Breaking into the corporate world

[jet2work]

No different than getting whipsawed at a Pt. 91 job. Boss to pilot (Pt. 91): "Well Joe can do it cheaper". You know the rest. Do what works for you and don't forget to have fun at your job, because too many pilots forget to do so!

This along with the making 100K + a year at a regional have to be the two most outrageous statements made in this whole discussion.

If you are working at a real corporate job. The guy paying the bills wants to know who his pilots are. He is making waaaaay too much money to let some lowballin' yahoo cart his A$$ around the country. My boss has about 58 Million reasons (last year alone) to not piss me off. But in the end you get paid what you command.

My boss could drive a Hyundia if he wanted to, but he drives a Lexus that costs 8X as much. Why? You get what you pay for. If you are not being paid well...... You figure it out. If you are working for less than your worth. Well then maybe you are WorthLess.

Some people are better suited to getting a job where they are a seniority number and fly their trips and bid their schedules. There is no shame in that. Some people would rather have more control over their own destiny. Along with the good comes the bad. I have flown for 2 Fortune 500 flight departments and have always been treated like gold. Are there bad jobs out there? I'm sure there are, but the good ones (like mine) nobody talks about. Why??? Personally I don't like the competition.

Anyone can do the kind of flying that I do. Not everyone is cut out to be a corporate pilot. For that matter, I am probably not cut out to be an airline pilot.

Good luck to all job seekers out there. My posts are designed to inform and hopefully provide you some strategy, not discourage you from trying. Stranger things have happened, but you should know what kind of prejudices you are dealing with.

 

[jet2work]

BigPappa says over on another forum to one of his regional airline brothers who left for a corporate job...

<<IMACDOG, You moved on to be a slave to the RICH so that you can make a little bit more money. How does it feel to be the Biatch to the rich? Now go back to flying your slowtation.>>>

I see it all clearly now Big Pappa. It's called "class envy." It was probably instilled in you by your union, which takes a cut of your crappy ASA paycheck and sends it to the DNC every month. You probably have the Obama 08 sticker on your pubs bag that ALPA sent you....don't you??

Go back to flying your RJ Alex, and relax a little. I know that your union is telling you that private aircraft are taking all the first class customers from the airlines, and causing them financial distress. But why are you getting your panties all twisted; you don't have any first class seats?

I am making the claim that YOU have NEVER flown for a 91 corporate flight department in your life. Sorry but Fracs don't count (that is charter on crack). Please prove me wrong or go back to the commuter airline boards and dish your class envy there.

Radio silence ensues........................................... Thats what I thought!

 

[imisscorplife]

lmao!! This thread is done! Industry is bad enough, then have to hear this $hit too! EVERY JOB IS DIFFERENT!!!!!!!! PERIOD! Move on!

 

[AA717driver]

I have met precious few airline pilots who were not absolutely obsessed with experiencing the real estate between a flight attendant's legs.

You got something against gettin' laid on a layover? TC

 

[jet2work]

You got something against gettin' laid on a layover? TC

No... But my wife is definitely against it.imp:

BTW Sierra Nevada is the best beer in the world.

 

[AA717driver]

No... But my wife is definitely against it.imp:

BTW Sierra Nevada is the best beer in the world.

NOW you're REALLY going to start a food fight! TC

P.S.--I do know some of those "obsessed" types.

 

[cjdriver]

FYI for anyone with an open mind on what corp flying is really like; some corporate gig's are with companies that use the airplane only for company business. I happen to work for one of those, and the people we fly are worker bee's up to CEO/board members. All treat us like co-workers, as it should be. And yes, we're home most nights and weekends because there are no personal trips in the plane.

 

[Bandit60]

You can make close to or more than a 100K with some seniority at a reputable Regional. My experience is that most pt 91 operator know that they can pay you less because there is no Union, and there are usually 20 pilots waiting to take the job from you (usually they'll wait until you go on vacation).

Most fortune 500 company flight departments start much higher than a reputable regional and with some seniority pay way more than any regional and they do it without a Union...hmmmm how did that happen?

 

[400A]

You can make close to or more than a 100K with some seniority at a reputable Regional. My experience is that most pt 91 operator know that they can pay you less because there is no Union, and there are usually 20 pilots waiting to take the job from you (usually they'll wait until you go on vacation).

That is assuming you can survive the first 5 years of wages that the awesome union got you that also qualify you for food Stamps.

 

[Gulfstream 200]

You got something against gettin' laid on a layover? TC

Finally!

Someone posts something sensible in this stupid thread...

 

[hmmm]

Another consideration is that many 121 guys that have been furloughed in the past and claim to have found Fortune 500 religion have bolted back into the arms of the Devil whenever he came a callin'.

That is to say that your fellow furloughed airline brothers gave the same story as you whenever they were laid off. A corporate operator hired them and sent them to school (20K to 45K for a jet type) and a few years later, when the guy gets recalled, he's gone.

Well, this is America, and that is his right. But fool me twice....... I think the biggest impediment to a 121 guy getting a corporate job (besides the union mentality, and lack of customer service thought) is the fear that the guy is only using this job to get him through the furlough. Why should we spend the time and money on him???

