Barger Out As JetBlue COO

[IronCityBlue]

little birdie told me

Let's just say I heard it from a birdy that the RJ and Dash build up wasn't just for connecting pax.....


Bye Bye--General Lee

I heard the same thing, also from a "little birdie" but I still don't believe it. I think it has a lot more (say, like, 100%) to do with providing connections to a rapidly expanding international hub than "messing with JB".

Think about it. The bigger DAL gets in JFK (and to a lesser extent NYC in general, due to total volume airspace issues) the more Delta is "messing with themselves" directly proportional to the extent that they are "messing with JetBlue".

Intl' flying is your bread and butter right now and will be for quite a while. Do you really think the powers that be are willing (and/or dumb enough in the first place) to intentionally disrupt the best thing they have going just to mess with JB, especially when you consider the more you mess with JB the more you're messing with yourself?

I think the NYC buildup for DAL is a smart move. We're still jam packed from the upstate area; the RJ's flying on top of us have had no significant effect. But they are oftentimes full too. That's because they're robbing pax that would have gone to CLT, PHL, DTW, MSP, EWR, ORD, etc. and connected on USAir, UAL, CAL or NWA.

So I think that "little birdie" on your end was doing a little ego boosting chest thumping, just like the little birdie I heard that rediculous theory from was hiding from the black helicopters looking for subdermal microchips. Not very credible a theory in either case, but it helps the time pass by in cruise though I guess.

 

[HomerJ]

HAHHAHAHAHHA! Look who got all of the bad press? You guys can't get enough bad press, and try to cover it hiring Chew, who will whip you guys into shape alright! What a joke. As Jay Leno said "Jet BLEW!" Oh wait, as Conan said "Jetblue, the May to August Airline."


Bye Bye--General Lee

The General, like his management, should stop worrying less about JB, and more about their own house. Unfortunately, we will see the 9000th post pretty soon, and more brilliant ideas like Song...

 

[AA717driver]

GL's still just whistling past the graveyard. That article on DL being the most financially vulnerable made him sweat a little. (And just when he was starting to get weaned off the Zanax after the USAir assassination attempt on his career... ) TC

 

[zkmayo]

As HomerJ was saying earlier, Dave B is as sharp as they come. That being said, he and DN are largely face men, DN for the financial/press/customer world, and DB for the company and suppliers. We need people like Chew and Ross to run the day to day ops and this is what is going on with this move.

 

[General Lee]

I heard the same thing, also from a "little birdie" but I still don't believe it. I think it has a lot more (say, like, 100%) to do with providing connections to a rapidly expanding international hub than "messing with JB".

Think about it. The bigger DAL gets in JFK (and to a lesser extent NYC in general, due to total volume airspace issues) the more Delta is "messing with themselves" directly proportional to the extent that they are "messing with JetBlue".

Intl' flying is your bread and butter right now and will be for quite a while. Do you really think the powers that be are willing (and/or dumb enough in the first place) to intentionally disrupt the best thing they have going just to mess with JB, especially when you consider the more you mess with JB the more you're messing with yourself?

I think the NYC buildup for DAL is a smart move. We're still jam packed from the upstate area; the RJ's flying on top of us have had no significant effect. But they are oftentimes full too. That's because they're robbing pax that would have gone to CLT, PHL, DTW, MSP, EWR, ORD, etc. and connected on USAir, UAL, CAL or NWA.

So I think that "little birdie" on your end was doing a little ego boosting chest thumping, just like the little birdie I heard that rediculous theory from was hiding from the black helicopters looking for subdermal microchips. Not very credible a theory in either case, but it helps the time pass by in cruise though I guess.

INTL flying is important to us, but not our bread and butter. Only about 30-35% of our revenue comes from it, up from 20% a couple years ago. We are trying to bring that up to 40%. ATL is by far the busiest hub in the world, and we fly 70% of the flights there. Most of that is domestic flying, and if you flew there you would see some of our 120 757s, 100 plus MD88s, many 738s, and some 767s doing domestic flying. They all bring in pax for our INTL connections in ATL, and that also occurs in JFK, with less mainline flights and more RJ connections though. As markets mature, more mainline flights will begin to connect with JFK INTL flights. We recently restarted our SAN to JFK flight (with a 757), plus added a PHX nonstop (738). PDX is coming back too, and DFW is also returning with an E170. Some of those Dash 8s are being replaced too with RJs to Upstate NY, which provides better competition with you guys too. Not everyone connects to Mumbai or Vencie, but plenty do.

