CFI scared of 152s.

[jaxpilot]

I've got 3 students in our 1964 C-150D. It's starting to get fun now that I've got around 50 hours in it, real satisfying to do a good landing. It looks like crap inside and out, and sometimes during these hot, bumpy Florida days I could think of other airplanes I'd rather be in. And its real loud inside because the gap seals in the doors and windows are worn out and theres lots of engine and wind noise. But I can't deny that its a great trainer, never had any engine problems.

 

[Waldom]

No airplane is perfect, amigo. That includes a new 747-400 that just completed its acceptance flight at Renton or a 28 year-old 152. Part of being a professional pilot is taking the equipment provided and making it work while minimizing the risk involved.

And there most certainly is life-threatening risk involved anytime we operate ANY aircraft, be it an ultra-light or that Boeing I mentioned. If you can't come to terms with this fact in the Cessna, you will never be comfortable in an aircraft of any size.

This is not meant as a disparaging remark, but this profession is not for everyone. If you truly feel this way, I'm not sure you will be happy pursuing it.

 

[threegreen]

Well for starters the thing (152) only has one engine. A piston engine - there are actually EXPLOSIONS in the engine that are NEEDED to keep it running.

The wings are not solidly attached. They need 'struts' to hold them on. How ridiculous is that?

And don't even think of flying them in the clouds. Then again, maybe you should - at least then you can't see how far the fall will be.

Have fun.

 

[9GClub]

Aw don't bust the little guys

I love the '66 -150 that I fly, man! Kinda underpowered, but SWEET otherwise. It's one of the best trainers out there. You're certainly entitled to your likes and dislikes, but I'm a big fan of 'em. They're cheap too!

 

[Ill Mitch]

I don't know what kind of 152 you fly, hotshot. I sure as hell don't get those kind of numbers. And it sure hasn't been hot here, lately.

I do some side work teaching at a flight school. With two people, and a bunch-O-gas, we get what Kream quoted or better.

 

[jumppilot]

I'm a little anxious about flying 152s, and let's not b.s. each other, pretty much every 152 out there is a pile of sh*t. They're old, they're often not well maintained, and you're not going to make it out alive if you bounce too hard.

As a CFI, I've never been afraid of flying anything that's well maintained. I just have trouble getting into the 152s. I feel unsafe. There is nothing I can do about that. I know the risks of flying, and I know what me and the airplane are capable of. But when I close the cardboard door of that thing, I feel unprotected and exposed. The lawnmower engine doesn't help, either.

Anyways, any way to quell these fears or am I the only one on here that feels this way.

ummm, how about you stop being such a vag? The 152 is nothing more than a powered glider.

If you ever get hired by an airline, keep this fear to yourself.

 

[Huggyu2]

You could look into instructing in some of the new Light Sport Aircraft (LSA) on the market. There are schools popping up using them. I don't know much about it being a CFI, but the LSA's I've flown are a blast. Plus, you can put a BRS parachute on some of them.

 

[Airway]

Wow you guys are really something else. For a group of RJ FOs that spend their days pissing on each other for doing the same crappy job and "bringing the industry down," I think it's funny you'd pass judgments on me. Last thing I need is a bunch of disgruntles telling me what profession I should pursue. I'm pretty sure that out of the past 6 years of flying, me being a little uneasy flying our piles of crap 152s our flight school owns isn't going to deter me. Do you guys even do a preflight? Or is that for sissies, too?

I don't know what I have to say to make this clearer. I've flown all types of old metal. I've flown planes that looked and, well, flew like garbage, but I was never worried because we didn't have squawks like "engine quits at idle" or had daily mishaps with equipment or planes that wouldn't start more than once a day, or loose rivets and missing bolts. This is my experience with Cessna 152s (not only at our FBO, but several places), and when the last time I flew I couldn't get full RPM on takeoff or the time I had to grab the flap handle so the plane wouldn't automatically retract the flaps to zero on a go around...that scared me. If it wouldn't scare you, you've got a lot more problems than me.

Make no mistake, I genuinely feel that Cessna made a great product, but I don't think they should all be flying because they are "bulletproof." The older the plane gets, the more work and maintenance you have to put into it, and a lot of places just don't spend the time or money because it's not worth putting a coupla grand into an airplane that's barely worth 10K as it is.

When I teach, I'm responsible for creating a safe environment for my student, and, yes, me. Or else, I'd be doing both of us a disservice.

I can get over any claustrophobia that I might have. Personally, I don't think that's quite the whole story. I just don't like 'em. I'll fly 'em if I deem 'em airworthy before every flight I take, but they certainly aren't my plane of choice.

You know, my brother's a surgeon. He doesn't like to see people in pain. He should find another profession.

Some of y'all need to grow up or need a reality check.

 

[lowtimedriver]

Funny thing, I would like to fly freight, granted the airplanes don't fly like ours. I'm starting to wonder if it's maybe just our FBO's 152s that never work. Starting problems, radios always fail, creaky everything. I don't know.

If your 152's look like the 152's at the flight school at KAJO, I feel for you. The 152 looks like a sardine can with wings. My CFI was just hired by Skywest and he was the best CFI at the flight school at CRQ. He hated 152's. He thought they were little piles of chit.

