CFI and ATP written test

[sjflyer]

In order to take the CFI/FOI and ATP written test do you need an endorsement from an instructor?


Thanks

SJFLYER

 

[PA-44Typed]

Not for the 1st time, only if you need a to retake one of them.

 

[bobbysamd]

CFI written endorsements

According to AC 61-65D, CFI students need a signoff to take the written:

6. COMPLETION OF GROUND TRAINING OR A HOME STUDY CURRICULUM . . . . Any one of the following methods may be used by the student to show evidence of ground school or home study curriculum completion.

b. An endorsement from an appropriately rated FAA-certificated ground or flight instructor who has certified the applicant has satisfactorily completed the ground training required for the certificate or rating sought and is prepared for the test . . . .

e. . . . .An applicant . . . . may present an individually developed home study course to an appropriately rated flight or ground instructor. The instructor will review the course materials and may question the applicant to determine that the course was completed and that the applicant does possess the knowledge required for the certificate or rating sought. The instructor will then complete an endorsement certifying that the applicant is prepared for the knowledge test.

(emphasis added)

"e" is what I did all the time for my students who wanted to take the ground instructor written(s).

And you need a signoff to take the FOI written as well. Here's the recommended signoff:

23. Fundamentals of instructing knowledge test: §§ 61.183(d) and 61.185(a)(1)

I certify that (First name, MI, Last name) has received the required fundamentals of instruction training of
§ 61.185(a)(1).

You do not need a signoff to take the ATP written. You do have to show up at FSDO with your current First Class Medical and your logbooks to document that you've met the time requirements to obtain the slip of paper authorizing you to take the ATP written.

Hope that helps.

 

[Cardinal]

That's intersting, because I took the CFIA and FOI both without an endorsement. Now I'll have to figure out how I did that...

 

[bobbysamd]

Non-endorsed CFI-A and FOI written-taking

The AC did talk about people who receive graduation certificates from ground schools. Did you receive one of those? I understand that people who obtain John and Martha tapes can take their writtens after watching the tapes without signoffs. I was just quoting from the AC that set forth the requirements for those who need signoffs - and I still believe that they are required.

 

[troy]

In the 61-65D, there is an endorsement for the FOI, but not for the FIA test. I just needed the FOI endorsement.....

 

[seattle]

I just passed both CFI written tests without so much as a peep from an instructor. I saw the AC61-65D text and still can't reconsile it. Maybe there's something in FAR 61 about this?

Seattle

 

[wanabe_fo]

FOI Endorsment

The FOI endorsment was added in 2002. Prior to that none was required. A CFI student actually brought this to my attention when he was getting ready for the FOI in Mar of 2002

 

[Catbert]

In order to take the CFI/FOI and ATP written test do you need an endorsement from an instructor?

The short answer is no.

An endorsement stating that the student is prepared for the test is not required for the first attempt at either exam. The following is from John Lynch's part 61 FAQ (1688k Word doc) (5377k Adobe pdf) at the FAA Regulatory Support Division site. Bold emaphasis was added by me.

Ref. §61.35 and §61.183. There was no change in policy. Although there was a major revision of Title 14 CFR part 61 effective August 4, 1997, the requirements for taking the ATP, flight instructor (CFI & CFII), fundamentals of instruction (FOI), military competency (MC), foreign pilot instrument (IFP) or the certificated ground instructor (CGI) knowledge test did not change. Unlike the requirements for some airmen certifications under §§ 61.65(a)(4), 61.96(b)(5)(ii), 61.103(d)(2), and 61.123(c)(2) that clearly require for eligibility an endorsement certifying the applicant is prepared for the appropriate knowledge test, applicants are not required to provide an instructor endorsement of preparation to take the ATP, CFI & CFII, FOI, MC, IFP or the CGI knowledge tests. Section 61.183(d) states that to be eligible for a flight instructor certificate or rating a person must have “a logbook endorsement from an authorized instructor on the fundamentals of instructing listed in §61.185(a)(1) of this part appropriate to the required knowledge test.” The regulation does not require that the endorsement state that the applicant is “prepared” for the test; instead it simply requires a certification that instruction has been received. When the applicant applies for an initial flight instructor practical test, an examiner must ensure that the applicant has received the logbook endorsement required under § 61.83(d), but the logbook endorsement does not need to be presented to take the knowledge test. However, we do note that in accordance with § 61.49, if an applicant is reapplying to take the knowledge test after failing, an instructor endorsement is required. Paragraph 5. b. of the Advisory Circular (AC) 61-65D also relates this information.

Like cardinal and seattle above, I was not asked for any endorsements before taking the tests. Nor should I have been as shown on page 5 of the FAA Airman Knowledge Testing Authorization Requirements Matrix (57k pdf), which is the document used by Computer Test Designees (like CATS and LaserGrade) for guidance.

 

[Capthuff]

Bobby??

You said
"You do not need a signoff to take the ATP written. You do have to show up at FSDO with your current First Class Medical and your logbooks to document that you've met the time requirements to obtain the slip of paper authorizing you to take the ATP written"

Are you saying you need to go to the FSDO to get permission to take the written? or even the Practical?

Maybe you are guilty of a typo.

And why do you need a first class medical?

Cappy