Bye Bye--General Lee

 

[General Lee]

GL's still just whistling past the graveyard. That article on DL being the most financially vulnerable made him sweat a little. (And just when he was starting to get weaned off the Zanax after the USAir assassination attempt on his career... ) TC

The best joke I heard on TV about JB was the Conan joke: "Jetblue, the May through August Airline.." You just can't buy advertising like that.
I hope Chew doesn't chew you up and spit you out. I hear Dave Barger was walking around your terminal with veins sticking out of his head during that mess, about to have a stroke or heart attack. Wow, what a mess. Thank gawd you got Chew. Now Barger can relax more and meet Parker at the bar if he wants to.

Bye Bye--General Lee

 

[AA717driver]

The best joke I heard on TV about JB was the Conan joke: "Jetblue, the May through August Airline.." You just can't buy advertising like that.
I hope Chew doesn't chew you up and spit you out. I hear Dave Barger was walking around your terminal with veins sticking out of his head during that mess, about to have a stroke or heart attack. Wow, what a mess. Thank gawd you got Chew. Now Barger can relax more and meet Parker at the bar if he wants to.

Bye Bye--General Lee

GL--I'm not at JB. Couldn't take the pay cut. TC

 

[ImRickJames]

Worry about your Mesa RJ Flying

INTL flying is important to us, but not our bread and butter. Only about 30-35% of our revenue comes from it, up from 20% a couple years ago. We are trying to bring that up to 40%. ATL is by far the busiest hub in the world, and we fly 70% of the flights there. Most of that is domestic flying, and if you flew there you would see some of our 120 757s, 100 plus MD88s, many 738s, and some 767s doing domestic flying. They all bring in pax for our INTL connections in ATL, and that also occurs in JFK, with less mainline flights and more RJ connections though. As markets mature, more mainline flights will begin to connect with JFK INTL flights. We recently restarted our SAN to JFK flight (with a 757), plus added a PHX nonstop (738). PDX is coming back too, and DFW is also returning with an E170. Some of those Dash 8s are being replaced too with RJs to Upstate NY, which provides better competition with you guys too. Not everyone connects to Mumbai or Vencie, but plenty do.

Bye Bye--General Lee

What you need to worry about is the Mesa flying your Delta Connection. This has nothing to do with the pilots (good, pissed off pilot group) but with Management. I just left and I know we have an attrition problem. I believe Feb. saw attrition of around 75 FO's & Captains. March estimate, 100+. There will be a lot of cancelled flights (no crew), not allowing for pax connections and a lot of angry folks looking at Delta colors. It is so bad that the Union MEC, approached management about attrition and they blew it off as false. So why is Management offering $500 to new hires in ground school if they can recruit their pilot friends. Minimums have been lowered to 500/100. San Juan pilot program students don't need to interview anymore.

There is a mass exodus of even 1st and 2nd year FO's leaving to other regionals. There will not be enough pilots to fly airplanes and plenty of cancellations. I know Delta can not afford this coming out of Bankruptcy. Look into it and ask around. Once again, this is a management issue and not a pilot group one.

 

[zkmayo]

The best joke I heard on TV about JB was the Conan joke: "Jetblue, the May through August Airline.." You just can't buy advertising like that.
I hope Chew doesn't chew you up and spit you out. I hear Dave Barger was walking around your terminal with veins sticking out of his head during that mess, about to have a stroke or heart attack. Wow, what a mess. Thank gawd you got Chew. Now Barger can relax more and meet Parker at the bar if he wants to.

Bye Bye--General Lee

You also cant buy advertising like "Hey, this is still better than Delta!" on the Letterman top 10 list.

 

[General Lee]

What you need to worry about is the Mesa flying your Delta Connection. This has nothing to do with the pilots (good, pissed off pilot group) but with Management. I just left and I know we have an attrition problem. I believe Feb. saw attrition of around 75 FO's & Captains. March estimate, 100+. There will be a lot of cancelled flights (no crew), not allowing for pax connections and a lot of angry folks looking at Delta colors. It is so bad that the Union MEC, approached management about attrition and they blew it off as false. So why is Management offering $500 to new hires in ground school if they can recruit their pilot friends. Minimums have been lowered to 500/100. San Juan pilot program students don't need to interview anymore.

There is a mass exodus of even 1st and 2nd year FO's leaving to other regionals. There will not be enough pilots to fly airplanes and plenty of cancellations. I know Delta can not afford this coming out of Bankruptcy. Look into it and ask around. Once again, this is a management issue and not a pilot group one.

We have seven vendors, and Mesa isn't the biggest. They can be replaced.


Bye Bye--General Lee

 

[rayford steele]

HAHHAHAHAHHA! Look who got all of the bad press? You guys can't get enough bad press, and try to cover it hiring Chew, who will whip you guys into shape alright! What a joke. As Jay Leno said "Jet BLEW!" Oh wait, as Conan said "Jetblue, the May to August Airline."


Bye Bye--General Lee

Yeah but as Letterman said in his top ten, "still better than flying on Delta".

