Bush is teaching Labor a lesson!!!!!!!!!

[cl-65link]

I was referring specifically to the McCain-Lott sponsored bill which proposes, among other things, to radically alter labor negotiations with regard to the airline industry and has a very good chance of becoming law next year, now that the Republicans control both houses of Congress. It has been referred to several times on this board before.

 

[boxcar]

Re: The greatest thing Clinton accomplished:

The greatest thing Clinton accomplished in office was to get Americans to agree blowjobs are not sex. Period.

Everything else was built on Reagan and Bush I 's legacy. GWB inherited Clinton's legacy. The next president will reap the benefits of GWB's labors. That is the way it works.

I'm still trying to figure out why it's illegal for a hooker to sell blow jobs. It can't be considered prostitution because it doesn't involve sex.

 

[Typhoon1244]

Re: Re: The greatest thing Clinton accomplished:

I'm still trying to figure out why it's illegal for a hooker to sell blow jobs. It can't be considered prostitution because it doesn't involve sex.

A better question is why prostitution is illegal. Why should it be illegal to sell something that's perfectly legal to give away?

(...with credit to George Carlin.)

 

[Timebuilder]

Timebuilder, you say you make only five dollars an hour. I bet you live in a 500,000 dollar house, right? It really bothers me when people are out of or going to be out of work, people that work to pay the rent and put food on the table are going to be out on the street, and have people that live on trust funds say to them, hey, thats just how the system works, I don't see what the big fuss is all about? [

Since I don't recognize your screen name, toecutter, I assume you haven't learned about me through my posts. I can safely say that I have never lived in a $500,000 house, even when I had money, and was a democrat. Since you missed my recent disclosure of my personal information, I can tell you that I live in a 12x12 room, with a bathroom in the hall. It is my considerable life experience that caused me to leave my ineffective liberal democrat beliefs behind. I won't make everyone re-read my life story. You can find it if you search under last week's posts, if you like. I don't have a trust fund like a Kennedy or a Daschle. I drive a 14 year old car.

About morality: it isn't a quality that you start out with in life. You start out as a sinner, and you die as a sinner. Every single one of us, believer or not. That's why we need the one individual sacrifice of the man whose birth we celebrate every December 25th. If you were in public school after 1965, you might never have heard of him.

George Bush didn't start out a perfect man either, and I'm sure he would be the fiirst to tell you he isn't. That doesn't stop him, me, or you from being a moral person now. So, while I'm impressed that you have a web reference to information about him, I'm wondering where all the attitude is coming from. If you were a perfect man, I'd tell you to raise up my dead fiancee who was killed in a holdup of her store. Hint: the only perfect man is referenced in the above paragraph.

As far as a being military friendly, I guess you can say republicans are military friendly, just not to its members. It won't be long until you see all of that money for pay raises go to pay for the war instead of the soldiers and their families. I noticed that army aviators had their bonus taken away right after the election. I would say it won't be long before tricare benefits and retirement are next on the chopping block.

I don't like the fact that the military has suffered under Clinton. His failure to back up the rangers in Somalia was unforgivable. I hope pay and benefits can be improved under Bush. If you have a link to information about the aviator's bonus money being cancelled, I'd like to research that. I can tell you this, you don't rebuild the military overnight. But you knew that.

I notice that the biggest talkers about going to war are people that have "civilian" in their profile.(military school does not count) You wrap yourselves in the blanket of freedom that others provide. If you what to talk big about going to war and killing people or being killed , I suggest you pick up a weapon, and stand your post.

Man what an attitude. My heart is sickened when I hear a soldier talking like this. Thank God it doesn't happen very often. I'm really hoping that this is a ruse, and that you're just some smart alec kid masquerading as a soldier.

First, you are in service of your country, that means me, George W, and every other American, both civilian and military. Second, you are bound by an oath to provide me with that blanket of freedom you mentioned. Others provided that freedom for YOU. You did not suddenly become worthy of that freedom because you put on a uniform and learned to fire a weapon. Like it or not, we, your countrymen will talk, and talk big if we like. That's the American way, and that's what the deal is. You signed up for it. Don't like the deal? Don't re-up. Simple. As an American, you have a right to complain.

I just hope you're not wearing the uniform when you do.

Killing?

I know quite a bit about killing. More than I'd like to know, actually. I hope that you can keep your innocence as long as possible. I have seen things that you may only see in your nightmares.

