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CAL/UAL merger statistics

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CRJ's suck

Well-known member
Joined
Aug 5, 2005
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105
Found this CAL/UAL merger info on another website.
Although I don't know how much of it is factual, it's pretty interesting reading none the less.

Sorry, I meant "possible" merger between CAL/UAL.
 
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Interesting comparison. The one thing that's changed is that Continental now has a larger market cap, effectively putting us in the driver's seat if this merger goes down.
 
Mr.B said:
Spoken like a true USAir Eastie.
Click to expand...

Spoken like a true ass.

I actually want to see a fair integration of our two seniority lists if this poop sandwich goes down. I want our management in the driver's seat because your airline's "leadership" couldn't manage their way out of a wet paper sack.

Thanks for the random insult, though.
 
A fair integration of the AWA/AAA seniority list already occured.

OK, I know USAPA will impose DOH, because thats just the way it is supposed to be.

You all knew DOH was not part of ALPA meger policy, so why did you legally agree to the process?
 
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LJDRVR said:
Spoken like a true ass.

I actually want to see a fair integration of our two seniority lists if this poop sandwich goes down. I want our management in the driver's seat because your airline's "leadership" couldn't manage their way out of a wet paper sack.

Thanks for the random insult, though.
Click to expand...

Based on your previous comments you seem to careless about fairness and use Market Cap as a sole determiner of who should be more senior. I have no dog in this fight but based on UAL performance and dark future I would put CAL way above you guys in most aspects.
 
How about we go back to the good old ways of the US of A...

Capitalism.

If an airline can not be run to the point of sustainability... it goes out of business.

After that, there is an acquisition of assets. Whoever wants to buy the piece, so be it.

Look, I'm all for helping out fellow Union Brothers and Sisters. But there also comes a time where you have to realize that people need to play the hand that they are dealt.

If the CAL/UAL merger were to happen, and the CAL work rules were applied, there will be furloughs. I'm out on the street. While a UAL pilot still has his job. How is that fair when my company was holding it's head above water while the competition was drowning before the merger?
 
No, the competition had an 86-87 year old life preserver.

Easy solution. Staple all scabs and make them pay their back dues.
 
LJDRVR said:
Interesting comparison. The one thing that's changed is that Continental now has a larger market cap, effectively putting us in the driver's seat if this merger goes down.
Click to expand...

That didn't last long. Market cap = price/share x shares outstanding. Using today's closing prices:
CAL= $16.04 x 98.00M = $1.57B
UAUA = $13.95 x 118.99M = $1.66B

Does this mean that, as of today, UAUA is back in the driver's seat? Market cap is not a measure of who's in charge of a merger.

You're also ignoring the fact that due to the DAL/NWA merger, CAL is going to be effectively frozen out of SkyTeam. In order for them to continue to expand internationally, they need to join the Star Alliance or One World.
Ask Kellner or any of the rest of CAL senior management how much they're concerned over their future in SkyTeam.
 
Andy said:
That didn't last long. Market cap = price/share x shares outstanding. Using today's closing prices:
CAL= $16.04 x 98.00M = $1.57B
UAUA = $13.95 x 118.99M = $1.66B

Does this mean that, as of today, UAUA is back in the driver's seat? Market cap is not a measure of who's in charge of a merger.

You're also ignoring the fact that due to the DAL/NWA merger, CAL is going to be effectively frozen out of SkyTeam. In order for them to continue to expand internationally, they need to join the Star Alliance or One World.
Ask Kellner or any of the rest of CAL senior management how much they're concerned over their future in SkyTeam.
Click to expand...

Good post.
 
Max Powers said:
Based on your previous comments you seem to careless about fairness and use Market Cap as a sole determiner of who should be more senior. I have no dog in this fight but based on UAL performance and dark future I would put CAL way above you guys in most aspects.
Click to expand...

???

Max, your reading comprehension needs some work. I don't believe I've ever posted anything related to market cap and I work for CAL.

