Bones?

[luck4unme]

Graduating from 38's soon and am dreamin' about dream sheet. No longer see myself going to IFF and beyond.

How about the B-1 as an alternative? It's fast, it's low and it's a real menace to the enemy. Supposedly they are "ready to go" most of the time. I heard they were the back bone of the attack on Iraq. (48,000 lbs per B 1 vs 4,000 lbs in a 15 or 16.) Is it true they dropped almost 40 % of the ordinance and flew only 10% of the sorties?

There's a good chance I screwed up going to 38's vs. Tones. Can I correct my error (if it was an error) by dreaming abount a Bone?

Bean

 

[STBY GAIN]

From your post you sound to me a lot like an A-10 guy. If you enjoy the ability to do single seat things and not worry about other crew members, go that route. The community is cool too. And shooting a gun is amazing. Granted, I've never shot the gun of the hog, but if it's that much bigger than the Viper gun, it's gotta be that much cooler too. B-1s may be fast but the bases are limited; most people rotate out of the jet for a tour before they get left seat; and you have to do all those goofy crew-member things. And for all that you don't even get to see the world like heavy guys. Maybe Guam or Diego Garcia. True, they dropped a whole lot of bombs, but if you can't roll inverted to watch your fireball, what fun is that?

 

[Hugh Jorgan]

Can I correct my error (if it was an error) by dreaming abount a Bone?

You sure you don't want to re-phrase that?

 

[A-10yungin]

Go Fighters!!

Go Fighters! I've never talked to a dude who flys single seat fighters that regretted taking that road. I have, however, talked to a few heavy/bomber guys that could have gone fighters, elected not to and subsequently regretted it. Go Fighters!!

 

[spanky2]

See avatar at left. Go for fighters. Even if you end up being a FAIP, a fighter is still an option.

Hugh - Good one...this is a tough crowd.

 

[BRlinepilot]

I'd stay away from bombers due to limited choice of bases. Given your situation (38 track), a fighter would be the better choice. I don't know your situation, but when I was in UPT (way back when), dudes were getting fed up with the AETC mentality. Fighters weren't a choice assignment back then due to deployments to the sand box. Many fighter wannabees (UPT IPs)talked down the fighter world. Well, things have changed. The heavy world is just as bad, if not worse, because you are gone all the time.... even to the sand box. This includes the bomber boys and girls. From my experience, the heavy world is not as laid back as it's been said; they eat many of their own. As far as being home when you are not flying......not true. Most guys worked 10-12 hour days in the office. I met a lot of bitter fighter wannabees too. I've got a few buds flying fighters and they love it! Don't let the AETC environment get you down. It's a whole different world out there. If you are going to be away from home, you might as well be flying in something cool and making some per diem.
As far as the airlines are concerned, most of them don't care if you flew single seat or crew aircraft; they care about PIC hours.
Just a few things to think about. Good luck!

 

[LJDRVR]

Here's a perspective you probably didn't expect: (Former Enlisted Puke.)

Go for the fighters. Here's why. You're never going to get the chance again to do that type of flying. It's not that the Bone isn't a bigger weapon of mass destruction, it's that there is no other type of flying you're ever going to do that will require as much hard work, self-discipline and growth as what you'll encounter at Holloman and beyond. It's not that the other MWS are easy, there's just something about the whole single-seat lifestyle that if you have the opportunity, you should do.

I just spent over five years flying various models of Learjets. As I move on to the airlines it dawns on me that it's probably the highest-performance jet I'll ever fly. One of the instructors I get at recurrent training is a retired F-4/F-16 wing commander who calls the Lear a dog. Why would you pass on the opportunity to have your perspective altered in such manner? You have the opportunity to fly aircaft where not only is the SA / mind / fun-meter pegged, but you'll be operating at the limits of your physiology too. Out of all the types of aircraft I've flown, the funnest were the airplanes where your behind was on the longitudinal axis.

Besides, in the nine years I spent on active duty, everybody I came in contact with that was occupationally married to a fast-moving asset, had a MUCH better history of cool assignments than me and my SAC friends. (Ooohh I'm dating myself it was ACC when I seperated.)