'nuff said.

 

[Timebuilder]

Dieterly, I found the chickenhawk website fascinating. I reminded me of the communist party propaganda that was handed out around NYU back in 1970. Where does this "symbolman" company get their support? The G7 protesters?

Is the point of the "chickenhawk" moniker that only active duty military personell have the right to determine what action they will undertake, and if you are not in the military, your opinion is invalid? Or is it a case of modern anti-war protesters amusing themselves with clever parodies?

I'm always amazed that adults can be involved in shenanigans like this.

 

[Toecutter]

OK Timebuilder, I figured out who you are, Chuck Barris?

Ready to recieve another B.S. sanctimonious answer.

 

[Timebuilder]

Good.

When you receive it, I'm sure you'll post it here on the board for all of us to view.

 

[cocknbull]

Typhoon1244

I said "If you're uneducated, on welfare, or a college teacher who smoked alot of weed in the sixties, then you're most likely a Democrat."

This was a response to your statement regarding being in a union and voting Republican. The statement is outrageous. Whether the statement is true or not makes no difference. The point is that yours is on the same intelectual feild. You claim to be unbias and middle of the road. However your statements infer that you are a habitual left wing voter. Since anyone who is in ALPA and votes Republican is incapable of thought. I am not myopic. I see the need for representation just as much as the next guy. However I also see the need for managers and CEOs to run their businesses efficiently. There must be a balance and I think we both agree it is not right to vote down party lines. The best man for the job.

I have read Flying The Line and a found it biased and misleading. The book only gives you one side of the story. Although I did more research myself and do agree with much of what the author expressed.

I have only voted for two Democrats in my life Cincinnati's mayor and former county recorder. Both are fine people with solid ideas. However your right I am a right winger. Who nows maybe in the future I will not agree with their vision, but for now I support Bush and the GOP.

 

[Typhoon1244]

Typhoon1244, I said "If you're uneducated, on welfare, or a college teacher who smoked alot of weed in the sixties, then you're most likely a Democrat." This was a response to your statement regarding being in a union and voting Republican. The statement is outrageous.

I admit, it was a gross over-simplification. I guess I'm guilty of "soundbiting" too.

Let me put it another way: the airline pilot community, in general, leans heavily to the right. Therefore, the Republican party usually comes the closest to meeting their political needs. The problem is that the Republicans are also, in general, an enemy of organized labor...and organized labor is the only thing keeping many of us from flying fifteen-day trips that don't end in domicile. In the end, a vast majority of the airline pilot community supports a political party that would throw their quality of life in the crapper for the sake of the almighty Dollar.

I like to think that, in a perfect system, sound corporate financial policy and organized labor could co-exist. (You'll note that companies that treat their employees fairly don't have unions...at least, not militant ones.)

You claim to be unbias and middle of the road. However your statements infer that you are a habitual left wing voter.

Well, I voted for Fred Thompson once. Does that count? Actually, I'm ashamed to admit that in the last presidential election, I voted for nobody. It was like choosing between Tweedle-dee and Tweedle-dumb.

You know who I would have liked to vote into office? Cheney and Lieberman. Now there's a ticket I could have gotten behind! Sorry guys, but I don't like George W. I never thought we'd actually have a president dumber than Dan Quayle. Now Richard Cheney is another story. Couldn't we just let George wander off into the woods and put Cheney in his place?

If I come off like a left-winger, it's because we're in a thread discussing unions and corporate America. Ask me about crime, the military, or what I think we should do about the Middle East, and you'll see I'm not as far left as you think I am.

 

[TurboS7]

