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Challenger & Global Order. New planes for who?

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I heard that if Netjets would buy the Globals, Bombardier would through in FlexJet for free. As far as Chinese pilots do they even have any? They seem to do a lot of hiring over here!
 
Pervis -- I do not see having the Challenger 300 replacing the G200 and Falcon while still having the X/Ten. I have spent some time on the 300 and lots on the G200 and Falcon. The 300 is comfortable as a 8 pax. The X is an 8 pax, the Sovereign is an 8 pax. The newly designed fleet would need something which has a FA and is smaller/less expensive than a Global or GV. Just a guess -- I predict they go with a Legacy or something similar to replace the G200, DA-2000 and most of the G4s, but still have a few larger transcon jets. Most of the G4 owners are in it for the size and comfort (and some ego) but very few need the transcon performance. A Legacy can handle 13 in comfort going from TEB-PBI or TEB-Ski areas or TEB-St Maarten. The cost structure of the Legacy would appeal to most current G200 and DA2000 owners and give them more seats. And it is a step up in size from the X.
 
NJAowner said:
Pervis -- I do not see having the Challenger 300 replacing the G200 and Falcon while still having the X/Ten. I have spent some time on the 300 and lots on the G200 and Falcon. The 300 is comfortable as a 8 pax. The X is an 8 pax, the Sovereign is an 8 pax. The newly designed fleet would need something which has a FA and is smaller/less expensive than a Global or GV. Just a guess -- I predict they go with a Legacy or something similar to replace the G200, DA-2000 and most of the G4s, but still have a few larger transcon jets. Most of the G4 owners are in it for the size and comfort (and some ego) but very few need the transcon performance. A Legacy can handle 13 in comfort going from TEB-PBI or TEB-Ski areas or TEB-St Maarten. The cost structure of the Legacy would appeal to most current G200 and DA2000 owners and give them more seats. And it is a step up in size from the X.
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If the cost structure, comfort, etc. would appeal to G200 and F2000 owners, why wouldnt they all just go to flops where they already operate it (probably around for what nja operates an XL at?)
 
If the cost structure, comfort, etc. would appeal to G200 and F2000 owners, why wouldnt they all just go to flops where they already operate it (probably around for what nja operates an XL at?)

Maybe because they love the custom logo'd NJ playing cards?

JJ-- to get your facts straight, under its new pricing system FLOPs operates the X for what what NJA charges for the XLS, and the Legacy for about the costs of the X/G200.
 
NJAowner said:
If the cost structure, comfort, etc. would appeal to G200 and F2000 owners, why wouldnt they all just go to flops where they already operate it (probably around for what nja operates an XL at?)

Maybe because they love the custom logo'd NJ playing cards?

JJ-- to get your facts straight, under its new pricing system FLOPs operates the X for what what NJA charges for the XLS, and the Legacy for about the costs of the X/G200.
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Wrong again. I'll get back to you later with real facts when I have a free moment. Until then, you may want to change your post to sayve face. :)
 
JJ -- what are your numbers and what are their sources?

Actually for FLOPS $ according the the FLOPs "Fractional Operations Cost Worksheet, including 2011 CPI Adjustment", version 1/4/2011, and for NJ the costs come from bills I see, the costs are as follows for a 1/16th share:

FLPOS X - Monthly Mgmt Fee $9533, Occupied Hourly Fee $3289
FLOPS Legacy: MMF $12076, OHF $3280
NJ XLS: MMF $9770, OHF $2609

These numbers do not include the fuel baselines and estimate, war risk insurance and FET.

FLOPs numbers were given to me in a proposal from my salesman who has been trying to get me to switch to FLOPS for a while, If you get better pricing on the Legacy, please PM me the numbers. I may be interested.
 
NJAowner said:
JJ -- what are your numbers and what are their sources?

Actually for FLOPS $ according the the FLOPs "Fractional Operations Cost Worksheet, including 2011 CPI Adjustment", version 1/4/2011, and for NJ the costs come from bills I see, the costs are as follows for a 1/16th share:

FLPOS X - Monthly Mgmt Fee $9533, Occupied Hourly Fee $3289
FLOPS Legacy: MMF $12076, OHF $3280
NJ XLS: MMF $9770, OHF $2609

These numbers do not include the fuel baselines and estimate, war risk insurance and FET.

FLOPs numbers were given to me in a proposal from my salesman who has been trying to get me to switch to FLOPS for a while, If you get better pricing on the Legacy, please PM me the numbers. I may be interested.
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I see $2,444/hour for the flops CX hourly, not the $3,289 you mentioned (unless the $3,289 includes fuel). Looks like you can get a CX for less than the price of an XL (even less if you compare the speed Delta). Interesting to see if the price difference between programs is relatively proportional to the pilot salary/benefits difference. For that, they outta throw in naked lady playing cards. :)
http://www.flightoptions.com/programs/fractional-ownership.html
 
JJ - You are correct as I copied the wrong OHF for the FO X. FLying the X for the XL cost is what I said. You said an owner could fly the FO Legacy at the NJ XL costs and told me I was wrong and to go check my facts and "sayve face". I looks like you are agreeing with my numbers??
 
jonjuan said:
I see $2,444/hour for the flops CX hourly, not the $3,289 you mentioned (unless the $3,289 includes fuel). Looks like you can get a CX for less than the price of an XL (even less if you compare the speed Delta). Interesting to see if the price difference between programs is relatively proportional to the pilot salary/benefits difference. For that, they outta throw in naked lady playing cards. :)
http://www.flightoptions.com/programs/fractional-ownership.html
Click to expand...

yeah but Netjets is just a better place all around. You get what you pay for at NJ...The Best



be there
:)
 
Can we please get back to the topic at hand: How Flexjet is going to blow its own head off by selling globals to netjets...
 
6 Globals and esp 2 Challengers couldn't be enough for a company the size of NJA to start a new fleet type. Heck FR says we'd need at least 5 or 6 Globals at Flex to make it work. Netjets doesn't do anything half-assed so I don't see them doing this to put their toes in the water and feel the market, they're either all in or nothing. IF these are for Netjets they're either going to EJA, NJME, or a new China operation as managed aircraft. And managed aircraft is probably the only way we'll see Globals at Flex in the near future. That's just my opinion, I could be wrong.
 
ArtVandalay said:
Can we please get back to the topic at hand: How Flexjet is going to blow its own head off by selling globals to netjets...
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OK, first of all, FlexJet doesn't sell airplanes to anyone. They "buy" them just like CitationAir "buys" their jets from Cessna. FlexJet has absolutely NO say on who buys Challengers and Globals so please don't kid yourself and try to make it sound like FlexJet has any power whatsoever.

You also may want to consider the future of Flex...


Just sayin'
 
G200_PILOT said:
OK, first of all, FlexJet doesn't sell airplanes to anyone. They "buy" them just like CitationAir "buys" their jets from Cessna. FlexJet has absolutely NO say on who buys Challengers and Globals so please don't kid yourself and try to make it sound like FlexJet has any power whatsoever.

You also may want to consider the future of Flex...


Just sayin'
Click to expand...

That was very well thought out, thank you cause I wasn't aware.
 

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