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Busiest Airspace in USA?
- Thread starter Delta3
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cpritchie5
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ShawnC
Skirts Will Rise
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I also have heard that the DAB, and ORL area is the busiest for GA traffic. It makes sense since we have ERAU (and the many other FBOs at DAB), ATA, Comair, and those are just to name the big places.
On top of that Central Florida has many smaller private airports, including Spruce Creek, and Jumble Air.
On top of that Central Florida has many smaller private airports, including Spruce Creek, and Jumble Air.
There is some single-runway GA airport south of Denver that I had thought was the busiest.
Addison (KADS) was one of the busiest for a long time but I think it has since dropped off. It's still very busy, though. I've had to hold short for 15-20 minutes on numerous occasions. I've never departed during "rush hour" but I have come in, once, during that time. Was VERY busy with a solid line of planes coming in and each of the three taxiway "queues" full of biz jets and small GA props.
Addison (KADS) was one of the busiest for a long time but I think it has since dropped off. It's still very busy, though. I've had to hold short for 15-20 minutes on numerous occasions. I've never departed during "rush hour" but I have come in, once, during that time. Was VERY busy with a solid line of planes coming in and each of the three taxiway "queues" full of biz jets and small GA props.
Hovernut
Home Based Again!
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Orlando
ATC asked my flight school to schedule our IFR traffic outside of their peak periods because they ran out of controller positions! We're also getting our own call sign to help keep the radio chatter down a bit....hard to get a word in edgewise!
Orlando Class B also got a VOR-to-Nowhere approach for participating flight schools to help out the bizjet guys at ORL. We were saturating that poor airport, too.
Sanford, SFB now has 747s coming in from across the pond. Pretty wild seeing a 152 in trail of one of those beasts! At 9600', our lil' airport must look like a short field to one of those guys!
ATC asked my flight school to schedule our IFR traffic outside of their peak periods because they ran out of controller positions! We're also getting our own call sign to help keep the radio chatter down a bit....hard to get a word in edgewise!
Orlando Class B also got a VOR-to-Nowhere approach for participating flight schools to help out the bizjet guys at ORL. We were saturating that poor airport, too.
Sanford, SFB now has 747s coming in from across the pond. Pretty wild seeing a 152 in trail of one of those beasts! At 9600', our lil' airport must look like a short field to one of those guys!
ShawnC
Skirts Will Rise
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Hovernut, you should see me coming into MCO, the controllers are pretty nice and work me in, its kind of cool as you are riding down the ILS in IMC and all of the sudden a 10,000+ ft runway pops out of the clouds, that thing looks titanic to a pilot he thought that Daytonas 7L was long.
ORL is just plain nuts on a Saturday, I remember going there to get some pilot supplies, our return flight was to the glider port. The total flight was .7, the thing was the glider port was maybe 10 miles away.
ORL is just plain nuts on a Saturday, I remember going there to get some pilot supplies, our return flight was to the glider port. The total flight was .7, the thing was the glider port was maybe 10 miles away.
beezlebozo
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cessna_driver2
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501261
Consigliere
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Let's not forget Teteboro, NJ and the New York Approach area. 4 of the World's busiest airports are within 20 miles of each other. JFK, LGA, EWR, and TEB.
You are correct that SOCAL is the busiest TRACON, however they are also the largest (area wise) TRACON operating from San Diego to Santa Barbara.
I believe you are correct in stating that VNY is the busiest GA airport in the world. SMO is also right up there.
I believe that (I'm on the road, no info) Scottsdale, AZ is the 2nd busiest single runway airport in the US (SMO is 1). It gets most of the corporate traffic going into Phoenix and a lot of Flight Schools are based there.
Shaun3000, I think the airport you are referring to is Denver Centennial (APA), it's got 3 runways, but is a very busy airspace since it gets most of the corporate traffic going to Denver and also has numerous flight schools.
How about Houston Center during the Summer T-Storm season, I seem to be constantly amazed at how well they handle all the reroutes and deviations.
As always, ATC normally does a great job handling these all busy airspaces, flying in and out of them is a very easy if you do a little homework and plan ahead. Remember to look at the whole airspace and not just your planned route. It makes it easier for everybody when you filed for the LEESE arrival, then 100 miles out they give you "Direct Jesup and the remainder of the BITHO7) that you know where Jesup is.
You are correct that SOCAL is the busiest TRACON, however they are also the largest (area wise) TRACON operating from San Diego to Santa Barbara.
