• NC Software is having a Black Friday Sale Event thru December 4th on Logbook Pro, APDL - Airline Pilot Logbook, Cirrus Elite Binders, and more. Use coupon code BF2020 at checkout to redeem 15% off your purchase. Click here to shop now.
  • NC Software is proud to announce the release of APDL - Airline Pilot Logbook version 10.0. Click here to view APDL on the Apple App store and install now.

Bloomberg says LCC and AMR

LeeRoyJenkins

Well-known member
Joined
Mar 9, 2011
Posts
314
Total Time
11,500
Ummm... you may want to check your facts.

Approx. 1200 pilots got stapled and approx 900 got integrated at 1:8. You just happened to have been hired after the last TWA stapled pilot.

Check my facts? You are basically agreeing with me with only one glaring error. You ASSUME I was hired after the TWA acquisition when I was not. I was on AA property two months before the TWA acquisition was announced.
 

Flopgut

Well-known member
Joined
May 16, 2005
Posts
3,627
Total Time
15k
I knew what you were talking about Leroy. You got a bad deal too that the TWA guys either have forgot about or don't care.
 

Metrojet

Well-known member
Joined
Aug 16, 2006
Posts
378
Total Time
16500
Won't be a windfall for anybody, Heaven forbid this merger should come to pass.

And for the record, I support binding arbitration and unlike some I can live with the result, come what may.


TWA Dude -

Rather than agreeing or disagreeing with your post - I will just make an observation - if there is a merger with 3 pilot groups and 3 contracts - I will bet that in 5 years from now there will be over 2000 retirements - so all these people posting - many wont even be here for the long term

Metrojet
 

TWA Dude

Well-known member
Joined
Nov 26, 2001
Posts
3,666
Total Time
9999+
You are absolutly correct. Just like USAPA did.
Actually, I'll have to agree with you here. In light of how the APA handled the TWA seniority integration one can only assume they'll have as little integrity as the USAir Easties. I still don't understand why you're an apologist for them.
 
Last edited:

TWA Dude

Well-known member
Joined
Nov 26, 2001
Posts
3,666
Total Time
9999+
TWA Dude -

Rather than agreeing or disagreeing with your post - I will just make an observation - if there is a merger with 3 pilot groups and 3 contracts - I will bet that in 5 years from now there will be over 2000 retirements - so all these people posting - many wont even be here for the long term

George Nicolau was well aware of the forecast retirements at US Air yet he chose not to grant the East a windfall at the West's expense because of them. It's indicative of how SLI arbitrations are going now, focusing on the more certain short-term rather than the less certain long-term. So your bet is moot.
 

On Your Six

Well-known member
Joined
Mar 8, 2004
Posts
4,509
Total Time
9,500
Who will "win" if there is a merger with AA and LCC? The AWA guys will likely push for arbitration, but with the Nicalau award which will stand eventually. Throw in very old pilot groups at USair East and AA, and if this merger goes, those AWA guys will rise to the top of the new AA very fast. AA has old captains and old FOs, just like USair East. That NIC award will eventually stand, and the Eastholes can go suck it.


Godspeed!


OYS
 

On Your Six

Well-known member
Joined
Mar 8, 2004
Posts
4,509
Total Time
9,500
TWA Dude -

Rather than agreeing or disagreeing with your post - I will just make an observation - if there is a merger with 3 pilot groups and 3 contracts - I will bet that in 5 years from now there will be over 2000 retirements - so all these people posting - many wont even be here for the long term

Metrojet

If the merger happens, NIC will stand, USAPA will fall. Heck yeah!


Godspeed!


OYS
 

eaglesview

Well-known member
Joined
May 5, 2008
Posts
1,350
Total Time
13,000
Whoa there fella. Have you been actually paying attention to how the APA does business? The only thing they will "definitly" do is look out for their own pilots.