We have flown both Clinton and G.W. Bush, between stops Clinton hit on the FA's and generally goofed off. Just before getting out of the airplane he would comb his hair then say"Showtime" it was all a big game to him. Bush and his aids had a Bible study between stops followed by a very serious prayer meeting. I consider Bush an older brother that just happened to become President, he is a neat guy. He runs an eight minute mile and can keep it up for 5 miles. His goal was to have that down to 6 minutes, I am sure he is close to it by now. I remember the SS agents dreading him making President as they knew that he would outrun them all. We are talking tough ex-marine types. They figured they would "stack" the course and that way they could keep fresh guys with them all the time. Personally I have found the White House staff to be wonderful, both with Clinton and Bush. Once you get to the top in life it is intense but very relaxed. Laura Bush is a sweetheart and a very soft first lady, we have some wonderful people in the White House at this time. Sure G.W. has a past but he is first to admit it .He came to a point in life that we all must and realized that he was a sinner and could only have redemption through the Christ in Christmas, his life was changed overnight. He may not have flown in Vietnam but I am sure he wanted too. Remember his father experienced the hell of war asd a pilot, I am sure that he did everything in his power to keep his son from it. I know that I would, and every father that has been there should too. If the son decides to go then he has made a proud decision.
Right now it is 1828Z, 61 years ago at this very moment the first bombs were falling on Pear Harbour. The loss of life in that great war is something to think about. God Bless America.

 

[DoinTime]

I bet this dude is good buddies with G. Dubya

Reuters
US Airways lender threatens to liquidate carrier
Saturday December 7, 12:14 pm ET
NEW YORK, Dec 7 (Reuters) - The chief executive of the primary lender to bankrupt US Airways Group (OTC BB:UAWGQ.OB - News) said he would liquidate the airline if unions refused to provide $200 million in additional wage and benefit concessions, The New York Times reported on Saturday.
David Bronner, CEO of the Retirement Systems of Alabama, said he did not expect to have to follow through on his ultimatum and predicted that cost-cutting discussions between the airline and its employees would result in an agreement by next week, The New York Times reported.
"What's their alternative?" Bronner asked rhetorically. "If they don't want to do this, we'll Chapter 7 it."
Alabama Retirement Systems has provided Arlington, Virginia-based US Airways with debtor-in-possession financing to help it operate while under bankruptcy protection. Bronner said that without the concessions, "we'll pull the DIP financing and they're gone."
Bronner's stance with the US Airways unions is an example of the tough stance analysts expect airlines to begin taking with employees now that a bankruptcy filing by UAL Corp.'s (NYSE:UAL - News) United Airlines is widely expected.
Executives at American Airlines' parent AMR Corp. (NYSE:AMR - News), traveling around the country to meet with employees, also have asked workers to forgo pay increases next year in order to trim expenses by $3 billion to $4 billion.

 

[TurboS7]

Businessman have been threatning to do that since caveman were gathering rocks for the head hancho. Nothing new, more than anything it is a big bluff and a show of their own inability to run an airline. You would be amazed at the waste that these airlines have, even the little ones. When I ran my little 135 I had no big office or secretary(just my wife) but I paid my pilots the best wages on the field for the type of aircraft they flew. Same thing goes for the big airlines, lots of waste on ego and garbage stuff. If I were the pilots I would tell him to stick it in his ear, shut it down.

 

[Typhoon1244]

Now I know I'm risking opening an ugly can of worms here, but I've got to get this out of my system before I burst.

We have flown both Clinton and G.W. Bush.... Bush and his aids had a Bible study between stops followed by a very serious prayer meeting.

Contrary to what you would expect, this does not improve my opinion of the President. I need very much to believe that the leader of my nation keeps his faith--whatever it may be--very private and very widely separated from his professional life. If the President was holding these Bible study sessions for the benefit of the press, I can dismiss it as Politics-as-Usual. But if these were indeed "very serious prayer meeting," that bothers me.

Now before you start flaming me, let me emphasize that this is not an endorsement or rejection of religion or any particular faith. It is my opinion that religion and politics are completely separate issues and should be mixed only with the greatest care and discretion. If George W's pilot knew about these prayer meetings, then that's not discrete.

 

[Rvrrat]

Typhoon,

Perhaps you will allow me to suggest that the matter of scale has not been accounted for in your detemination of what is discrete. Which is more discrete; a group holding a private meeting aboard an aircraft or a group being filed off to a side room in a building for a private meeting prior to going on about the business at hand? In the first instance, only those aboard the aircraft can become aware of said meeting; in the latter instance, particularly with media attention to a public figure all manner of persons may inquire as to what is taking place.

 

[Typhoon1244]

Rvrrat,

You make a good point...but it still bothers me.

Nancy Reagan's astrologer bothered me, too. Maybe it'd be more accurate to say that any display of adherance to an organized religion or faith (including Astrology) by an elected official causes me trouble. Now I'm not saying that any American government could ever become something like the Taliban...but it has to start somewhere.