Regarding who's going to be in control, my choice is for Continental to run the show. Not because I think that will enable our pilot group to come out on top, but because our management team actually knows how to run an airline. (Don't anybody get their panties in a wad, that's a true statement and I'm not insulting line United employees, but their criminally inept "leaders".)

A combined UAL/CAL with Larry Kellner and Jeff Smisek at the helm, would be the world's largest airline, with the best route structure and network. Although the process would be very painful, our combined airline would be the proverbial 800 pound Gorilla. (Not only the biggest, but the only one with a real plan and the ability to compete and win.)

As far as the seniority list integration goes, we can get ourselves all worked up with the details, but a deal hasn't been announced yet and I'm confident that if it is, our MEC's will come to a solution where nobody gets hosed too badly.

I would love to see a group of United pilots with the opportunity to again work at a carrier where they can be proud of the product and their leaders. I think the influx of their pilots and culture would make this a better place to work than it already is. I would be proud to share a cockpit with any of y'all. (I'm just hoping it doesn't happen, I like CAL the way it is, and I'd like to get our contract fixed.)

Tilton needs to go away with nothing but his last paycheck withheld and a restraining order.

PS - Whoever said staple the SCABS? Very interesting.:D
 
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Hey Andy,

Are you in contact with any of your MEC on property, wondering about furlough numbers, IF ANY? Hopefully none, but IF the merger goes on, I'd imagine the #'s would be split on both sides. Just wondering, I saw you thought you'd be out next year. I hope NONE comes to fruition, but if Prater has his way, we'll all have to give back 40% and work all FAR's, no work rules, along with furloughing everyone EXCEPT his greedy friends? Thanks
 
Maybe there's one silver lining.
At least now the CAL scabs who have gotten a pass all these years will get to work side by side with members of one of the more militant ALPA pilot groups. Plenty of names to add to the UAL "list". Never forget.
 
motch said:
How is that fair when my company was holding it's head above water while the competition was drowning before the merger?
Click to expand...

It's not, which is why integration should heavily favor career expectations. I'm pretty none of the recently hired pilots at UAL expect to upgrade within five years.
 
LJDRVR said:
It's not, which is why integration should heavily favor career expectations. I'm pretty none of the recently hired pilots at UAL expect to upgrade within five years.
Click to expand...

Your (and our) career projections from 6 months ago are worthless now. Just the way it is. Not saying Continental doesn't have better prospects than UA, but I promise you will be looking at cancelled orders, block hour decrease, and maybe even furloughs. We all are.

Your argument reminds me of what we felt at UA when USAir was announced only 8 yrs ago. We had 2.5 yr Captains. Our ESOP money was going to be used to buy a floundering carrier, and it would hurt our own advancement.

We felt angry, because we were so smart to be at our carrier, and they were obviously fools to be at theirs. (Sarcasm intended).

Just asking that you look at history; many of the great airlines are now dust. Don't think that the same won't happen at Continental, or even Southwest for that matter. So, be careful when you say that you should get the better end of the deal because Continental is "stronger".
Karma is a b!tch, and she always comes back around...
 
MountainFreak said:
Karma is a b!tch, and she always comes back around...
Click to expand...

I bring up career expectations and now I'm in for a heap of bad juju? :rolleyes:

Read my post carefully, Sir. I was very tactful, the only thing I said that was the least bit conceited is that we are better run. (Which is true, and believe me, I know it could swing the other way.) I said several nice things about my peers at UAL.

I'm a historian of our profession and am well aware what could happen to any of us.

How about we quit taking potshots at each other, when management is the enemy?

Take Care,

LJDRVR

PS - As far as career expectations go, I'm not sure what you're getting at. We lost 82M 1st quarter, but only because we spent 209M on LHR slots. We may be getting rid of some older 737's, but those are going to be replaced by 800's, 900's and 777's.
 

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