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Capital Cargo

khsgt

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Hey Guys,
I'm looking for some information on Capital Cargo. I have looked for a copy of the contract or pay rates and I have been unable to find one. How happy is the pilot group and how are you treated by the company? Positive Corporate environment? Any help would be greatly appreciated and any tips on getting in would be great!
 

Midnight Flyer

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I'm generally happy. The company compensates and treats you fair, unlike alot of other airlines. For instance, I have numerous buddies flying for the regionals and they are all treated like trash. To add insult to injury, they're also paid not even half of what they're worth.
That's not the case here. Most cappy pilots don't go to work mad and don't hate the company. Of course you do have your typical whiners, but then you have those types everywhere (I've heard fedex capt's bitching about the pay and schedule with fedex, so go figure) I guess it's all relative. I think freight is a little more stable right now as opposed to passenger flying.
There is a little uncertainty in the air right now, because rumor says that BAX (the company that Capital contracts for) was bought by TNT trucking, and nobody seems to know an awful lot about TNT. We don't know if BAX will continue to contract with us.
 

mrvmo

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You may need that KY at Capital as they have a $12,000-$15000 training contract (somewhere in that range) to train you as an F/O..............and no type.
 

Midnight Flyer

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Think of it like this; you're not paying anything unless you quit, then it's only prorated. And in the current state of this industry, where ya gonna go, UPS? I don't know of too many people who actually left for a better job. The guys who have quit in the past are people who have been trying for years to get on with airlines like Jet Blue or something.

Cappy's not a bad place to work. It's way better than all the regionals. You never see people leaving here to go to work for a regional, but we have alot of guys who quit the regionals to come over here.
 

mrvmo

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Many have left for greener pastures in the past two years and have found them. The amount of that contract.........even having a training contract at all, and without even getting a type is very shady. As far as your regional comparison, yea I'll give you that. The schedule there is not bad.
 

Midnight Flyer

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I can count the pilots on one hand who have quit for a better job over the last 2 years (not including the Delta recalls, retirements, people getting fired, etc).

I think one reason for the contract is because some newhires are excited about flying a 727, but when it comes down to it and they're on the line, they can't handle the lifestyle or can't handle working nights, so they quit, after the company has invested time and money in training them. They just want you to stay awhile.
 

mrvmo

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Let's just put it this way. If it was a great place to work, a training contract wouldn't be necessary because nobody would be leaving. Capital is one of the ONLY airlines left that do this stuff. That should tell you something. You can rationalize this contract any way you choose. But in the end it is Bulls^$t, and everybody who is thinking about getting involved with these guys should know about it before interviewing because for many it will be a dealbreaker.

PS For all who work at Capital and enjoy it I bring no harm!
 

Midnight Flyer

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I'm not really rationalizing or saying the contract is right, I just understand why the company requires you to sign one, that's all. Personally, I hate training contracts as much as the next guy. I didn't want to sign it either, but I'd rather sign it and have a job as opposed to not signing it and be on the streets still looking for a job.

I agree, training contracts are going away, but every flying job I've ever had required you to sign one, even a large regional that I was with 10 years ago had a training contract, so I just go with it.

Us pilots are already stressed out enough about the uncertainty of our industry. Life is too short to try and fight the things that you will never have any control over.

I do agree that pilots interviewing with Capital need to be made aware of the contract before they interview...like you said, it is a dealbreaker for some folks.

If it makes anybody feel better, I've never heard of pilots quitting and having to pay their balance. Most pilots you talk to say that they've heard the contract doesn't stand up in a court of law and is not enforcable. I personally am not an attorney and I have never tried to get out of a contract, so I don't know for sure.
However, I'm sure the company would wind up paying more in legal fees than what it's worth to take you to court to sue for their money.
 

Midnight Flyer

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I agree with tgates.
A 2 year committment isn't that long in this industry... Why would somebody turn away a job where you get to fly a 727, upgrade quckly and make a decent living while flying a good schedule.

The only place people would go from here would be Fedex, UPS, JetBlue, Continental, AirTran, SouthWest, etc

A lateral move would be Gemini, Kalletta, TradeWinds, ExpressNet, etc... Yes, some people do leave for those airlines. Personally, I don't think it's worth starting all over, going through initial newhire training, learning a new airplane and loosing your seniority just to make $200-$300 more a paycheck.

Seniority has it's benefits and also it's nice that the company buys you a ticket on a major airline to travel you to and from work.

I don't know, it seems like the people who bitch about the training contract are the same people who never stick around anyway, and just want to "use" the company for a free type rating then jump ship. I guess the training bond is good for attracting the people who are really interested in staying and having a positive attitude.
 

khsgt

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Guys thanks for all the responses. I have recently been offered a LOR there and I have been researching the company to decide if I want to apply. After looking into it, I believe Capital is a decent airline and the kind of place I would like to go. The two year training contract is a non issue because I have the intention of staying and upgrading there if possible. I'm a current regional 121 CA with 3000 TT and 1000 Turbine PIC, do I stand a chace at getting in with those kind of hours and a LOR? How much hiring is Capital doing and what is projected in the near future (6-8 months). What is causing the hiring, is it attrition or growth? Any tips or suggestions would be greatly appreciated!
 

