Attn: Delta Pilots

[General Lee]

Mike: I read it again. I stand by my observation.

If its just posturing, as the General says, why bother.

How about a simple if they throw out our contract we will walk away. Leave it at that.

I am behind you guys 100%.

FJ

Thanks FJ. I know you support us. I never said I thought we were all unwilling to strike, rather what I thought the process would look like. Posturing is just part of this process, and I told Minime that. If management is reading this board, then they probably will find plenty of discontent. I think we all know what will eventually happen, a mutually agreed upon settlement that suks for both sides, but preserving some things for both sides too. I am ready to walk if necessary, and so are almost all of the pilots I have personally talked to. Thanks again for your support and I understand what you are saying. It is true that IF THEY THROW OUT OUR CONTRACT, WE WILL WALK.


Bye Bye--General Lee

 

[Buckaroo]

Thanks FJ. I know you support us. I never said I thought we were all unwilling to strike, rather what I thought the process would look like. Posturing is just part of this process, and I told Minime that. If management is reading this board, then they probably will find plenty of discontent. I think we all know what will eventually happen, a mutually agreed upon settlement that suks for both sides, but preserving some things for both sides too. I am ready to walk if necessary, and so are almost all of the pilots I have personally talked to. Thanks again for your support and I understand what you are saying. It is true that IF THEY THROW OUT OUR CONTRACT, WE WILL WALK.


Bye Bye--General Lee

General,

There will be no such thing as a strike. As soon as Delta "pilots" walk off of the job, Delta will cease to exist as a company. There will be no job to strike. Do any of you guys understand this? The gravy train has departed -
The Airline industry is operating under a whole new set of rules, and Labor Unions like DALPA are no longer calling the shots.

 

[General Lee]

General,

There will be no such thing as a strike. As soon as Delta "pilots" walk off of the job, Delta will cease to exist as a company. There will be no job to strike. Do any of you guys understand this? The gravy train has departed -
The Airline industry is operating under a whole new set of rules, and Labor Unions like DALPA are no longer calling the shots.

We understand that the "Gravy train" has departed for the time being, but that doesn't mean we have to give up everything. Nope. We will stand our ground and keep what we want to keep. There are a lot of jobs at stake, and HUGE payoffs to management when the new stock comes out (like United and their 8% of new stock to management). Do you think they want to give up their "gravy train?" How about all of the creditors and vendors that make money off of us? How about the local and State governments that need the jobs? Will they pressure Delta to make a deal? Will the Governor intervene? Ummmmmm yes. You can't see the forest through the trees Buckaroo. We will fight for what we want. The negative publicity alone makes Dalpa a strong player. We may not add to our fortunes much, but we will keep things we need to keep.


Bye Bye--General Lee

 

[Buckaroo]

We understand that the "Gravy train" has departed for the time being, but that doesn't mean we have to give up everything. Nope. We will stand our ground and keep what we want to keep. There are a lot of jobs at stake, and HUGE payoffs to management when the new stock comes out (like United and their 8% of new stock to management). Do you think they want to give up their "gravy train?" How about all of the creditors and vendors that make money off of us? How about the local and State governments that need the jobs? Will they pressure Delta to make a deal? Will the Governor intervene? Ummmmmm yes. You can't see the forest through the trees Buckaroo. We will fight for what we want. The negative publicity alone makes Dalpa a strong player. We may not add to our fortunes much, but we will keep things we need to keep.


Bye Bye--General Lee

General,

Evidently, DALPA doesn't realize the gravy train has departed - They are now demanding 2004 wages - What a joke!

Saturday, February 11, 2006 Delta pilots want wages restored | Print |
HARRY R. WEBER - The Associated Press ATLANTA -- A Delta Air Lines Inc. official told management employees Friday that the company's pilots are asking that their wage scales be restored to December 2004 levels after a certain period.
Dan Lewis, the company's vice president of corporate communications, said in a memo to officers and directors that the request was made in the latest offer on new pay and benefit cuts by the union representing Delta's 6,000 pilots.
Lewis said the union also wants an interest-bearing note of roughly $1 billion, presumably in case the pilots' defined benefit pension is terminated. Lewis said Delta has offered the pilots a $300 million note.
The newly revealed terms come as negotiators for both sides try to reach a pact on a second round of concessions before a March 1 deadline. If they can't, a three-person arbitration panel will decide Delta's request that its contract with its pilots be thrown out so the company can impose $325 million in cuts unilaterally.
The chairman of the union's executive committee, Lee Moak, said Thursday that the pilots will strike if their contract is thrown out. The company has said a strike would put the nation's third-largest carrier out of business.
In late 2004, Delta's pilots agreed to $1 billion in annual concessions, which included a 32.5 percent pay cut. The company's latest proposal on new cuts asks for another 18 percent pay reduction, Lewis said in the memo. The union wants pay scales restored to the levels they were after the 2004 deal following a certain period, Lewis said. He didn't specify the period.
A union spokesman, Ken Frydman, did not immediately respond Friday to questions about the company memo. But Moak, in a letter to pilots posted on the union Web site Friday, said management is the one that is playing hardball.
"It is in management's best interest to understand that it is time to abandon their 'demand philosophy' and return to the time-honored practice of earnest negotiating," Moak wrote.
Moak also said in the letter that the termination of the pilot pension plan would provide the company with massive savings, "yet they propose to credit us with less than 10 percent of those savings." Moak said Thursday that Delta has told the union that it believes the pension plan will be terminated. A Delta spokesman said the airline has made no decision about the pension.
Delta, which filed for bankruptcy protection in September, has said repeatedly that it needs $325 million in new concessions from its pilots as part of its turnaround plan. The pilots' latest offer calls for $115 million in annual concessions.
Lewis said in his memo that the company's latest offer reduces the total amount of concessions it is seeking from $325 million to $315 million, despite the risk that would add to Delta's restructuring plan. Moak said Thursday that Delta was still stuck at $325 million.
Lewis accused the union, the Air Line Pilots Association, of failing to share with the company the union's own financial analysis of what it believes the company requires for a successful reorganization.
"That has prevented the company from assessing the financial basis for ALPA's proposals," Lewis said.
Two months ago, Delta and its pilots reached an agreement on interim wage cuts of 14 percent and other cuts equal to an additional 1 percent wage reduction, which would be worth about $143 million to $152 million on an annual basis. The purpose was to give the sides time to reach a permanent comprehensive agreement.
Delta pilots were earning on average $169,393 annually prior to the interim pay cuts two months ago, according to papers filed by the company in bankruptcy court.
Delta has reported $11.6 billion in losses since January 2001. It is scheduled to report its fourth-quarter and year-end 2005 results on Tuesday.
This story appeared in The Daily Herald on page D6.

