Big Netjets decision...Need Help!

[FLYnMONKEYS]

If I stayed here, my hope in a few years would be to eventually go to a place like Southwest.

!

What makes you think that Southwest is such a great place? Do you want to fly the same plane for the rest of your career? It's like working at a Walmart that moves fast.

Seriously, if the new TA passes I believe NJA could be a career type of place. The wages are below Southwest's but I also feel the surviving majors are going to join Southwest in the race to the bottom that they created. Southwest is responsible for brining low fares and low expectations to the public. When the hedging is over it will be a question of industry limbo. How low can you go?

In NJA's case rich people will always be here. If some rich guy loses it all it's only because someone else took it from him. A potential new owner Unlike Southwest we will better the company and marketshare by being flexible, innovative, and forward thinking. Not making price the only issue.

Southwest pilots may be the highest paid airline pilots in the country now, and that may be their ultimate demise as the cheaper low cost companies out Southwest them with their new found cheap labor.

I'm sticking with the rich people.

 

[semperfido]

It's like working at a Walmart that moves fast.

I also feel the surviving majors are going to join Southwest in the race to the bottom that they created. Southwest is responsible for brining low fares and low expectations to the public. When the hedging is over it will be a question of industry limbo. How low can you go?

.

i am riding on them next week and i am not looking forward to the inevitable "seat grab". if i end up in a middle seat next to a fat gang banger --oh well you get the picture---da monkey is right about this one.

 

[Stickshaker]

Will FLy

Will Fly,
If they have treated you so good, why havn't they paid you like a professional Pilot with a college degree. Because they want you to leave and move on so they can hire another CFI with 1500 hours. NJA is a no brainer for now. Please send me an email and I will send you my number to talk to you. I have been at NJA for 5 years and I have been with two 121 airlines as well as a part 91 flight department. Just e-mail me

 

[beytzim]

I'll be fashnizzled! Now that you have a descent T/A, Netjets is better than Southwest? Who are you kidding? I flew for NJA and now fly for SWA. Hands down, SWA is a better company, in every aspect:
1. Pay
2. Schedule
3. Managment/Employee Relationship
4. Fun on the job
5. Overnights
6. Overrall employee satisfaction.

Let me tell you something, brother, when you're making 200k+/year (12th year PIC pay) and only overnighting 8-10 nights a month, you can have a lot of FUN away from the job as well. Your family may even recognize you when you come home from a whopping MAXIMUM 4 day trip.

In the two months on the line at SWA, I've had more fun on overnights that I've had in a long time at Netjets. When you mix two sets of flights crews together (i.e. 10 of us) with SWA drink specials at most of our hotels you can have a lot of fun


Back to the original subject. SWA has consistently proven that working efficiently creates low fares - we are not bringing the industry down - we only fly to 61 cities - hardly a competitor to Northwest and Delta! The industry has destroyed itself through greedy unions and egotistical managment - read Hard Landing for God's sake!

 

[Gulfstream 200]

What makes you think that Southwest is such a great place? Do you want to fly the same plane for the rest of your career? It's like working at a Walmart that moves fast.

Seriously, if the new TA passes I believe NJA could be a career type of place. The wages are below Southwest's but I also feel the surviving majors are going to join Southwest in the race to the bottom that they created. Southwest is responsible for brining low fares and low expectations to the public. When the hedging is over it will be a question of industry limbo. How low can you go?

In NJA's case rich people will always be here. If some rich guy loses it all it's only because someone else took it from him. A potential new owner Unlike Southwest we will better the company and marketshare by being flexible, innovative, and forward thinking. Not making price the only issue.

Southwest pilots may be the highest paid airline pilots in the country now, and that may be their ultimate demise as the cheaper low cost companies out Southwest them with their new found cheap labor.

I'm sticking with the rich people.

After 10+/- years at SWA my guess is you will be doing a little better than Netjets industry breaking whopping 90K.

no?

While It's not my bag, FLYING for SWA is very different than RIDING on SWA.

It may not be old school Major Airline money, but it's not even in the same league as any fractional.

Netjets may be a fine place to work for a bit, but to consider that TA grounds for a "career" is absurd. Shoot high for you career.

reality - we dont hang with the rich guys, we unload thier bags and empty thier $hit pots. (OK, throw someone 20 and supervise it)

 

[semperfido]

very true... i am just dreading the whole check-in process...i am thinking as a pax not a pilot.

 

[Diesel]

god i hate queing for the A B C lines

 

[FLYnMONKEYS]

I'll be fashnizzled! Now that you have a descent T/A, Netjets is better than Southwest? Who are you kidding? I flew for NJA and now fly for SWA.

Never said NJ was better than Southwest. I was trying to relate the fact that flying in the majors is very much different than it used to be.

Southwest created a bussiness model that has changed the industry forever. Price is their clame to fame, while I'll admit their people are always friendly their service sucks. People only fly on them because they believe it's a good bargin. People used to put a premium on frequency of schedule, perks for frequent fliers (using points to go somewhere other than BWI), and eating on a flight, not to mention an assigned seat.

Now the other airlines are trying their hardest to be like Southwest. Some of these companies will not survive. Some of these companies will beat Southwest at their own game eventually. Don't know who but it will be the ones who are willing to lower the bar even more.

As for me, a former major airline pilot, I'm glad to be at NetJets. I believe over the long run it will be more stable than any airline, including Southwest. I put a premium on that.

 

[Semore Butts]

Shhhhheeeeattt!!! Thats easy....

Well go to Netjets for awhile and then go to SWA...

Get there before the TA.

(Bird in the hand theory)

 

[beytzim]

Netjets has hardly proven a succesful past fostering a successful future:

1. Netjets has laid off pilots before
2. Netjets management/union relationships are absolutely awful (even with the T/A)
Remember, you practically had to get on your knees for four years, begging to get a descent wage that Santulli promised you anyway in 2001.
3. Netjets' business model failed to bring a sustainable profit when sales were slowing. That's when Boisture tried to get a profit from Flight Operations - an impossiblity.
4. Further, the business model is flawed by the greedy unabated jump into the Marquis program. Eventually owners will demand to know why their aircraft are accumulating twice the hours they initially expected, dropping resale values and transforming NJA into a glorified charter company.

The fact is that Netjets has yet to establish a consistent business model that will work for the long term. So don't be so confident, my friend.

Poor people are very predictable- they always go to the 'percieved' cheapest airline. Rich people are much harder to predict: price is not really a factor, its percieved value and stature, which is very subjective - don't be so sure NJA will hold the top 'percieved value' forever. Netjets has become very inefficient, reversing the theory of econimies of scale, don't be so sure that smaller companies like CitationShares won't come and bite you in the a$$ with better efficiencies and values.

One more addendum. Many pilots grounded airplanes left and right for the last 12 months - that had to create some bad blood with the owners - those owners may go elsewhere when their contract ends.

Netjets future is hardly written in stone. A smart pilot would rely on FedEx/SWA/UPS for a a stable future, period.