Midnight Flyer

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khsgt said:
Guys thanks for all the responses. I have recently been offered a LOR there and I have been researching the company to decide if I want to apply. After looking into it, I believe Capital is a decent airline and the kind of place I would like to go. The two year training contract is a non issue because I have the intention of staying and upgrading there if possible. I'm a current regional 121 CA with 3000 TT and 1000 Turbine PIC, do I stand a chace at getting in with those kind of hours and a LOR? How much hiring is Capital doing and what is projected in the near future (6-8 months). What is causing the hiring, is it attrition or growth? Any tips or suggestions would be greatly appreciated!


I'd have to agree with tgates, hiring is for attrition.
We aren't growing too much...however, we just got an additional city, Huntsville.

There was word put out last week within the pilot ranks looking for people who want to become checkairmen. I don't know if that means they're anticipating alot of upcoming training or what.
Remember, our parent company (capital holdings) owns several 767's, so who knows what will happen there. They are flying now, just not at Capital Cargo (the owner has leased them to other operators).
CCIA is a good place to work, and your times seem competitive. There have been some people wash out of training, but that's true where ever you go.

This is not a large airline and the training department isn't anything similar to that of a legacy carrier that's had the ability to refine their curriculum and teaching techniques over a long period of time. That being said, you're on your own during class with this airline. They do not spoon feed you. The class I was in, for the most part, was self taught. Half of us had prior 727 experience which helped GREATLY, but one of 2 guys did not, and we spent lots of time after class helping those guys, and they did make it.

If you get a class date, let me know and I'll either post or PM you the Limitations. If you learn those now and get that crap out of the way, you can better spend your time learning the systems once you're in class.
 

DAL737FO

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You can do a lot worse than Cappy. I'm one of the one's that went back to Delta when recalled. If I would have stayed, I would have upgraded right around the year mark. They have a lot of good people there and I stay in touch with many of them. Under the old contract, they are still in negotiations, a First Officer will make about $50k with per diem and bonuses.

I will also say this Peter F. the owner of Capital lived up to his end of the bargain while I was at Cappy. His saying is "Your priorities in life should be your God, your family and then Capital cargo". When the hurricanes hit us last year he sent all the Florida based crews home to take care of their families. No pay was docked and he ate the airline tickets to get us home.

Now don't get me wrong, flying sixteen day rotations is hard. Flying sixteen day night freight rotations can be brutal. You have to go into this job with your eyes wide open.
 

Capt1124

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I haven't been around that part of the industry for several years but one company I worked for shared a room in the trailer at Dayton with Capital. I jumpseated on them once. For that segment of the industry it's quite good- they seemed to have nice airplanes, good quality pilots, and gave the impression of being a decently run outfit, not your typical slimeball freight company.

Still, a 12,000 or more training contract with no type rating seems awfully high. A year would not be unreasonable, but two years?
 

bobs98tlr

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Hey Midnight Flyer...i see Cappy guys sometimes come into the FBO i work at when you guys fly into RFD. If your ever there walk a building or two to the North (big white hanger) and ask for me (Bobby). Ill show you some of the toys in the hanger..;). Normally its a flight in from TOL and back out to TOL. See ya..
 

PHXFLYR

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I will also say this Peter F. the owner of Capital lived up to his end of the bargain while I was at Cappy. His saying is "Your priorities in life should be your God, your family and then Capital cargo". When the hurricanes hit us last year he sent all the Florida based crews home to take care of their families. No pay was docked and he ate the airline tickets to get us home.

This was the nicest thing I have ever read on this webboard. Nice to see an
airline manager who knows what the real priorities in life are!:)


PHXFLYR:cool:
 

Midnight Flyer

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bobs98tlr said:
Hey Midnight Flyer...i see Cappy guys sometimes come into the FBO i work at when you guys fly into RFD. If your ever there walk a building or two to the North (big white hanger) and ask for me (Bobby). Ill show you some of the toys in the hanger..;). Normally its a flight in from TOL and back out to TOL. See ya..
is that the hangar with all those high performance props are? I think ive been there..probably talked to you and didn't even know it.

Take care
 

PCL_128

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I don't know why some of you guys are making a big deal out of the training contract. Cappy is headquartered in Orlando, FL. Florida is a right-to-work state, and therefore the training contract isn't worth the paper it's printed on. You could leave just one day after finishing training and there isn't a dang thing the company can do about it. From the things I've heard about Cappy management, I doubt they'd be the kind to pursue it anyway. Besides, it shouldn't be an issue unless you're planning on screwing the company by leaving so soon.
 

PHXFLYR

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Seems to me a schedule like this could be a little rough on family life and
life away from the airport. No?


PHXFLYR
 

khsgt

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Guys, out of curiosity, I have a few questions. How many hours do you guys fly on an average month? Could I get somebody to post a payscale for FO's and CA's under the current contract. What is the predicted upgrade right now? Thanks guys!!!!
 
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