I've got a money market account set aside for a T-38A. Anything I make doing Safety/Human Factors consulting goes in there. At the current rate, only three more lifetimes to go! (Besides the -38 is a toy airplane compared to some of the airframes available to you after IFF.) My point being, scratch that itch while you have the chance.

At any rate good luck with your descision.

 

[ScudB]

View from the inside

Well, it seems you've been getting lots of replies from fighter foks, but not much from someone who actually knows the Bone (so to speak). As someone who has flown the Bone since '89, let me tell the good, the bad, and the ugly.
The good--1) faster and lower is a blast! It's a kick to fly night, low level terrain following. It's also fun to be asked by fighter guys (on more than one occasion!) to slow down so they could play with us. 2) The Bone is now the weapon of choice of the commanders--unparalleled weapon capabilities (24 JDAMs is a lot of hate! new weapons on the way), better range/loiter time, outstanding response time. You're numbers for Iraq were correct. If you don't believe me on this, talk to the F-16 aggressor pilot I was talking to several weeks ago--it pained him to admit it. 3) The maintenance is not nearly as bad as everyone has been led to believe over the years. It's improved significantly over the years. 4) The crew concept works good for some folks--it depends on your personality.
The bad--1) Deployments are increasing--see 2 above. They're now on par with the fighter units. However, they're usually in some fairly nice spots (think warm, blue oceans) 2) Basing is limited--hope you like Texas or South Dakota. I've done both places and both are nice areas to live. 3) You typically get 200-250 hours a year--about the same time as fighters, but fewer sorties. 4) Alpha tours (UAVs, AETC, ALO, etc.) are a fact of life (just like the fighter guys) 5) Duty days are 9-12 hours long (longer on fly days). However, we play hard too.
The ugly--disrespect. We get dissed all the time by folks who don't know the airplane, it's capabilities, or who think the airplane is the same as it was when it was introduced in the 80's. This is not your grandpa's bone (so to speak). It's got new computers, new weapons, and lots of other improvements. Luckily the word is starting to get out and we're getting positive press.
By the way--significant disagreement with the former enlisted puke. Bone flying requires just as much discipline, work, and expertise as the little airplanes. Our -1 is over 1000 pages--that's just system info. Add in the tactical and weapons and you're up to serious brain bytes. We don't eat our own--that's a holdover rumor generated by Buff folks from the old SAC days.
Good luck on your completion of UPT--hope you get the airplane of your choice (even if it is one of the little guys!)

 

[LJDRVR]

"By the way--significant disagreement with the former enlisted puke. Bone flying requires just as much discipline, work, and expertise as the little airplanes."

Yeah, I figured I'd take some flak for that one. (Deservedly so.)
My apologies. You guys are the ones that were selected and graduated from UPT and beyond. My "opinions" are worth what you paid for them.

When posting on the military forum, I've always been careful to limit my comments to those areas that I can respond about with some level of expertise. (General airmanship, human factors, QOL at ____AFB, etc...) My post would have been better off had I either confined my thoughts and opinions to areas that I can speak to from experience, or been much more careful in expressing my opinions concerning the subject matter.

Perhaps a better way to express myself would have been to say that the single-seat community appears to be as far away as possible from whatever civilian job luckun4me is going to eventually do. The idea of being able to not only employ an aircraft as a weapon, but to do so in one as maneuverable as a viper or eagle or as "hands on" as the A-10 is intriguing. To do so by oneself, where your crew is in the next airplane and not in yours, is also an interesting thought to me. I think the U-2 would be fun also, just because they're so completely different from any other type of flying out there. Of course the B-1 isn't your average jet either.

Believe me, I do understand that not only do you operate a much more complex jet than I do, you also must contend with tactics, weapons, AR, formation, getting shot at, united way officer, voting officer and a host of other demands that I as a civilian aviator wil never know. (Well, I do remember the additional duties )

Not sure if I really have much more of a point other than sorry for the un-informed commentary. I see you're hoping to go for Southwest also. Best of luck.

 

[ScudB]

LJDRVR,
Thanks for the reply. We Bone drivers get a little defensive sometimes. Good luck on your attempt for Southwest--their hiring forecast looks really good!