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Bill O'Reilly defends pilots

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That's a bunch of babbling BS. The top 10% pay 75% of the acutal tax dollars...
What's your point?
Let me give you an example that maybe even you'll comprehend (I'll make it REAL simple for ya):
Let's say you and I are the only ones that pay taxes. We both pay 10% of our income (flat tax to make it simple for ya).
I make $10,000, you make $990,000.
I pay $1,000 in taxes, you pay $99,000. I'm left with $9,000, you are left with $891,000...
Of all the taxes paid, you paid a WHOPPING 99%!!!! I paid only 1%...
Unfair? WAH WAH WAH!!!
To say that it's unfair for the top 10% to pay 75% of all taxes is a ludicrous statement, my friend. I'd say it should be even higher...
 
Take responsibility for your own life and fortune. If you don't like your present situation CHANGE IT!

Unfortunately I can't afford to hire a lobbyist to ensure that the laws are written in a way that benefits my own self interests. It must be nice though...
 
What's your point?
Let me give you an example that maybe even you'll comprehend (I'll make it REAL simple for ya):
Let's say you and I are the only ones that pay taxes. We both pay 10% of our income (flat tax to make it simple for ya).
I make $10,000, you make $990,000.
I pay $1,000 in taxes, you pay $99,000. I'm left with $9,000, you are left with $891,000...
Of all the taxes paid, you paid a WHOPPING 99%!!!! I paid only 1%...
Unfair? WAH WAH WAH!!!
To say that it's unfair for the top 10% to pay 75% of all taxes is a ludicrous statement, my friend. I'd say it should be even higher...

No, you're left with 90% of your earnings and the other guy's left with 90% of his earnings. Before taxes you only made $10,000 to begin with and the other guy made $990,000. Is it unfair that you only made $10,000? or $25,0000 or $40,000?
 
No, you're left with 90% of your earnings and the other guy's left with 90% of his earnings. Before taxes you only made $10,000 to begin with and the other guy made $990,000. Is it unfair that you only made $10,000? or $25,0000 or $40,000?
Aiaiai... Since you obviously missed the point, I guess I'll spoonfeed you:
By default, the guy making more money will pay a higher percent of the total taxes! Even with a flat tax, as in my example.. Of course this results in the top 10% paying 75% (or whatever the actual percentage is). To suggest this is unfair is, at best, moronic. Which proves that people like Sean Hannity (who brings this "argument" up on a regular basis) and Bill O'Reilly are morons. Then again, look at all you people buying into this stuff... 'Nuff said.
 
Under the lower tax rates the top 10% is paying a greater proportion of the tax bill than before; How does this leave you with the tab? The top 10% is paying way more than their fair share; It's the bottom 10% that needs to get off their collective fat arses. Get educated. I know it's easier and more satisfying to blame you're problems on someone else, but going through life without a basic understanding of economics is like trying to play a game without knowing the rules. It's frustrating, but in the end it's your own fault.



I'd say Ben Stein has a basic understanding of economics.



In Class Warfare, Guess Which Class Is Winning
Sign In to E-Mail This Print Reprints Save

By BEN STEIN
Published: November 26, 2006
NOT long ago, I had the pleasure of a lengthy meeting with one of the smartest men on the planet, Warren E. Buffett, the chief executive of Berkshire Hathaway, in his unpretentious offices in Omaha. We talked of many things that, I hope, will inspire me for years to come. But one of the main subjects was taxes. Mr. Buffett, who probably does not feel sick when he sees his MasterCard bill in his mailbox the way I do, is at least as exercised about the tax system as I am.

Put simply, the rich pay a lot of taxes as a total percentage of taxes collected, but they don’t pay a lot of taxes as a percentage of what they can afford to pay, or as a percentage of what the government needs to close the deficit gap.