 

[Draginass]

Does the fact that Bush and family go to church on Sunday bother you too? Or maybe Clinton's going to church on Sunday but getting a bimbo BJ in the oval office balances things out for you?

 

[Timebuilder]

I'll try and keep the flame thrower at port arms, okay?

Contrary to what you would expect, this does not improve my opinion of the President. I need very much to believe that the leader of my nation keeps his faith--whatever it may be--very private and very widely separated from his professional life. If the President was holding these Bible study sessions for the benefit of the press, I can dismiss it as Politics-as-Usual. But if these were indeed "very serious prayer meeting," that bothers me.

First, I don't think it was intended to improve your perspective on our current President, but only to contrast his character with that of his predecessor, which, as the two recent elctions indicated does count.

I do disagree that anyone who works in government has to keep their practice of religion either private or discrete. There is no legal or constitutional requirement to do so. While you are free to have an opinion regarding this, it appears that it is based on a feeling or an interpretation of the founder's wishes that is not in evidence. I'm certain that few minds are going to be changed here regarding the "establishment clause", but as you already know, the costitution says that Congess shall make no law respecting religion. So, from the standpoint of a strict constructionist, as long as no law is passsed that sets one religion above another, or makes official any particular religion or religious viewpoint, then the constitutional constraints have been fully satisfied.

From what I know of GW, all of which is at best from those who know him, and therefore second hand, he would never agree to a prayer meeting for the purpose of making it a media event. With that in mind, consider what Clinton did when he visited Normandy. He took some debris and attempted to fashion a small cross on the beach, in a supposedly unscripted and impromptu moment, with several press photographers nearby. The interesting difference is that this conspicuous, purposeful event which transpired on that beach was featuring a President who has no record of reverence or adherance to scripture as an adult. On the contrary, this central figure has established a track record of self aggrandizement and masterful manipulation of the media at every turn.

So, which is really more offensive: a man who exercises his freedom to practice a religion, granted under the constitution that he has sworn to protect and defend, so help him God, or a man who pretends at reverence when his every action shows an absence of core values and a willingness to exploit every opportunity for his own gain?

I am far more bothered that someone who is the leader of the Free World would engage in a religious act, and not be serious about it.

 

[A1FlyBoy]

What utter bull @hit.

 

[TurboS7]

Maybe I should have kept my big mouth shut. The point is that Bush and his aids took the job very seriously, while the other had a totally fippant attitude towards it. I want any leader that I have to look to Almighty God for guidance, any leader who doesn't is a fool, and that goes for any pilot too.

 

[atpcliff]

Hi!

What our president's private life consists of is no concern of ours, just as your private life is no concern of mine.

Men AND women in very high positions of power necessarily have a lot of power. Many people seek out powerful people for sex, especially women, because they are biologically attracted to power, as a more powerful father can protect and provide for her children better.

Clinton had an affair? This is normal for presidents. Almost ALL of our US presidents had affairs, both prior to and while in office.

Bush Jr: As far as I know, he isn't having an affair now. He had at least one previously.
Bush Sr: He had a steady "other woman" while in office.
Reagan: I don't know of any affairs, but I would be surprised if he didn't have them at some point.
Carter: No affairs, and probably the most religious and moral president we've ever had. Did that make him a great president?
Ford: No affairs I know of.
Nixon: He had a number of affairs.
LBJ: He had a number of affairs.
Eisenhower: He had an affair with his military driver.
Truman: No affairs I know of.
FDR: As our longest acting president, 4 terms, we must assume he was a great president, and I believe he did a herculean job during WWII. He had an affair, AND his wife had an affair with a FEMALE White-house staffer. Now, why do we not talk about his and his wife's lesbian affairs? Because at the time, the press believed that was personal, and although everyone knew about it, the press didn't believe in smearing FDR just to smear him. Imagine in today's world, if the press found out about Bush Jr's or Clinton's wife having an affair with a FEMALE White-house staffer?
George Washington: A number of affairs
Thomas Jefferson: A number of affairs, including fathering a large number of children with his black female slaves.
Note: Screwing the female slaves was a commonly accepted practice at the time, and no one thought him ill for it.

America is about the only First World country that goes nuts over SEX and is surprised or upset when it's leaders actually have sex, sometimes with someone who's not their spouse.

Our next president will have affairs, and the next, and the next, and the next. Get over it.

Cliff
GRB