Welcome to Flightinfo.com

  • Register now and join the discussion
  • Friendliest aviation Ccmmunity on the web
  • Modern site for PC's, Phones, Tablets - no 3rd party apps required
  • Ask questions, help others, promote aviation
  • Share the passion for aviation
  • Invite everyone to Flightinfo.com and let's have fun

B-1 Gear Up Accident?

Welcome to Flightinfo.com

  • Register now and join the discussion
  • Modern secure site, no 3rd party apps required
  • Invite your friends
  • Share the passion of aviation
  • Friendliest aviation community on the web
Register   Log in
Pistlpetet said:
http://www.sftt.us/cgi-bin/csNews/csNews.cgi?database=Unlisted%2edb&command=viewone&id=41

"From all indications, it appears this was a good, old fashioned, unintentional gear up landing. Investigation is ongoing but a preliminary scrub of the tower transmission tapes has our controllers telling the B-1 to report a five mile final with the gear. They received a positive response. Pilot in command was an O-4."
Click to expand...

I'd be curious as to where you got that info. I'd also be curious as to why it was released and why you posted it here.
 
MAGNUM!! said:
I'd be curious as to where you got that info. I'd also be curious as to why it was released and why you posted it here.
Click to expand...

1. I'd be curious as to where you got that info.

Answer: From the website you read it.

2. I'd also be curious as to why it was released.

Answer: Because some AF guy let it be released.

3. Why you posted it here.

Answer: Because inquiring Pilot minds want to know.
 
Magnum, I'm with you, this shouldn't have been released, but reading the web site it looks like it came from the Navy. I guess that's what happens when you don't own the base.
 
Pearl sounds like a class A kiss ass. Nice to have such a cavalier attitude about somebody else's misfortunes.

I'm so relieved that he's not worried about eating brown lettuce. It will go with his nose.

Definitely an Admiral in the making.

There is no way that should be out on the internet.

FJ
 
OK guys, devil's advocate time - why should military mishaps, b0ners, etc, NOT be released? If a civil aircraft goes down, all pertinent info is released as it is discovered.

Note I'm not talking about speculation, I'm talking about mishap facts as released by the military itself. Yes, it sucks for the crew, but if they screwed up, then they pay the price. It shouldn't be a hush-hush thing, as if the military is "embarrassed."
 
Gorilla said:
OK guys, devil's advocate time - why should military mishaps, b0ners, etc, NOT be released? If a civil aircraft goes down, all pertinent info is released as it is discovered.

Note I'm not talking about speculation, I'm talking about mishap facts as released by the military itself. Yes, it sucks for the crew, but if they screwed up, then they pay the price. It shouldn't be a hush-hush thing, as if the military is "embarrassed."
Click to expand...

Often during mishaps, only people directly involved know exactly what happened. They know all the human factors issues going on at home, at work, sleep patterns, family life, 72 hour histories, etc. All those things can contribute to a mishap. AFI 91-202 and -204 specifically deal with MISHAP PREVENTION. We put together TAB T's so other AIRCREW can get all the contributing factors to avoid similar pitfalls in the future.

That said, if you weren't sleeping well, were having an affair, or ANYTHING that might look bad in the press, would you fess up in an accident investigation? Hell, no. Why would you? We use confidentiality to get ALL the facts and contributing factors, no matter how ugly and scandalous they may be, and to prevent the same thing from happening in the future. Nothing like learning from other's dumb mistakes.

If someone breaks a reg or commits a crime, there is an avenue for that. The AIB. All the above stuff deals with the SIB. If the SIB president deems that an AIB is warranted, he gets with the commanders and the JAG and does so. That stuff can be made public.

Sounds like you need to get your annual "safety confidentiality" refresher brief. You guys DO do that in your unit, don't you? :D
 
Last edited:
Magnum. one slight correction to what you said. An AIB is required by law if the accident cost exceeds 1 million. So to answer the above post. If the accident exceeds 1 million all the facts will be released through the Freedom of Information Act. Note, I said facts. In an AIB they produce a documet called the Summary of Facts, in it they list all the facts of the accidednt and that's it. No speculation or guess on what happened. Then they produce another one called Statement of Opinion, this is the board presidents opinion of what caused the accident. Throughtout this process the lawers review all documents and are present for all questioning. Thier primary job is to protect "privilege", which is what is given to the people interviewed by the SIB. Like Magnum said, without privilege the people interviewed may not tell what "really" happened.

Both boards, the SIB & AIB are very thourough but independant. This allows the military to both comply with the FIA and find out what really happened.
 
Gorilla said:
OK guys, devil's advocate time - why should military mishaps, b0ners, etc, NOT be released? If a civil aircraft goes down, all pertinent info is released as it is discovered.

Note I'm not talking about speculation, I'm talking about mishap facts as released by the military itself. Yes, it sucks for the crew, but if they screwed up, then they pay the price. It shouldn't be a hush-hush thing, as if the military is "embarrassed."
Click to expand...

Release of some information about mishaps and accidents could give any potential enemy information on weaknesses in equipment or training. Just because you wanna know, doesn't mean you need to know.
 
RickKC-135 said:
Magnum. one slight correction to what you said. An AIB is required by law if the accident cost exceeds 1 million. So to answer the above post. If the accident exceeds 1 million all the facts will be released through the Freedom of Information Act. Note, I said facts. In an AIB they produce a documet called the Summary of Facts, in it they list all the facts of the accidednt and that's it. No speculation or guess on what happened. Then they produce another one called Statement of Opinion, this is the board presidents opinion of what caused the accident. Throughtout this process the lawers review all documents and are present for all questioning. Thier primary job is to protect "privilege", which is what is given to the people interviewed by the SIB. Like Magnum said, without privilege the people interviewed may not tell what "really" happened.

Both boards, the SIB & AIB are very thourough but independant. This allows the military to both comply with the FIA and find out what really happened.
Click to expand...

I'd have to look that up. I've been an IO on two Class As (F-16 and MQ-1) in the past four years and neither convened an AIB. One is automatically triggered, but the BP of the SIB can recommend no AIB and if everyone agrees, none is convened. They still might put out a summary of facts, but that's basically Part I of the report. Anyway, I'm not saying you're wrong by the letter of the law, but an AIB wasn't convened in either of the Class A's I investigated. My knowledge isn't complete in that area since I spent all my time writing the Tab T monster.

Other than maybe that, I agree with everything you said. Again, I'd have to look up the reg.
 
Magnum, you're right there is one exception to the Class A misshap rule and that's the F-16. They have so many that they have given up doing AIBs on them. Nobody cares anymore. Just kidding, but it might be true, I saw a Class A with an F-16 flameout and they didn't do an AIB. It can be waived but it's a pretty high official who waives it, and I don't know who that is right now.
 

Share this page

Latest posts

Latest resources

Latest media

Carbon Cub FX-3 Shenandoah Valley
Carbon Cub at Kittyhawk
FX-3 in the backcountry
IFR Panel in a Carbon Cub FX-3
Cub-Provo-UT-c.jpg
Back
Top Bottom