 

[rayford steele]

Yeah but as Letterman said in his top ten, "still better than flying on Delta".

Never mind ZK beat me to it.

 

[General Lee]

You also cant buy advertising like "Hey, this is still better than Delta!" on the Letterman top 10 list.

That was funny. Leno called them "Jet Blew" and Letterman reamed Neeleman in person. Ouch.

Bye Bye--General Lee

 

[Fins Up]

Letterman had always had a grudge against us for some reason. Maybe he's a union guy. It's not surprising to hear him give us a hard time.

 

[sayagain?]

General-

I'm sure it's been asked before, but, do you have a life outside of FI?

 

[737 Pylt]

And who's fault was that?...please enlighten us....


And just in case you're feeling good about JetBlue and Airways "helping you out"....take a stroll down to the Delta Connection gates at JFK and experience first hand what Ellis Island was like circa 1904.

I don't care who you are, that's funny! I've never heard it described that way, but I'm gonna have to use that one!:laugh:

737

 

[General Lee]

General-

I'm sure it's been asked before, but, do you have a life outside of FI?

Absolutely. I enjoy life to the fullest. I hope you do too.


Bye Bye--General Lee

 

[atcloser]

I think you all may be missing the big picture here. Russ Chew came from the FAA. He was there for a few years and left at a time when things are spiraling out of control. He created the ATO (Air Traffic Organization), and since its implementation, has short staffed the entire ATC system to the bare minimum, increased user fees for you folk, and made conditions at the FAA worse than they were in 1981. He had an integral part in busting up the unions in that FAA, and now, the FAA is bleeding controllers who are retiring and quitting because things are so bad. Rumor inside the agency is that Chew was asked by Blakely to resign because things are so screwed up right now. This is a man who continuously tells the FAA workforce and the media that the ATC system is overstaffed and everyone is happy. Well when the FAA has to call in overtime every single shift because of short staffing, denied people sick leave (who then come to work puking their brains out) because they are too short, and when operational errors are going through the roof because postions cannot be decombined because there are no bodies to work them, then I'd say there is a problem. The man steered a ship into a huge iceberg and jumped off.

It will remain to be seen as to whether he steers another ship into another iceberg now. I personally think this is the worst move JBU could have made for both its employees and customers.

http://www.govexec.com/story_page.cfm?articleid=27127&ref=rellink

 

[Cookie Monster]

Absolutely. I enjoy life to the fullest. I hope you do too.


Bye Bye--General Lee

I have said it before, and I will say it again:

Arguing on the internet is like running in the special olympics, even if you win, you are still retarded.

 

[clickclickboom]

I have said it before, and I will say it again:

Arguing on the internet is like running in the special olympics, even if you win, you are still retarded.

Actually that should read at the end " general lee "


8 tausand ferhundred and teanty posts my name iz ganerel wee

 

[Heavy Set]

I have said it before, and I will say it again:

Arguing on the internet is like running in the special olympics, even if you win, you are still retarded.

Except if you have good points and make the others look like they are retarded. You need to give credit where credit is due. This is a forum and people can argue.

 

[Heavy Set]

Actually that should read at the end " general lee "


8 tausand ferhundred and teanty posts my name iz ganerel wee

Most of his posts make people like you look dumb. The only way you know how to respond is to bash him, like this post. Show some ballz, try to debate him. If you cannot, which is obvious, try to show some restraint. I enjoy his posts because they bring some insight, which yours do not.

 

[FDJ2]

Most of his posts make people like you look dumb. The only way you know how to respond is to bash him, like this post. Show some ballz, try to debate him. If you cannot, which is obvious, try to show some restraint. I enjoy his posts because they bring some insight, which yours do not.

I agree completely. The General also tends to debate with facts instead of emotions. That's tough on the guys with limited knowledge. Their response to the General's reasoned posts tend to just be juvenile personal attacks.

 

[clickclickboom]

Most of his posts make people like you look dumb. The only way you know how to respond is to bash him, like this post. Show some ballz, try to debate him. If you cannot, which is obvious, try to show some restraint. I enjoy his posts because they bring some insight, which yours do not.

Considering that I have only responded to 2 of his 8500 posts in this case I will happily stand defeated. There you and the general win.

I have a low opinion of so called forum experts who have the short sighted opinion that the airline they collect a paycheck from is completely 100% perfect and every other possible employer is crap. Unlike you and others i do wish that we can all improve our way of life and industry post 911,,,

 

[General Lee]

Considering that I have only responded to 2 of his 8500 posts in this case I will happily stand defeated. There you and the general win.

