Bare Minimum Time For A Job?

[weekendwarrior]

I think being a CFI is a falicy that most people think they "have" to do in order to get a job. If one has no resources to build time (friends, partial ownership, etc) then maybe a CFI is the way to go. For me, I own my own airplane, a C-140. I build my time in that, plus it gives me the tailwheel experience I need to get a job towing sailplanes if necessary.

$6,000 The cost of getting CFI, CFII, MEI) can buy alot of gas in my Cessna 140. I have a perfect time builder that for the price and time I"d spend on getting a CFI, etc I could have built the time I need to meet the minimums. Then all I need is the multi time which I couldn't get around here with 10 hours of multi time anyway. Insurance requirements at my school for MEI's are 250 hours multi and 1000 TT to be an instructor.

Towing gliders is also another option. I'm approaching the tailwheel minimums for that as well. It has been done by people that I know, so I'm still going to avoid the CFI thing if I can.

My point is, no, you do not have to have your CFI. Being resourceful, finding a good deal on a cheap airplane, buying into a partnership, washing and detailing airplanes in exchange for time, etc, will get you the time that you need. And, it is on your watch, not a flight school that is going to under pay you for long hours.

If I run out of money, don't have an airplane to fly, and am stuck at 600 hours, then ok. I'll give. But in the mean time, the task at hand is to get the bare minimum requirements to start flying somewhere.

 

[willi7]

cfi

It's not just how many hours you have, it's the type of hours you have!! Towing gliders and flying around in a 140 by yourself will not compare to the experience of working with different personalities and teaching! An employer wants to see certain things on your resume not just TT.

 

[weekendwarrior]

Good point. I see where that could show the personal ability. As far as aircraft flying is concerned, it's probably about equal, as most time will be in 152, 172, Warrior, etc.

My logic is that if I can shine in the interview with personal skills and good references, they will hopefully see that I have the TT, as well as the personal skills. One thing for sure is that being a CFI has it's advantages, as you really get to know the material since you are breathing it everyday, as opposed to just flying....Both sides work for me, but I really don't care to instruct new pilots how to fly. If I could get comm/IFR students, it would be ideal, but that's in a different world I'm sure.

 

[BigFlyr]

I know of guy who, years ago bought an old Aztec, parked it for about one year, painted it, sold it, made money and pencil-whiped some 500+ hours of multi-time which helped him to land a commuter job!!! Where he is now, I don't know but there I was working my @$$ off... Don't get me wrong though, people who cheat eventually get caught and I'm sure he'll get his if he hasn't already. The point is... if you're going to fly your own airplane to build time in it you should have a way of verifying it's usage. By using it for flight instruction would be one such way and the money you make could at least pay for the airplane.

 

[weekendwarrior]

He's only cheating himself. With my situation, if someone wants to verify my time, they are more than welcome to look at the tach time and note the maintenance in the aircraft logbook. That would be absolute proof, since it is my airplane that has logbook entries for routine and major maintenance. But since I run an honest logbook, I'm not concerned about it. Also, when I take people with me (which is quite often) I put their names in my logbook. Both for memories, as well as something other than "practiced touch and goes". And hey, I definately have the fuel bills to show for it!

 

[Steve]

Cessna 140

Weekendwarrior,

How much did the 140 set you back? I was thinking of getting a 140 myself.

 

[weekendwarrior]

$20,000. I've seen them from $17,000 on up to $30,000. Mine has gyros, radio, xponder, VOR/LOC/GS. I wouldn't fly it IFR though. The gyros are all venturi driven and are not that accurate. Not to mention, the VOR/LOC/GS/COMM all use the same antenna, so an ILS isn't that accurate either. Anyway, it is a fair weather machine, time builder. Costs about $10.00/hour to operate. (not including engine reserves) Dirt cheap flying. Unless something breaks, of course. I did have to have a cylinder overhauled at about $600. Nevertheless, I've flown about 50 hours so far in it, and have only put about $1000 into it, plus gas and insurance.

Not to mention tailwheel flying will make you a better pilot. Keeps you awake on t/o and landing. It's a real dream to fly, though. Low and slow, cheap, etc. It does not do well over mountains in the summer time. Density altitude is not good when you only have 85 HP.

 

[Steve]

What's the cost of insurance for a low time pilot (I have 300 hours with a Commercial license) for a 140? I 'v looked at a few 140s and am considering purchasing one.

 

[willi7]

instruction

weekend just think of how well you would do if you got your cfi, (shouldn't cost you more than 2000 maybe 2500) and then instructed in it. You would have to do regular maint, but you can charge whatever you want for your time as well as for the airplane. You may even make some money. And the kicker is you get to chose who you instruct. Best of both worlds!!

 

[weekendwarrior]

I looked into that. The insurance is about $5,000/year as opposed to $1200/year. Not to mention my plane is a tailwheel, and unless I was giving tailwheel checkouts, it's pretty useless. The last thing I would want to do with my airplane is to teach someone how to land a tailwheel. Too much abuse, expense, and if they ground loop the thing, it goes on my record, being PIC.

Not worth it.

 

[weekendwarrior]

I only had 190 TT and no tailwheel time when I bought my 140. The insurance is $1200/year, and that included getting a tailwheel endorsement in my airplane. I just had to put my CFI on the policy for the tailwheel. Got the insurance through Nationair. Great guys. http://www.nationair.com ask for JT Helms.

 

[cpritchie5]

Instructing is not the most glorifying job but it gives you valuable experience dealing with people. When you get a job and upgrade to captain one of the roles is to be a teacher. The experience also comes in hany if you want to become a check Airman as well.

CR

 

[DesertFalcon]

WeekendWarrior;

I'll say it in only a few words, "Become a Flight Instructor".
It's worth the experience!

I have also heard that some companies won't consider you unless you have been a flight instructor in the past?

 

[Aviator]

Being an aircraft owner myself, I agree with weekendwarrior's logic. I've logged nearly 500 hours of quality time. In the last 4 years, I've flown coast to coast three times and even been island hopping in the Bahamas and down to Baja several times. It's been a blast! Planning to go to Alaska in August. I've been primarily doing IFR training flight between San Diego and LA shooting multiple approaches. Always try to fly with people more experienced than myself. My goal is hone my flying skills to a professional level. The opportunity for networking alone with this method more than justifies this approach to timebuilding. I've flown with several airline pilots and even a WW2 B25 bomber pilot. Last week a friend brought home $50 for a week of instructing. He was at the airport 6 days for 10 hours a day. Granted he is just starting out and this will change over time. I agree that instructing has many advantages both in the present and for the future. But if you have the means, aircraft ownership is a viable option for gaining real world experience. (BTW my insurance is $400 a year/last annual $175)

 

[norskman2]

Aviator,

I too am intrigued by the idea of buying a cheap plane and building some hours.

But I don't get it -- who are these more professional pilots you fly with? People you know? Just pilots you meet hanging out at the FBO? Do you entice them with a free trip to Baja?

We'd all love to network, but I'm just wondering where you're meeting all these other pilots.