Mr. Buffett compiled a data sheet of the men and women who work in his office. He had each of them make a fraction; the numerator was how much they paid in federal income tax and in payroll taxes for Social Security and Medicare, and the denominator was their taxable income. The people in his office were mostly secretaries and clerks, though not all.

It turned out that Mr. Buffett, with immense income from dividends and capital gains, paid far, far less as a fraction of his income than the secretaries or the clerks or anyone else in his office. Further, in conversation it came up that Mr. Buffett doesn’t use any tax planning at all. He just pays as the Internal Revenue Code requires. “How can this be fair?” he asked of how little he pays relative to his employees. “How can this be right?”

Even though I agreed with him, I warned that whenever someone tried to raise the issue, he or she was accused of fomenting class warfare.

“There’s class warfare, all right,” Mr. Buffett said, “but it’s my class, the rich class, that’s making war, and we’re winning.”

This conversation keeps coming back to mind because, in the last couple of weeks, I have been on one television panel after another, talking about how questionable it is that the country is enjoying what economists call full employment while we are still running a federal budget deficit of roughly $434 billion for fiscal 2006 (not counting off-budget items like Social Security) and economists forecast that it will grow to $567 billion in fiscal 2010.

When I mentioned on these panels that we should consider all options for closing this gap — including raising taxes, particularly for the wealthiest people — I was met with several arguments by people who call themselves conservatives and free marketers.

One argument was that the mere suggestion constituted class warfare. I think Mr. Buffett answered that one.

Another argument was that raising taxes actually lowers total revenue, and that only cutting taxes stimulates federal revenue. This is supposedly proved by the history of tax receipts since my friend George W. Bush became president.

In fact, the federal government collected roughly $1.004 trillion in income taxes from individuals in fiscal 2000, the last full year of President Bill Clinton’s merry rule. It fell to a low of $794 billion in 2003 after Mr. Bush’s tax cuts (but not, you understand, because of them, his supporters like to say). Only by the end of fiscal 2006 did income tax revenue surpass the $1 trillion level again.

By this time, we Republicans had added a mere $2.7 trillion to the national debt. So much for tax cuts adding to revenue. To be fair, corporate profits taxes have increased greatly, as corporate profits have increased stupendously. This may be because of the cut in corporate tax rates. Anything is possible.

The third argument that kind, well-meaning people made in response to the idea of rolling back the tax cuts was this: “Don’t raise taxes. Cut spending.”

The sad fact is that spending rises every year, no matter what people want or say they want. Every president and every member of Congress promises to cut “needless” spending. But spending has risen every year since 1940 except for a few years after World War II and a brief period after the Korean War.

The imperatives for spending are built into the system, and now, with entitlements expanding rapidly, increased spending is locked in. Medicare, Social Security, interest on the debt — all are growing like mad, and how they will ever be stopped or slowed is beyond imagining. Gross interest on Treasury debt is approaching $350 billion a year. And none of this counts major deferred maintenance for the military.

The fourth argument in response to my suggestion was that “deficits don’t matter.”

There is something to this. One would think that big deficits would be highly inflationary, according to Keynesian economics. But we have modest inflation (except in New York City, where a martini at a good bar is now $22). On the other hand, we have all that interest to pay, soon roughly $7 billion a week, a lot of it to overseas owners of our debt. This, to me, seems to matter.

Besides, if it doesn’t matter, why bother to even discuss balancing the budget? Why have taxes at all? Why not just print money the way Weimar Germany did? Why not abolish taxes and add trillions to the deficit each year? Why don’t we all just drop acid, turn on, tune in and drop out of responsibility in the fiscal area? If deficits don’t matter, why not spend as much as we want, on anything we want?

The final argument is the one I really love. People ask how I can be a conservative and still want higher taxes. It makes my head spin, and I guess it shows how old I am. But I thought that conservatives were supposed to like balanced budgets. I thought it was the conservative position to not leave heavy indebtedness to our grandchildren. I thought it was the conservative view that there should be some balance between income and outflow. When did this change?

