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Boeing or Airbus?
- Thread starter pavelump
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metrodriver
No jobs anymore in here??
- Joined
- Aug 25, 2002
- Posts
- 492
I like the airbus seats better. The A320 series is assembled in Germany out of parts from all over the world. Boeing is subsidized by the US government through militairy projects. And the 777? assembled in Seattle out of parts from all over the world. tail for example comes from Japan or korea.
Most Honda's and Toyota's qualify as an American car. More than 75% of the parts are US made and put together in the US, whereas most 'US' cars have lots of parts out of Mexico and Canada or are assembled there. It's just that the Japanese sense for quality makes a superior product. An American (GM) car is designed to fall apart after 100kmiles or 10 years
Most Honda's and Toyota's qualify as an American car. More than 75% of the parts are US made and put together in the US, whereas most 'US' cars have lots of parts out of Mexico and Canada or are assembled there. It's just that the Japanese sense for quality makes a superior product. An American (GM) car is designed to fall apart after 100kmiles or 10 years
chawbein
Well-known member
- Joined
- May 13, 2002
- Posts
- 689
That is because they make military products. The government gets something in return for their money. Airbus gives nothing in the form of a physical object back to their subsidizing govt's.
Airbus is nothing more than a big conglomerate operated by socialist governments. There is no incentive to create a lasting and quality product because they cannot go out of business, their socialist system will not allow them to. This is why you will see Boeing and McDonnell Douglas aircraft (I know they are the same company) operating much longer than their Airbus counterparts. Just look at the old Soviet system and the type of commercial aircraft they turned out (absolute crap), this is what Airbus is to a lesser extent.
Just my humble opinion.
Fly-By-Cable
Well-known member
- Joined
- Nov 29, 2001
- Posts
- 515
flx757
I gotta have more cowbell
- Joined
- Mar 6, 2002
- Posts
- 1,356
Well, I for one, have flown both. And even though I have nothing bad to say about the Airbus, it's a fine product and I enjoyed flying it, I still prefer Boeing.
BTW, "Boeing's latest creation" that you and I currently fly is hardly a Boeing creation at all. My certificate still says DC-9.
BTW, "Boeing's latest creation" that you and I currently fly is hardly a Boeing creation at all. My certificate still says DC-9.
Airbus is trash
Airbus is nothing more than socialist subsidized garbage made by baguette-eating anti-American Frenchys
(at least at the Toulouse WB plant).
I'm particularly fond of such "quality" aircraft as the A340-300, with its amazing takeoff performance, blazing cruise speeds and 34k CFM 56-5C4 engines that have less thrust than a hairdryer. And now they're doing it all wrong again with the high wing loading and weight of the -500/600. Excellent!
The 777-200LR and 300ER are going to have a field day with these two, especially since the 300ER has just recieved a gross weight increase that appears to nullify the A346's initial range advantage. The 7E7's performance quotes at this point are going to take care of the A332 as well...a lighter aircraft available in at least two variants that has transpacific range and the ability to carry 88x108 pallets and side-by-side LD3's (correcting the bad mistake of the 767 family).
The notion that the 764 was Boeing's true response to the development of the 332 is garbage...the 764 has 800 NM less range than the 332 and was obviously designed with DL in mind for ATL-HNL nonstop range to replace the L10's. (Of course, they route it via LAX for crew rest purposes, which is an entirely different discussion.) The 737NG family is doing a pretty solid job against the A32x family.
And of course, how could we discuss Airbus without interesting financial deals that have occured on Leahy and Foelgard's watch. Easyjet, and South African's latest debacle of going A32x to 738 and now back to A32x, are two that come to mind. Also,just recently they won the Iberia A346 vs 772ER deal. Leahy and Foelgard flipped out when the CFO of IB proudly bragged to the press that Airbus was going to guarantee the residual value of both the 346, and their present 18 acft 343 fleet starting in 2005. So much for their little secret. I guess since they're gov't subsidized it won't matter if they lose their shirt on that deal when IB wants to get rid of the 343s. There was an great article about this deal in a recent Wall Street Journal.