I believe you are correct in stating that VNY is the busiest GA airport in the world. SMO is also right up there.
I believe that (I'm on the road, no info) Scottsdale, AZ is the 2nd busiest single runway airport in the US (SMO is 1). It gets most of the corporate traffic going into Phoenix and a lot of Flight Schools are based there.
Shaun3000, I think the airport you are referring to is Denver Centennial (APA), it's got 3 runways, but is a very busy airspace since it gets most of the corporate traffic going to Denver and also has numerous flight schools.
How about Houston Center during the Summer T-Storm season, I seem to be constantly amazed at how well they handle all the reroutes and deviations.
As always, ATC normally does a great job handling these all busy airspaces, flying in and out of them is a very easy if you do a little homework and plan ahead. Remember to look at the whole airspace and not just your planned route. It makes it easier for everybody when you filed for the LEESE arrival, then 100 miles out they give you "Direct Jesup and the remainder of the BITHO7) that you know where Jesup is.
Five-O Pilot
Member
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- Apr 24, 2002
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- 6
KAPA (Centennial)
I recently had a conversation with two tower controllers from Denver Centennial (APA) during which they made the statement that APA is the 2nd busiest GA airport in the country. They also said that one of the SOCAL airports is #1, but I can't remember which one.
I don't know what they base their numbers on, but after training at Centennial (PVT -- CFI's), I can definitely believe it!
5-O
I recently had a conversation with two tower controllers from Denver Centennial (APA) during which they made the statement that APA is the 2nd busiest GA airport in the country. They also said that one of the SOCAL airports is #1, but I can't remember which one.
I don't know what they base their numbers on, but after training at Centennial (PVT -- CFI's), I can definitely believe it!
5-O
wingnutt
...recognize this?
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man...ive been thru Orlando numerous times in various single-engines, and havent caught half of the grief that i get going in/out of Houston in a baron. if you arent sitting on a jet engine your treated like the proverbial red-headed step-child down there. they may not be the busiest technically speaking, but they sure act like they are!!!
ShawnC
Skirts Will Rise
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I.P. Freley
I like people food
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Hmmmm....
All this talk about California and Florida, and there's practically no mention of any NY airport outside of the biggies. Teterboro was mentioned, but I'm afraid that Republic Airport (FRG), aka-Farmingdale, beats out Teterboro by a country mile. The guys in the FRG tower told me that they had about 220,000 total aircraft movements per year, and that ranks it as third in the state behind JFK and LGA (though I am not sure what order those two would be ranked as). GA airports in the northeast are always going to suffer in yearly totals when compared to airports in SoCal because of the inevitable number of IFR days that one experiences.
In any case, that place was a total horror show in the summer. It was not unusual to be #8 or 9 for callback to get in on a weekend afternoon, and once I orbited over a VOR for forty minutes waiting for my number to come up... Not to mention being one of 7, 8, 12 aircraft in the pattern... Downwind legs over the ocean or LI Sound... #20 for takeoff... You name it.
All this talk about California and Florida, and there's practically no mention of any NY airport outside of the biggies. Teterboro was mentioned, but I'm afraid that Republic Airport (FRG), aka-Farmingdale, beats out Teterboro by a country mile. The guys in the FRG tower told me that they had about 220,000 total aircraft movements per year, and that ranks it as third in the state behind JFK and LGA (though I am not sure what order those two would be ranked as). GA airports in the northeast are always going to suffer in yearly totals when compared to airports in SoCal because of the inevitable number of IFR days that one experiences.
In any case, that place was a total horror show in the summer. It was not unusual to be #8 or 9 for callback to get in on a weekend afternoon, and once I orbited over a VOR for forty minutes waiting for my number to come up... Not to mention being one of 7, 8, 12 aircraft in the pattern... Downwind legs over the ocean or LI Sound... #20 for takeoff... You name it.
flydog
Well-known member
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If you are talking GA it is definitely between Southern California and South Florida. Having flown extensively recently out of VNY and FXE I have to say FXE is hands down the busiest. On weekends there can be a dozen cessnas and pipers lined up for takeoff and the mix between jet traffic and GA is overwhelming. They usually change controllers out every 15 minutes at peak hours. FXE also seems to have more jet traffic than VNY.
I have waited 30 minutes in the practice area with students just to be able to get in a word edgewise to announce intentions to land and 8 mile downwind legs are common. I havent seen that type of GA traffic at VNY or any other California airport including SNA.