Oh, now, now, now I recall. It changed when we figured that we could cut taxes and generate so much revenue that we would balance the budget. But isn’t that what doctors call magical thinking? Haven’t the facts proved that this theory, though charming and beguiling, was wrong?

THIS brings me back to Mr. Buffett. If, in fact, it’s all just a giveaway to the rich masquerading as a new way of stimulating the economy and balancing the budget, please, Mr. Bush, let’s rethink it. I don’t like paying $7 billion a week in interest on the debt. I don’t like the idea that Mr. Buffett pays a lot less in tax as a percentage of his income than my housekeeper does or than I do.

Can we really say that we’re showing fiscal prudence? Are we doing our best? If not, why not? I don’t want class warfare from any direction, through the tax system or any other way.

Ben Stein is a lawyer, writer, actor and economist. E-mail: [email protected].
 
I'd say Ben Stein has a basic understanding of economics.

A wonderful essay from the man who we all tried to win his money.

Again, I find it hard to believe that any person posting in the REGIONALS FORUM could possibly make a case for the top 10% of income earners in America. (FYI- you're not in it.)

As far as taxes go, any talk of tax reduction at this point seems incredibly foolish due to the fact that the government is consuming far more than it takes in. We're living off the government credit card, and it won't be long before we start getting those annoying phone calls asking if we can make our payments this month.

The issue is spending. If conservatives could realize that tax cuts and unnecessary war are inversely related, then tax cuts might be more appropriate. Deficit-spending may be effective if that borrowed money is used to build up the nation's infrastructure- but spending $12,000,000.00 an hour in the sandbox is comparable to flushing it down the world's largest toilet.

If you wanna see how deficit-spending really works, I would wait for the time that all our creditors make a margin call. Then, to the dismay of very smart, conservative economists, (like TV's Ben Stein) the sh1t will proverbially hit the fan.

Bueller? Frye? Anybody?
 
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Aiaiai... Since you obviously missed the point, I guess I'll spoonfeed you:
By default, the guy making more money will pay a higher percent of the total taxes! Even with a flat tax, as in my example.. Of course this results in the top 10% paying 75% (or whatever the actual percentage is). To suggest this is unfair is, at best, moronic. Which proves that people like Sean Hannity (who brings this "argument" up on a regular basis) and Bill O'Reilly are morons. Then again, look at all you people buying into this stuff... 'Nuff said.

Or, we could tax the lower income folks at a higher % as punishment for bringing down society. Maby that would give them some incentive to get a GED or stop watching Springer and having a newborn every 10 months.
 
Or, we could tax the lower income folks at a higher % as punishment for bringing down society. Maby that would give them some incentive to get a GED or stop watching Springer and having a newborn every 10 months.

Certainly you don't believe that everyone who fits into the lowest bracket of income fits the stereotype that you described above.

Are you saying that my Aunt who is a waitress and single parent should be taxed higher because she didn't go to law school?

Are you saying that a first year 121 FO should be taxed more because he/she isn't a 737 FO bringing in six figures like yourself?

Its a good thing that we have people like you to maintain our society, since so many of us are "bringing it down".
 
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I'm not shocked O'Reilly supported the pilots. His "shtick" is that he's a blue collar warrior fighting for the middle class workers". He wouldn't tout any kind of management. Of course we know that's just an act, what with his millions of dollars. But hey, it gets ratings.
What can I say but:rolleyes:
You libbies crack me up
 
I'm not shocked O'Reilly supported the pilots. His "shtick" is that he's a blue collar warrior fighting for the middle class workers". He wouldn't tout any kind of management. Of course we know that's just an act, what with his millions of dollars. But hey, it gets ratings.

Only people in America who know pilots are "blue collar ... middle class workers" are the pilots themselves. If it was for the ratings it would be the other way around since America considers pilots to be in the same class as doctors and lawyers.
 