So to answer the initial question, Fly Boeing Jets. Too bad I probably won't have an opportunity to fly a non-sim pax 727 though.
Airbus is nothing more than socialist subsidized garbage made by baguette-eating anti-American Frenchys
(at least at the Toulouse WB plant). I'm particularly fond of such "quality" aircraft as the A340-300, with its amazing takeoff performance, blazing cruise speeds and 34k CFM 56-5C4 engines that have less thrust than a hairdryer. And now they're doing it all wrong again with the high wing loading and weight of the -500/600. Excellent!
The 777-200LR and 300ER are going to have a field day with these two, especially since the 300ER has just recieved a gross weight increase that appears to nullify the A346's initial range advantage. The 7E7's performance quotes at this point are going to take care of the A332 as well...a lighter aircraft available in at least two variants that has transpacific range and the ability to carry 88x108 pallets and side-by-side LD3's (correcting the bad mistake of the 767 family).
The notion that the 764 was Boeing's true response to the development of the 332 is garbage...the 764 has 800 NM less range than the 332 and was obviously designed with DL in mind for ATL-HNL nonstop range to replace the L10's. (Of course, they route it via LAX for crew rest purposes, which is an entirely different discussion.) The 737NG family is doing a pretty solid job against the A32x family.
And of course, how could we discuss Airbus without interesting financial deals that have occured on Leahy and Foelgard's watch. Easyjet, and South African's latest debacle of going A32x to 738 and now back to A32x, are two that come to mind. Also,just recently they won the Iberia A346 vs 772ER deal. Leahy and Foelgard flipped out when the CFO of IB proudly bragged to the press that Airbus was going to guarantee the residual value of both the 346, and their present 18 acft 343 fleet starting in 2005. So much for their little secret. I guess since they're gov't subsidized it won't matter if they lose their shirt on that deal when IB wants to get rid of the 343s. There was an great article about this deal in a recent Wall Street Journal.
So to answer the initial question, Fly Boeing Jets. Too bad I probably won't have an opportunity to fly a non-sim pax 727 though.
Aerosmith
Well-known member
- Joined
- Aug 21, 2002
- Posts
- 59
[QUOTE
Airbus is nothing more than a big conglomerate operated by socialist governments. There is no incentive to create a lasting and quality product because they cannot go out of business, their socialist system will not allow them to. This is why you will see Boeing and McDonnell Douglas aircraft (I know they are the same company) operating much longer than their Airbus counterparts. Just look at the old Soviet system and the type of commercial aircraft they turned out (absolute crap), this is what Airbus is to a lesser extent.
Just my humble opinion. [/B][/QUOTE]
Get that needle out of your arm! Comparing Airbus to Tupolevs!!!
When will everybody realize that Boeing is state subsidized. Now that times are tough, all the airlines and industry are lined up with their big trunks down the government wallet. Quit the whining!
I fly a socalled NEXT generation 737, as well as a -500, and I have a hard time finding out of the improvement. Its an ok aircraft, but noisy and steamdriven.
Airbus is nothing more than a big conglomerate operated by socialist governments. There is no incentive to create a lasting and quality product because they cannot go out of business, their socialist system will not allow them to. This is why you will see Boeing and McDonnell Douglas aircraft (I know they are the same company) operating much longer than their Airbus counterparts. Just look at the old Soviet system and the type of commercial aircraft they turned out (absolute crap), this is what Airbus is to a lesser extent.
Just my humble opinion. [/B][/QUOTE]
Get that needle out of your arm! Comparing Airbus to Tupolevs!!!
When will everybody realize that Boeing is state subsidized. Now that times are tough, all the airlines and industry are lined up with their big trunks down the government wallet. Quit the whining!
I fly a socalled NEXT generation 737, as well as a -500, and I have a hard time finding out of the improvement. Its an ok aircraft, but noisy and steamdriven.
Currently fly a Canadian product (CRJ) and in the past, flew a 727. Don't have any experience flying Airbus equipment so can't talk with any real authority regarding which is a better product.
