participated in the decision-making process.

Now, I'm not real sure why you want to take this private, or insinuate that I'm doing something wrong by continuing this discussion in public, but since you seem to be sensitive to the issue, I'll not divulge the contents of the second PM.

However, I must inform you that you have also assumed incorrectly. FedEx is NOT a scheduled 121 carrier. Yeah, I know, that must seem amazing, and it boggles my mind, too. FedEx is a Supplemental carrier, enjoying the relaxed rest rules of Supplemental, and enjoying the less-stringent dispatch requirements of a Supplemental. That's right, our dispatchers are not required to be licensed, either. (Some are, but it's not required.) So, you see, I DO know what I'm talking about on the subject of joint responsibility for dispatch.

OH, and I can also say that there are very few areas of a flying operation that the FAA is NOT concerned about - - dispatching an airplane is NOT one of them.

IF you've gotten through THAT much of my response, allow me to summarize. You've bragged that your company turned down the trip, you've announced to this forum that someone else took the trip and screwed up, and now you're upset about the reaction to YOU? Do you really not understand why?

 

[TxPilot0878]

Give up!

Pilotyip, like I said you are obviously pissed because you got outbid!!!
No one makes it in this business unless they take everything they can! And to prove that...in March of last year when I was flying for Cherry "ya'll" took trips to places we as pilots and our dispatchers agreed were unsafe flying environments...so are you honestly saying that your company or YOU for that matter refuses flights...based on safety and overall complicance with regs/opspecs/and PIC authority??? Do ya'll sit there and discuss it and realize that the company could lose in the long run and safety is higher regard...instead of the bottom dollar? Last time I checked dispatcher don't go by the bible(FAR/AIM) but rather the boss breathing down their neck....saying "GET IT DONE!!!" That your position as a Capt. is regarded as supremacy and noone should ever question you???
Or do you happen to live in Reality which is 135 freight and fortunately for bragging rights your company didn't get the trip and so somehow....you can ride on the ghost "coat tails" of anothers mistake and show your superior knowledge the rest of us lack????????

Tex

 

[Gulfstream 200]

Pilotyip,

You know, its never too late to start an online degree through ERAU!

You MUST have tuition reimbursement at your employer?? right??

 

[WrightAvia]

thanks Tony for sharing information about FedEx. You learn something every day. I never knew that FedEx operates under supplimental regulation.

 

[TxPilot0878]

LAUGHING!!!!

Gulfstream200, "You kill me,...you really do!"

Tex

 

[Xfr8dog]

Pilotyip, like I said you are obviously pissed because you got outbid!!!

-TxPilot0878



curious... where did Cherry outbid us? It wasn't through Active Aero was it?

 

[TxPilot0878]

Uhhhh...what?

Never been underbid or lost a trip to someone else??? Sorry bro I musta been thinking of someone else!

~T

 

[inline]

Yip is your typical nonsched loser.

And I suppose you're a "sched winner?" You are absolutely clueless.

 

[pilotyip]

For Capt

You know I went to college and got couple degrees and still ended up in my present job, as posted to you in a PM I consider myself extremely lucky to be where I am, and love my job. We get 100's of resumes from pilots who would also lke to be here, that includes ex fortune 100 corp pilots, unemployed DAL, UAL, AA, and NWA pilots. They must all crazy.

 

[banned username 2]

Re: For Capt

You know I went to college and got couple degrees and still ended up in my present job, as posted to you in a PM I consider myself extremely lucky to be where I am, and love my job.

So why the uncalled for jab at me? Because I support higher education? Give me a break...

Remember the old saying... "Those whom live in glass houses... Shouldn't throw stones"... I wasn't even involved in this thread, until your smart-a$$ed comment came up. Those who know me, knew I wouldn't let that opportunity slide by. My position still stands.

 

[cruxx@9]

Pilot Yip,

With your entire 300+ hrs. in the falcon, you have obviously never been in this situation. You teach how to get out of a situation that you have never encountered.......(man do I wish I had TR's). Just yesterday, I used 6500 ft. of a 7500 ft. rwy. and that's not the first time the seat cushion was sucked half way up my a$$ as the snowy runway disappeared before my eyes. Thank God noone was hurt in the Cherry Air situation. If you had spent enough time flying this airplane in these conditions, you would have known not to post this thread. This very thing has happened at your airline, and will happen again. With my 3K+ hrs. in this airplane, by the grace of God it has not happened to me. I would like to think it is my superior airmanship........but I know better than that.

In this business, everyone including our licensed dispachers, have missed something they should have caught. This is where the Captain must stand his ground and refuse to fly into these conditions. We don't know what the crew of this flight knew when they where dispatched. This is an uncontrolled airport, where there are no braking action reports.

In these type of situations, we all second guess what happened and how we might have handled it differently. Hopefully you won't post about my next mistake from your 68 degree, climate controlled, office chair.

Keep 'em in the green

 

[pilotyip]

hey kid

Your guess isn't quite than good, I have more time than that in the DA-20, true not as much as you, but with 5000 TT you are still in the kiddie car range, If you want to go by A/C weight X's flight time you are not even out of grade school yet. Is that old enought to buy drink beer?, althought I have been know to share a beer minors, but they can not drink out of my bottle. BTW end of story the cargo from AOH was trucked to YIP as I understand and flown by your airline