Well spoken, Palerider957, and let's hope it never gets to it. I've lived there, and it ain't good!
 
Only people in America who know pilots are "blue collar ... middle class workers" are the pilots themselves. If it was for the ratings it would be the other way around since America considers pilots to be in the same class as doctors and lawyers.

Good point.
 
Or, we could tax the lower income folks at a higher % as punishment for bringing down society. Maby that would give them some incentive to get a GED or stop watching Springer and having a newborn every 10 months.
Let me guess: You feel the top 10% should pay 10% of the taxes, right? 8-B
 
Three solutions:

1. Get rid of the progressive tax system we have today and go to a regressive system. Give the freeloaders something to strive for instead of living off the handouts of ALL (not just rich or just middle class) the Americans who help build and make this great society and nation.

2. Go to a national sales tax. Tax every good and service. For those who buy the big luxury SUVS, like the ones Green Peace people drive or ride around in your own private jet going to movie premiers, then they can pay the taxes. If you can't afford to drive a $40k Navigator or a 20 Mil Lear, guess what? You don't have to pay the taxes on one. Kinda works out good for everyone.

3. Just tax everyone the exact same precent. Your income is X and you pay Y percent, just like everyone else.

Of course none of this will happen but it sure would be easier for me every year if it would.:laugh:
 
To say that it's unfair for the top 10% to pay 75% of all taxes is a ludicrous statement, my friend. I'd say it should be even higher...

BYU - newsflash! Soviet Union tried the "egalitarian" approach and it did NOT work. Then again, Hillary might bring some of the communist ideas back soon...
 
I'd say Ben Stein has a basic understanding of economics.



In Class Warfare, Guess Which Class Is Winning
Sign In to E-Mail This Print Reprints Save

By BEN STEIN
Published: November 26, 2006
NOT long ago, I had the pleasure of a lengthy meeting with one of the smartest men on the planet, Warren E. Buffett, the chief executive of Berkshire Hathaway, in his unpretentious offices in Omaha. We talked of many things that, I hope, will inspire me for years to come. But one of the main subjects was taxes. Mr. Buffett, who probably does not feel sick when he sees his MasterCard bill in his mailbox the way I do, is at least as exercised about the tax system as I am.

Put simply, the rich pay a lot of taxes as a total percentage of taxes collected, but they don’t pay a lot of taxes as a percentage of what they can afford to pay, or as a percentage of what the government needs to close the deficit gap.

Mr. Buffett compiled a data sheet of the men and women who work in his office. He had each of them make a fraction; the numerator was how much they paid in federal income tax and in payroll taxes for Social Security and Medicare, and the denominator was their taxable income. The people in his office were mostly secretaries and clerks, though not all.

It turned out that Mr. Buffett, with immense income from dividends and capital gains, paid far, far less as a fraction of his income than the secretaries or the clerks or anyone else in his office. Further, in conversation it came up that Mr. Buffett doesn’t use any tax planning at all. He just pays as the Internal Revenue Code requires. “How can this be fair?” he asked of how little he pays relative to his employees. “How can this be right?”

Even though I agreed with him, I warned that whenever someone tried to raise the issue, he or she was accused of fomenting class warfare.

“There’s class warfare, all right,” Mr. Buffett said, “but it’s my class, the rich class, that’s making war, and we’re winning.”

This conversation keeps coming back to mind because, in the last couple of weeks, I have been on one television panel after another, talking about how questionable it is that the country is enjoying what economists call full employment while we are still running a federal budget deficit of roughly $434 billion for fiscal 2006 (not counting off-budget items like Social Security) and economists forecast that it will grow to $567 billion in fiscal 2010.

When I mentioned on these panels that we should consider all options for closing this gap — including raising taxes, particularly for the wealthiest people — I was met with several arguments by people who call themselves conservatives and free marketers.

One argument was that the mere suggestion constituted class warfare. I think Mr. Buffett answered that one.