Loved flying the 72 so my vote naturally goes to Boeing. Steam gauges and underpowered (-7 engines in the summertime - what fun!) but it handled great. Seems like most of the people I fly with say that the 72 is one airplane they always wanted to fly. Nothing looks like it -- well except maybe the Tupolov or the trident - and they can't compare.
Like I said, no hard data. Just emotion but it seems like most of the earlier opinions were simply emotion too.
Loved flying the 72 so my vote naturally goes to Boeing. Steam gauges and underpowered (-7 engines in the summertime - what fun!) but it handled great. Seems like most of the people I fly with say that the 72 is one airplane they always wanted to fly. Nothing looks like it -- well except maybe the Tupolov or the trident - and they can't compare.
Like I said, no hard data. Just emotion but it seems like most of the earlier opinions were simply emotion too.
JRSLim
Executive Freightdawg
- Joined
- Feb 21, 2002
- Posts
- 232
Partridge
Active member
- Joined
- Oct 3, 2002
- Posts
- 35
Last I heard Boeing couldn't get their act together (again!) on the 787. Structural problems and such. Bit late to find out too, this far in the program.
Hope they sort things out, both companies make really nice aircraft. We could use a big third player though, such as MCD. Perhaps Embraer or Canadair will step up.
Hope they sort things out, both companies make really nice aircraft. We could use a big third player though, such as MCD. Perhaps Embraer or Canadair will step up.
waka
Emasculating the Right
- Joined
- Nov 28, 2001
- Posts
- 1,972
Wrong. Boeing is government subsidized too. Although, not in the way you might think. Why don't you do some research on Boeing, corruption, ex-Pentagon staff/now with Boeing and military contracts?
BornAgainPagan
No Gods. No Masters.
- Joined
- Jan 2, 2004
- Posts
- 752
Let's assume for a minute that you're correct about the part about Airbus and socialist governments.You comparing Soviet airliners to Airbus is abject nonsense. They don't compare. The economic system behind their design/engineering/manufacturing doesn't compare. You're not even close.
I have had jobs flying both and I prefer Boeing. However, Airbus makes a fine products in their own rite. Hell, I have even ridden in an Antonov and yes, they don't compare to Airbus/Boeing. How do you know that they're "absolute crap"? Is it because you're just talking out of your ass?
Boeing/Airbus
Company's like Frontier, Spirit and the majors bought Airbus because the US would not employ or enforce trade restrictions and we allowed them to sell airframes for millions less than Boeing. Two identical planes but one is $5million less. They could sell at a loss because they have several govts and industry to cover the loss. We protect shimp fisherman, steel, and many other business from preditory pricing from other countries and they have them against us. Japan restricts US drugs and adds tarrifs because we can produce and sell them cheaper than Japan can. Airbus sold many planes in sales that should not have been allowed. I am not bashing Airbus, just saying they would never have passed Boeing and we may still have MD or Lockheed had we leveled the playing field. The only Boeing product I have flown is the B-17, designed to survive @ 15 missions or 200 hours during WWII yet it is flying 64 years and nearly 10000 hours later. The B-52 will have 4th generation pilots of the same families flying the same airframes when they are retired. You won't see that from an Airbus. my 2cents
Company's like Frontier, Spirit and the majors bought Airbus because the US would not employ or enforce trade restrictions and we allowed them to sell airframes for millions less than Boeing. Two identical planes but one is $5million less. They could sell at a loss because they have several govts and industry to cover the loss. We protect shimp fisherman, steel, and many other business from preditory pricing from other countries and they have them against us. Japan restricts US drugs and adds tarrifs because we can produce and sell them cheaper than Japan can. Airbus sold many planes in sales that should not have been allowed. I am not bashing Airbus, just saying they would never have passed Boeing and we may still have MD or Lockheed had we leveled the playing field. The only Boeing product I have flown is the B-17, designed to survive @ 15 missions or 200 hours during WWII yet it is flying 64 years and nearly 10000 hours later. The B-52 will have 4th generation pilots of the same families flying the same airframes when they are retired. You won't see that from an Airbus. my 2cents
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