If you want to know busiest as far as non-GA my top 10 list would include DTW, SFO, SEA, and BOS not in any particular order. For some reason these places seem to be high workload even though their traffic count is not as high as LAX, ORD, and JFK, etc
I have waited 30 minutes in the practice area with students just to be able to get in a word edgewise to announce intentions to land and 8 mile downwind legs are common. I havent seen that type of GA traffic at VNY or any other California airport including SNA.
If you want to know busiest as far as non-GA my top 10 list would include DTW, SFO, SEA, and BOS not in any particular order. For some reason these places seem to be high workload even though their traffic count is not as high as LAX, ORD, and JFK, etc
JBHewlett
AOPA & EAA Member
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- Aug 11, 2002
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Well according to Airnav
According to Airnav I beleive that VNY is going to take the cake. However thats just from the statistics that I got off of airnav. I can tell you right now Airnavs operations data, needs to be taken with an entire shaker of salt because I know that at CEY there aren't 35 operations per day. VNY looks like its crazy though!!!!
I know that PRC has a bunch of operations per day. That is also one busy place.
J.
According to Airnav I beleive that VNY is going to take the cake. However thats just from the statistics that I got off of airnav. I can tell you right now Airnavs operations data, needs to be taken with an entire shaker of salt because I know that at CEY there aren't 35 operations per day. VNY looks like its crazy though!!!!
I know that PRC has a bunch of operations per day. That is also one busy place.
J.
501261
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You bring up an excellent point regarding traffic. It really depends on what time you hit it and what the weather is like.
I've never had a problem at VNY or SFO, but I don't go into VNY on weekends and I tell the boss if there's any weather (i.e. ground stops) at SFO we're going into OAK. If the airports require slots (JFK, ORD, Ski country during winter, etc.) it actually real easy to get into since the slots take care of most of the waiting.
Most of the headaches are caused when getting in line, not when you’re actually in line itself.
Some of the worst traffic scenarios that I have been part of are:
1. DCA 2000 inauguration. Primary cause- incompetence
2. A runway change at LAX, with weather. Primary cause- communication problems with the foreign carriers and having to repeat instructions (1 JAL got lost and caused a blockage on a taxiway).
3. NCAA Final 4 in SAT. Primary cause- T-storms.
4. NBAA conventions
5. Super bowl in MIA
6. SNA- just the other day. Took about 40 minutes to taxi out on a clear blue afternoon. Primary cause- lack of situational awareness from "pleasure" and students or instructors by wanting to shoot a couple of touch and go during such a busy push.
Sorry I have to vent a little here! But hey, when there are 20 people in line to take off and you don't HAVE to be flying, go get a cup of coffee and come back in an hour, the airport will still be there! On that same note, when there are more than 5 people in the pattern at airport A, do something a little crazy and shoot touch and goes at Airport B!
Sorry to Flame anyone, but I was pissed.
I've never had a problem at VNY or SFO, but I don't go into VNY on weekends and I tell the boss if there's any weather (i.e. ground stops) at SFO we're going into OAK. If the airports require slots (JFK, ORD, Ski country during winter, etc.) it actually real easy to get into since the slots take care of most of the waiting.
Most of the headaches are caused when getting in line, not when you’re actually in line itself.
Some of the worst traffic scenarios that I have been part of are:
1. DCA 2000 inauguration. Primary cause- incompetence
2. A runway change at LAX, with weather. Primary cause- communication problems with the foreign carriers and having to repeat instructions (1 JAL got lost and caused a blockage on a taxiway).
3. NCAA Final 4 in SAT. Primary cause- T-storms.
4. NBAA conventions
5. Super bowl in MIA
6. SNA- just the other day. Took about 40 minutes to taxi out on a clear blue afternoon. Primary cause- lack of situational awareness from "pleasure" and students or instructors by wanting to shoot a couple of touch and go during such a busy push.
Sorry I have to vent a little here! But hey, when there are 20 people in line to take off and you don't HAVE to be flying, go get a cup of coffee and come back in an hour, the airport will still be there! On that same note, when there are more than 5 people in the pattern at airport A, do something a little crazy and shoot touch and goes at Airport B!
Sorry to Flame anyone, but I was pissed.
I can't believe some of those airports in SoCal. Almost all of those Class D (VNY right?) have almost twice the amount of traffic than Cleveland International (Class B).