Lastly (and just a complete ramble without any empirical evidence to back it up...) I have met precious few airline pilots who were not absolutely obsessed with experiencing the real estate between a flight attendant's legs. I know guys who bid their schedules based on who the FA's were. Well, in the corporate world, that is a huge liability. You might be able to get away with that in a 121 environment, but in a corporate flight department that is poison.

Good luck.

Anybody who thinks that is what's going on in 121 is adolecent or has blinders and been hanging around the koolaid cooler too long.

It aint like that son.

 

[Marquis de Saab]

Okay. I can't stand it any longer. I'm going to hate myself in the morning, but I'll weigh in on this topic.

Airline pilots are not any more or less likely than anyone else to leave a job when offered more money or a better life. A guy who has never flown for an airline is just as likely to move to another job if that job is much better for him as an ex-airline type. I believe accountants and lawyers and baseball players are the same way.

If you hire a good pilot with good experience and good people skills, be prepared to pay him what he's worth, whether he has a 121, 135 or 91 background.

As for advice, here's my rule-of-thumb: When some crusty pilot wants to tell you about "the way it is" smile politely and completely ignore him if:

1. He's still flying an airplane certificated before you were born.
2. He's flying an airplane without a movable stab
3. He wears a tie with a short sleeve shirt.
4. He consistently talks about talk-radio.
5. He despises his boss
6. He worships his boss
7. His copilot looks miserable.

Back to lurking...

 

[jet2work]

Airline pilots are not any more or less likely than anyone else to leave a job when offered more money or a better life.

That my friend is true! It's called the American Way!

But by definition, FURLOUGH means that you have not been fired, or quit, or that your company has gone under. It simply means that we do not have enough work for you right now. When we get enough work for you we will give you a call.

Now if you were a pay protected FO at a major airline with flow through, you could be makin' some serious coin, yet still get furloughed ( I don't claim to understand it myself :nuts: ).

So why would I hire and relo and type a guy who ALREADY has a higher paying job waiting for him? Or if the job isn't higher paying it certainly has the potential to be.

You see.. Us poor corporate slobs top out at about $150K a year whereas Some airlines used to be double that.

Back to reality.... I know that most 121 guys were probably flying for some crappy regional and got furloughed, but in the meantime they might have put an app in at Southwest or Jet blue etc.... Am I gonna shell out $80K to relo and type him and have him leave in a year or two? Why would I? There is no pilot shortage now (really never has been unless you are paying FO's 18K to start).

If a Chief Pilot asked you to resign your seniority as a condition of employment, would you? I probably wouldn't because corporate flight departments go under just like airlines (speaking from experience).

So in the end, it is what it is. Go in and offer to repay your type rating cost if you leave within X# of years ( I personally find this distasteful- akin to PFT).
The other "perceived obstacle" that you will have to overcome is the "Union Mentality." Real or not, many on our side of the fence view people on your side as "Blue Collar Malcontents." An 18 hour day?- $hit happens. A pop up trip this weekend - That's why we make the big bucks. No "hard days off" - unless you are a raging alcoholic, you should be able to get by only working 2-3 days a week with only a few days advance notice. Guys like BigPappa only help to reinforce that stereotype. Also, you will have to get used to no cockpit door, and the CEO looking over your shoulder, which means that you won't be able to read the paper or do a crossword puzzle out of 10Kft.

If you get a job like this, working for the right company, the one thing that will change is that you will never spend a whole leg (or trip for that matter) bitching about your job or management. This might be the hardest transition of all for an airline pilot.:beer:

Good luck you job seekers!

 

[learflyer]

Okay. I can't stand it any longer. I'm going to hate myself in the morning, but I'll weigh in on this topic.

Airline pilots are not any more or less likely than anyone else to leave a job when offered more money or a better life. A guy who has never flown for an airline is just as likely to move to another job if that job is much better for him as an ex-airline type. I believe accountants and lawyers and baseball players are the same way.

If you hire a good pilot with good experience and good people skills, be prepared to pay him what he's worth, whether he has a 121, 135 or 91 background.

As for advice, here's my rule-of-thumb: When some crusty pilot wants to tell you about "the way it is" smile politely and completely ignore him if:

1. He's still flying an airplane certificated before you were born.
2. He's flying an airplane without a movable stab
3. He wears a tie with a short sleeve shirt.
4. He consistently talks about talk-radio.
5. He despises his boss
6. He worships his boss
7. His copilot looks miserable.

Back to lurking...

8.doesn't wear a tshirt
9.wears cowboy boots (yes, their gay)
10.brags about the amount of time he spends on the road.

 

[400A]

8.doesn't wear a tshirt
9.wears cowboy boots (yes, their gay)
10.brags about the amount of time he spends on the road.

11. Shows up to give you his resume in shorts, flip-flops and a motorcycle helmet under his arm and addresses you as "Dude".

Allow possible exception to rule # 2 if it was a Hawker. Great corp. bird but Stab does not move.