Another argument was that raising taxes actually lowers total revenue, and that only cutting taxes stimulates federal revenue. This is supposedly proved by the history of tax receipts since my friend George W. Bush became president.

In fact, the federal government collected roughly $1.004 trillion in income taxes from individuals in fiscal 2000, the last full year of President Bill Clinton’s merry rule. It fell to a low of $794 billion in 2003 after Mr. Bush’s tax cuts (but not, you understand, because of them, his supporters like to say). Only by the end of fiscal 2006 did income tax revenue surpass the $1 trillion level again.

By this time, we Republicans had added a mere $2.7 trillion to the national debt. So much for tax cuts adding to revenue. To be fair, corporate profits taxes have increased greatly, as corporate profits have increased stupendously. This may be because of the cut in corporate tax rates. Anything is possible.

The third argument that kind, well-meaning people made in response to the idea of rolling back the tax cuts was this: “Don’t raise taxes. Cut spending.”

The sad fact is that spending rises every year, no matter what people want or say they want. Every president and every member of Congress promises to cut “needless” spending. But spending has risen every year since 1940 except for a few years after World War II and a brief period after the Korean War.

The imperatives for spending are built into the system, and now, with entitlements expanding rapidly, increased spending is locked in. Medicare, Social Security, interest on the debt — all are growing like mad, and how they will ever be stopped or slowed is beyond imagining. Gross interest on Treasury debt is approaching $350 billion a year. And none of this counts major deferred maintenance for the military.

The fourth argument in response to my suggestion was that “deficits don’t matter.”

There is something to this. One would think that big deficits would be highly inflationary, according to Keynesian economics. But we have modest inflation (except in New York City, where a martini at a good bar is now $22). On the other hand, we have all that interest to pay, soon roughly $7 billion a week, a lot of it to overseas owners of our debt. This, to me, seems to matter.

Besides, if it doesn’t matter, why bother to even discuss balancing the budget? Why have taxes at all? Why not just print money the way Weimar Germany did? Why not abolish taxes and add trillions to the deficit each year? Why don’t we all just drop acid, turn on, tune in and drop out of responsibility in the fiscal area? If deficits don’t matter, why not spend as much as we want, on anything we want?

The final argument is the one I really love. People ask how I can be a conservative and still want higher taxes. It makes my head spin, and I guess it shows how old I am. But I thought that conservatives were supposed to like balanced budgets. I thought it was the conservative position to not leave heavy indebtedness to our grandchildren. I thought it was the conservative view that there should be some balance between income and outflow. When did this change?

Oh, now, now, now I recall. It changed when we figured that we could cut taxes and generate so much revenue that we would balance the budget. But isn’t that what doctors call magical thinking? Haven’t the facts proved that this theory, though charming and beguiling, was wrong?

THIS brings me back to Mr. Buffett. If, in fact, it’s all just a giveaway to the rich masquerading as a new way of stimulating the economy and balancing the budget, please, Mr. Bush, let’s rethink it. I don’t like paying $7 billion a week in interest on the debt. I don’t like the idea that Mr. Buffett pays a lot less in tax as a percentage of his income than my housekeeper does or than I do.

Can we really say that we’re showing fiscal prudence? Are we doing our best? If not, why not? I don’t want class warfare from any direction, through the tax system or any other way.

Ben Stein is a lawyer, writer, actor and economist. E-mail: [email protected].

I remember watching a show while he was reading this. I dozed off because of the WAY HE TALKS!!!!

For red, dry eyes, clear eyes is awesome! Wowwwwwwwwwwwwwwww
 
To say that it's unfair for the top 10% to pay 75% of all taxes is a ludicrous statement, my friend. I'd say it should be even higher...

BYU - newsflash! Soviet Union tried the "egalitarian" approach and it did NOT work. Then again, Hillary might bring some of the communist ideas back soon...

Ummm, that wasn't me....
 

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