I took a delta MD-88 to DCA on that Innauguration Day. Popping out of the clouds right above the Potomac and seeing Capitol was quite a sight.
I took a delta MD-88 to DCA on that Innauguration Day. Popping out of the clouds right above the Potomac and seeing Capitol was quite a sight.
I.P. Freley
I like people food
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- Dec 26, 2001
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Cleveland Int'l? Oh, please, I've never had a problem going in there (IFR, airline service of course).
I say again, weekend traffic in northeast airports on a nice day will equal any worst-case scenario in SoCal or Florida. 8-mile downwinds? Try 12! Far, far outside of the airspace "controlled" by the tower in a Class D field... Take a look at Republic some time and look at what "downwind over water" REALLY means. Some of the days I suffered through on Long Island were simply the worst I have ever seen, worse than any airport east of the Mississippi that I have had to deal with (and as an ERAU grad, that includes the exaggerated case of DAB, which isn't even in my personal top-five as heavy traffic goes).
I say again, weekend traffic in northeast airports on a nice day will equal any worst-case scenario in SoCal or Florida. 8-mile downwinds? Try 12! Far, far outside of the airspace "controlled" by the tower in a Class D field... Take a look at Republic some time and look at what "downwind over water" REALLY means. Some of the days I suffered through on Long Island were simply the worst I have ever seen, worse than any airport east of the Mississippi that I have had to deal with (and as an ERAU grad, that includes the exaggerated case of DAB, which isn't even in my personal top-five as heavy traffic goes).
Obviously nobody here has worked out of Tuweep, AZ. Talk about busy. Once I saw two airplanes land there within a one month period. Soon there was talk about putting in a tower. Then about paving the runway. Even about cutting down the weeds so we could find the runway. After the second airplane landed you could hear everyone thinking, "well, there goes the neighborhood." Next thing you know, the federal government steps in and puts a boatload of restricted airspace about the place. I have no idea what would happen if they got a third airplane in, but you can bet it would involve the invocation of a clearance delivery and possibly even a fuel truck...
GCN is a really busy place. With four to five patterns going for the same airport and frequently three or four stacks of aircraft holding just outside the airport, it's almost always strictly VFR. I've seen dual right and left inner and outer patterns going simultaneously to one runway, with the addition of several helicopter patterns and overhead patterns...all full. That's an inner and outer left down wind, and right downwind, and overheads to both, plus the helicopter ops.
The busiest airspace, without question, is between my soon-to-be-ex-mother-in-law's ears. You can actually look in through one ear, or a cavernous nostril, and see little balls of light and thousands of demonic fairies flying around in there. It's not a pretty sight.
GCN is a really busy place. With four to five patterns going for the same airport and frequently three or four stacks of aircraft holding just outside the airport, it's almost always strictly VFR. I've seen dual right and left inner and outer patterns going simultaneously to one runway, with the addition of several helicopter patterns and overhead patterns...all full. That's an inner and outer left down wind, and right downwind, and overheads to both, plus the helicopter ops.
The busiest airspace, without question, is between my soon-to-be-ex-mother-in-law's ears. You can actually look in through one ear, or a cavernous nostril, and see little balls of light and thousands of demonic fairies flying around in there. It's not a pretty sight.
Ravengirl
Sierra Whiskey!
- Joined
- Nov 25, 2001
- Posts
- 211
Avbug- I want to see that! Can you try to put a TFR on it? Or make it a prohibited area?
SNA can be awful at times...yet somehow I still manage to love the place. The thing is, you can realize it's busy and taxi back to the FBO, but half the time it takes just as long to taxi back...so in the end it's better to just stick it out and wait your turn. What I do is time it so I am ready to go and calling clearance either right on the hour or the half hour. These are times that many students and CFI's are getting ready to go to the airplane, so you can escape a little bit of the crush...
Patience is a virtue and you learn it well at SNA.
Stephanie
SNA can be awful at times...yet somehow I still manage to love the place. The thing is, you can realize it's busy and taxi back to the FBO, but half the time it takes just as long to taxi back...so in the end it's better to just stick it out and wait your turn. What I do is time it so I am ready to go and calling clearance either right on the hour or the half hour. These are times that many students and CFI's are getting ready to go to the airplane, so you can escape a little bit of the crush...
Patience is a virtue and you learn it well at SNA.
Stephanie
AAflyer
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- Nov 26, 2001
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