You are correct. But you see a DOH merger puts a vast amount of East Coast folks on the street in a hurry due to 65 and the AA guys are much more senior, (longevity) than are the west. They will do what is best for them. Obviously DOH is better than the NIC for APA in this hypothetical scenario.
 

eaglesview

Well-known member
Joined
May 5, 2008
Posts
1,350
Total Time
13,000
Actually, I'll have to agree with you here. In light of how the APA handled the TWA seniority integration one can only assume they'll have as little integrity as the USAir Easties. I still don't understand why you're an apologist for them.

I am not fan of theirs but I just look at typical pilot greed and do the math. Your scenerio is awful as you have not been treated fairly by a number of pilot groups starting with the APA.
 

aa73

Well-known member
Joined
Oct 12, 2004
Posts
2,075
Total Time
10K
Check my facts? You are basically agreeing with me with only one glaring error. You ASSUME I was hired after the TWA acquisition when I was not. I was on AA property two months before the TWA acquisition was announced.

OK, my bad on the assumption.

That would place you as an Oct/Nov 2000 hire, correct? So there would still be a bunch of TWA pilots integrated at 1:8 ahead of you. Remember, they furloughed a bunch of TWA and AA folks at the same time. The stapled TWA pilots are all below you. However, you were in the group that got furloughed along with many of the 1:8 TWA pilots as well.
 

shon7

Well-known member
Joined
Jan 30, 2002
Posts
423
Total Time
K++
why would anyone in thier right mind want to touch LCC. Its a complete mess and a merger will only complicate matters. Better to just bid on the assets and see what happens.
 

eaglesview

Well-known member
Joined
May 5, 2008
Posts
1,350
Total Time
13,000
why would anyone in thier right mind want to touch LCC. Its a complete mess and a merger will only complicate matters. Better to just bid on the assets and see what happens.

And in your opinion do what with the pilots???? This is where we are our own worst enemy. Pilot greed is sickening.
 

Ky.BrownBourbn

Well-known member
Joined
Nov 29, 2005
Posts
553
Total Time
<9K
why would anyone in thier right mind want to touch LCC. Its a complete mess and a merger will only complicate matters. Better to just bid on the assets and see what happens.

What if LCC is doing the "touching", you have to look at the big picture, DP loves having two pilot groups to play off each other, imagine a third...like three companies competing for your business, let the "throat cutting" begin!

Good luck to us all,
KBB
 

JumpersAway

Cruise Bores Me.......
Joined
Nov 5, 2007
Posts
1,222
Total Time
9000++
Attrition would be so agressive it wouldn't really matter. The numbers are the numbers- retirements far outpacing that of any other airline, in a short span. Depending on how much the combined airline cut capacity, both AWA and USAir of old would get what they wanted- the pay and QOL each seeks. It's a moot point- everybody would be arguing just to argue.
 

LeeRoyJenkins

Well-known member
Joined
Mar 9, 2011
Posts
314
Total Time
11,500
OK, my bad on the assumption.

That would place you as an Oct/Nov 2000 hire, correct? So there would still be a bunch of TWA pilots integrated at 1:8 ahead of you. Remember, they furloughed a bunch of TWA and AA folks at the same time. The stapled TWA pilots are all below you. However, you were in the group that got furloughed along with many of the 1:8 TWA pilots as well.

AGAIN, that is what I was saying. Another poster indicated that the APA stapled the TWA pilots. That is simply not true. If it had been a true staple then there wouldn't have been 700 TWA pilots still flying for AA when I was furloughed.

As I stated before it wasn't pretty for the TWA pilots but it was not a staple of the entire group which seems to be the assumption around here. I was merely pointing that out.

If I was not clear I apologize however I thought my statement was short and to the point.
 

aa73

Well-known member
Joined
Oct 12, 2004
Posts
2,075
Total Time
10K
LeeRoy... correct - they didn't staple the whole group.

54% stapled, 46% integrated at 1:8.
In actual #s, approx. 1200 stapled and 900 integrated.

Hope this clears it up.
Happy holidays...
73
 
Top