I have a low opinion of so called forum experts who have the short sighted opinion that the airline they collect a paycheck from is completely 100% perfect and every other possible employer is crap. Unlike you and others i do wish that we can all improve our way of life and industry post 911,,,

Say what? I have never said Delta was perfect. We have been through some very rough times, and I think we are now starting to get on the right track. I enjoy my job and tend to be a bit more positive than most, and some people, like yourself, take that wrong. I recently stated I would not want to be a Southwest pilot because of their busy schedule, and for that I was lambasted again. I don't mind getting slammed, but please state why and try to show some facts or back up your opinion. If you can't do that and choose only to slam, then you are a dumba#@ and it shows. Making fun of my number of posts just shows your ignorance. A lot of those were responses to other people's questions or opinions, and I have been on this board since before 9-11. When I sit down and respond, it may be to many many posts.

Bye Bye--General Lee

 

[IronCityBlue]

dashes, RJ's and hubris, OH MY!

INTL flying is important to us, but not our bread and butter. Only about 30-35% of our revenue comes from it, up from 20% a couple years ago. We are trying to bring that up to 40%. ATL is by far the busiest hub in the world, and we fly 70% of the flights there. Most of that is domestic flying, and if you flew there you would see some of our 120 757s, 100 plus MD88s, many 738s, and some 767s doing domestic flying. They all bring in pax for our INTL connections in ATL, and that also occurs in JFK, with less mainline flights and more RJ connections though. As markets mature, more mainline flights will begin to connect with JFK INTL flights. We recently restarted our SAN to JFK flight (with a 757), plus added a PHX nonstop (738). PDX is coming back too, and DFW is also returning with an E170. Some of those Dash 8s are being replaced too with RJs to Upstate NY, which provides better competition with you guys too. Not everyone connects to Mumbai or Vencie, but plenty do.

Bye Bye--General Lee

So by saying your INTL revenue has almost doubled in a few short years, you're saying Intl' flying is very, very important to your operation, and is increasing in importance at a rapid rate. Thats what I meant about "bread and butter". And of course you guys are huge in ATL, even bigger than NYC. But NYC in general, and NYC international in particular, are increasing in importance by the day. That's why I don't believe Delta would spam JFK with RJ's in an attempt to sabotage JetBlue; any dammage done would be done to yourselves as much or more than it would be to JB.

Its kinda like saying you're spamming ATL with RJ's in large part to disrupt AirTran's operations. Makes for great "my airline can beat up your airline" rhetoric, but it just doesn't hold water as a credible theory.

And I don't think adding RJ's to the upstate will be a competitive blow to us in the least. Replacing Dash 8's with RJ's increases per seat cost substantially, and its doubtful you'll get very many additional pax that way, above the ones you would have gotten anyway due primarilly to INTL connections/Skymiles/domestic connex we don't serve/etc, and its those pax that would have just as likely flown on the Dash 8 in the first place.

Rumor has it ATL is back on the short list (only this time from JFK and maybe BOS instead of fragmented flights from the west coast) and if/when that happens I'm sure we'll have plenty of people chest thumping about how it was done in revenge for Delta's dash 8 disruption tactics, etc. when there's just a slight chance it had a lot more (i.e. 100%) to do with linking our 14 million resident metro area to a popular 6 million resident metro area. Nah, retaliation for the Dash's is probably a more credible theory.

And yes, I have seen your ATL operation. Though not without its own unique challenges, its very impressive and well run by comparison to any other hub its size. Not sure why you mentioned that though, since I never said otherwise.

 

[jbucpt]

I agree completely. The General also tends to debate with facts instead of emotions. That's tough on the guys with limited knowledge. Their response to the General's reasoned posts tend to just be juvenile personal attacks.

lets list some of general lee's "facts":

1. age 65 will never pass due to a "supreme court" decision.
2. SONG flights are full, DELTA is making alot of money (he was the biggest defender of the SONG "adventure").

do you want me to continue??

 

[DIAMONDDD]

Yes, please do.

 

[F/O]

In light of what just happened in Feb., I rather enjoyed watching Neeleman patting himself on the back back in November...

http://www.wingsclub.org/speeches_nov06.html

 

[Heavy Set]

lets list some of general lee's "facts":

1. age 65 will never pass due to a "supreme court" decision.
2. SONG flights are full, DELTA is making alot of money (he was the biggest defender of the SONG "adventure").

do you want me to continue??

Before you slam GL, you need to fix your own sham of an operation. I bet the "Song" flights, now on MD88s, were full and have been full since your Valentine's debacle. How are those Expressjet E145s doing for you too? At least Delta shows passengers ahead of time that they will fly on an RJ, so they can actually choose whether or not they want to fly on it. Your airline is making plenty of "one time Jetblue flyers." And, has age 65 actually passed yet? It may coming up here, but not yet. Please continue to make a fool out of yourself and your airline. General Lee backs up his opinions at least.