Bombardier to sell 120 planes to NETJETS???

[ultrarunner]

After it became apparent NJA was going to furlough a bunch of pilots, I advocated all of us taking a 10 percent pay cut to save their jobs......

And the company gave assurances that would happen? Really?

The 500 on furlough has a net-value savings of around 75 to 80 million, annually. That's figuring a total comp/benefits package costing the company about 150 grand per head.

A 10% cut in 'compensation only' to the remaining 2300 or so is only going to get you a fraction of 80 mil. And that is figuring an average comp-only figure of about 115 grand.

Now, this is just a WAG from the comp numbers on APC, but it's likely reasonably close. But in any event, when you furlough in large numbers like NJA did (over 20% of the working group), that's racks up to massive cash savings that only draconian comp cuts could equal. And at the end of the day, it was about right-sizing the outfit anyway. No amount of cuts would have saved those jobs, IMHO.

 

[fischman]

After it became apparent NJA was going to furlough a bunch of pilots, I advocated all of us taking a 10 percent pay cut to save their jobs. My fellow pilots to whom I told my idea were not amused. Neither was my wife. True story.

How long is it going to take for pilots to realize that CONCESSIONS DO NOT SAVE JOBS?!?

 

[imacdog]

Some people will never get it.

 

[gunfyter]

The only way concessions would save jobs is if the company actually needed those pilots to fly. And cost cutting allowed the product to maintain or increase market share.

Look. Fuel costs @ $6/gallon is $2000/ hour to run a X or a Falcon. Thats fuel alone then management fees.... We are a relatively small cost per hour especily when you are talking 10% of our pay as mentioned previously. A 10% pilot pay cut is not affecting our ability to maintain pilot jobs through market share.

 

[jonjuan]

We are a relatively small cost per hour especily when you are talking 10% of our pay as mentioned previously.

Huh? $160,000/year * 2,800 pilots is $450 Million/year. Compared to total revenues, that's a big %, like it or not.

 

[CA1900]

Huh? $160,000/year * 2,800 pilots is $450 Million/year. Compared to total revenues, that's a big %, like it or not.

Right. A 10% cut from that would be $45 million. If the company took in $5 billion in revenue, that's less than 1%.

 

[gunfyter]

Huh? $160,000/year * 2,800 pilots is $450 Million/year. Compared to total revenues, that's a big %, like it or not.

But 10% is only $45M. Thats only about 1% of revenues. Not going to affect pricing or market share or keep people on or off the property.

 

[jonjuan]

But 10% is only $45M. Thats only about 1% of revenues. Not going to affect pricing or market share or keep people on or off the property.

Gotcha- thx.

 

[G4dude]

I hadn't actually done the math, just thought the idea might save those jobs. However, y'all are right, we didn't need those pilots due to lower demand, unfortunately. The funny thing is, that 200 guy accused me of not caring about my "brothers and sisters", so I thought I would broach the subject.

 

[G4dude]

What assurance from the company did you have that would be acceptable?

I just floated the idea to some of my colleagues, I didn't talk to management. In retrospect, I don't think it would have prevented the furloughs because we are now a smaller company. It will be a happy day when we hire them all back!

 

[G4dude]

The only way concessions would save jobs is if the company actually needed those pilots to fly. And cost cutting allowed the product to maintain or increase market share.

Look. Fuel costs @ $6/gallon is $2000/ hour to run a X or a Falcon. Thats fuel alone then management fees.... We are a relatively small cost per hour especily when you are talking 10% of our pay as mentioned previously. A 10% pilot pay cut is not affecting our ability to maintain pilot jobs through market share.

Good post, but since NJA furloughed 495 pilots, it must have been significant. Although, upon reflection, if we didn't need them any more, then it did not matter how significant the cost was, because the pilots were redundant. So I see your point.

 

[gunfyter]

Good post, but since NJA furloughed 495 pilots, it must have been significant. Although, upon reflection, if we didn't need them any more, then it did not matter how significant the cost was, because the pilots were redundant. So I see your point.

Yes G4. It didn't matter. It mattered to RTS... and we did have a voluntary measures program ... but after he left, it no longer mattered.

You have good instincts. Wiling to sacrifice yourself for your brothers. I commend you although I know you do not need any commendation from me.

 

[G4dude]

Yes G4. It didn't matter. It mattered to RTS... and we did have a voluntary measures program ... but after he left, it no longer mattered.

You have good instincts. Wiling to sacrifice yourself for your brothers. I commend you although I know you do not need any commendation from me.

Actually, commendation feels good right about now, as I get snarled at by the more intense union guys about supposedly not caring.

 

[gunfyter]

Actually, commendation feels good right about now, as I get snarled at by the more intense union guys about supposedly not caring.

Sorry about that. Some people act out of emotion. I don't dislike people just because I disagree with them. Like on these boards, disagree and argue with many people. The only one I can think of I might possibly dislike is 19. Not because he disagrees with me ... but because I believe he actually wants to hurt us. Maybe I am wrong about that. Maybe he is from the government and is here to help us?

 

[G4dude]

Sorry about that. Some people act out of emotion. I don't dislike people just because I disagree with them. Like on these boards, disagree and argue with many people. The only one I can think of I might possibly dislike is 19. Not because he disagrees with me ... but because I believe he actually wants to hurt us. Maybe I am wrong about that. Maybe he is from the government and is here to help us?

I suspect B19 is a capitalist radical like me, that's all. We all care about the same things and the same pilots, just have different beliefs about how to fix them.