 

[bubbers44]

C150/152 is probably one of the most forgiving easy to fly airplanes you will ever fly. After hundreds of hours instructing in it I never had a problem. A little tight but very forgiving. I could let my students get totally in a mess landing and one rudder kick and a nudge on the wheel fixed it.

 

[jumppilot]

Some of y'all need to grow up or need a reality check.

Indeed. Grab your testicles and lets go flying.

I want to work on power on stalls, or is that too much?

 

[nosehair]

The only time I've ever been scared in an airplane was in a 150152. I will not teach in one. But, of course that's in Colorado where the little power plant feels much, much smaller. I have no problem with them at sea level airports.

Hey! I thought they had an AD restricting them from making Take-Offs in Colorado.

 

[coloneldan]

Hey! I thought they had an AD restricting them from making Take-Offs in Colorado.

I saw a 150 in Leadville CO once. (10,000 msl) It had a few mods though. There was a TSIO-550 on the nose, a J-85 in the tail, complete with afterburner, and there were JATO bottles duct taped to the fuselage. Had a right nice climb rate. :nuts:

 

[RichardRambone]

I didn't care for the 172 after flying the 152. It's (the 152) a better training platform for a student and doesn't drive like a truck.

Hahahaha! A 172 drives like a truck ehhhh......

 

[dseagrav]

I was under the impression that if you were claustrophobic and ended up in a 152 you could just open the window and stick your head out the side, because it's so slow the wind is not a factor. (Just watch out for bugs.)

152s are cool, and by cool I mean totally sweet. It's easy to put into the hangar when I'm done with it. I just pick it up and carry it inside. It's also very easy to steer. With enough aileron you don't need any rudder input to take off, which is good because it means I don't have to bother adjusting the seat. On windy days it's perfectly safe - If the engine fails, we turn into the wind, and the airplane will hover. Loading lots of luggage for a flight in the 152 is a breeze. You just put everything in suitcases, lock the suitcases so nothing happens to them, take the suitcases to fedex and give them to the lady behind the counter, then go to the airport and get your airplane. By the time you get to your destination the bags will already be there! And it doesn't cost you any fuel, either.

 

[j41driver]

Just watch out for bugs...

...smacking you in the back of the head.

:laugh:

 

[81Horse]

Hahahaha! A 172 drives like a truck ehhhh......

But it does -- just like one of these: http://www.pre67vw.co.uk/classifieds/uploaded/large/331.jpg

 

[iflyjets4food]

I've flown 152's in three different places. The place I first flew them had great maintenance. The airplanes were kept in about as new condition as is possible for a 28 year old airplane. I flew a 152 from Aero-Tech in Lexington. It was in decent condition. Not as pristine as the one I flew in the first place, but it flew great. Then I went and flew the 152s at KHUF. Those were some of the worst airplanes I ever saw or flew. Transponders falling out of the dash, maintenance squawks being signed off as fixed and finding the item still broken next time I got in, and radios on the fritz every time we got in. I think the 152 design was a good one, but some people have not given them the TLC that is required for an airplane that is old. You are a responsible adult who I'm sure is capable of making your own decisions. Best of luck in this one. The 152 is a great airplane, but some folks just don't like them. It doesn't make anyone less or greater than anyone else.

 

[Waldom]

Airway, some of these posts (including mine) were meant to be constructive.

Like any airplane, the Cessna 152 has limitations. Because it is a light airplane, it has lots of them. The design has proven to be well suited to the role it was meant for, but there's nothing wrong with just not liking the airplane.

Your initial post left the impression that you doubted the structural integrity of the aircraft and that you were consequently left with a fear of the act of flying. Subsequent posts have revealed the very tangible problem of an operator who's lack of maintenance leaves the aircraft in an unairworthy condition.

I have been in that situation myself and finally recognize the feeling you describe in your first post. I believe it is caused by the stress created when the desire to pursue a career you love and the need to eat comes in conflict with the feeling that you are compromising your integrity. Your statement regarding your responsibility for your student's safety demonstrates your integrity.

There is only one cure for it, and its a tough one. After taking the cure though, you will not only feel much better but also be a more self-assured and confident aviator.

Go to the boss today and express your concern that the poor quality of the maintenance has reached the point that the aircraft are unairworthy. Express your willingness to do anything you can to improve the situation. You have a responsibility to your students, yourself, and even your boss to do this. In a perfect world, the boss would appreciate your honesty and professionalism and know that improving this situation is in everyone's best interest. But we both know that he or she has already made a conscious decision to operate the aircraft in this condition and is not likely to change. If the person indicates that is the case, give them your two week notice.

Doing this without another job already lined up is a very hard thing to do. But when you walk out of there you will feel a great weight lifted off your shoulders. You now have the knowledge to accurately access the quality of your next prospective employer and the peace of knowing that your conscience will stop bothering you.

Or maybe I'm way off base and your concerns were the result of indigestion caused by the bean burrito you happened to have for lunch that day.

I actually do have a desire to help. My previous post was sincere and was not meant to deflate your ego or pump up mine.

 

[CrimsonEclipse]

It would be perfect if it had a pull starter.

A J-3 without electrical system still beats all.
(electrical start is for wussies)

CE