Close Window ​

 

[AAflyer]

DAL & NWA should form a pact against the 1113. Having 15000+ pilots say they will walk if management won't do the right thing would be a great Business Headline in USA Today.

Draw the line in the sand and stand fast!!!

Good luck to all!

Baja.

Actually that doesn't sound that bad, both groups under the same pressure. It certainly would show that ALPA airlines are in this mess together, as well as showing a little solidarity. Not to mention the the result may be better in large numbers. Have either MECs talked to one another yet?

AA

 

[General Lee]

General,

Evidently, DALPA doesn't realize the gravy train has departed - They are now demanding 2004 wages - What a joke!

Saturday, February 11, 2006 Delta pilots want wages restored | Print |
HARRY R. WEBER - The Associated Press ATLANTA -- A Delta Air Lines Inc. official told management employees Friday that the company's pilots are asking that their wage scales be restored to December 2004 levels after a certain period.
Dan Lewis, the company's vice president of corporate communications, said in a memo to officers and directors that the request was made in the latest offer on new pay and benefit cuts by the union representing Delta's 6,000 pilots.
Lewis said the union also wants an interest-bearing note of roughly $1 billion, presumably in case the pilots' defined benefit pension is terminated. Lewis said Delta has offered the pilots a $300 million note.
The newly revealed terms come as negotiators for both sides try to reach a pact on a second round of concessions before a March 1 deadline. If they can't, a three-person arbitration panel will decide Delta's request that its contract with its pilots be thrown out so the company can impose $325 million in cuts unilaterally.
The chairman of the union's executive committee, Lee Moak, said Thursday that the pilots will strike if their contract is thrown out. The company has said a strike would put the nation's third-largest carrier out of business.
In late 2004, Delta's pilots agreed to $1 billion in annual concessions, which included a 32.5 percent pay cut. The company's latest proposal on new cuts asks for another 18 percent pay reduction, Lewis said in the memo. The union wants pay scales restored to the levels they were after the 2004 deal following a certain period, Lewis said. He didn't specify the period.
A union spokesman, Ken Frydman, did not immediately respond Friday to questions about the company memo. But Moak, in a letter to pilots posted on the union Web site Friday, said management is the one that is playing hardball.
"It is in management's best interest to understand that it is time to abandon their 'demand philosophy' and return to the time-honored practice of earnest negotiating," Moak wrote.
Moak also said in the letter that the termination of the pilot pension plan would provide the company with massive savings, "yet they propose to credit us with less than 10 percent of those savings." Moak said Thursday that Delta has told the union that it believes the pension plan will be terminated. A Delta spokesman said the airline has made no decision about the pension.
Delta, which filed for bankruptcy protection in September, has said repeatedly that it needs $325 million in new concessions from its pilots as part of its turnaround plan. The pilots' latest offer calls for $115 million in annual concessions.
Lewis said in his memo that the company's latest offer reduces the total amount of concessions it is seeking from $325 million to $315 million, despite the risk that would add to Delta's restructuring plan. Moak said Thursday that Delta was still stuck at $325 million.
Lewis accused the union, the Air Line Pilots Association, of failing to share with the company the union's own financial analysis of what it believes the company requires for a successful reorganization.
"That has prevented the company from assessing the financial basis for ALPA's proposals," Lewis said.
Two months ago, Delta and its pilots reached an agreement on interim wage cuts of 14 percent and other cuts equal to an additional 1 percent wage reduction, which would be worth about $143 million to $152 million on an annual basis. The purpose was to give the sides time to reach a permanent comprehensive agreement.
Delta pilots were earning on average $169,393 annually prior to the interim pay cuts two months ago, according to papers filed by the company in bankruptcy court.
Delta has reported $11.6 billion in losses since January 2001. It is scheduled to report its fourth-quarter and year-end 2005 results on Tuesday.
This story appeared in The Daily Herald on page D6.

Close Window ​

"The union wants pay scales restored to the levels they were after the 2004 deal following a certain period, Lewis said. He didn't specify the period."


READ THAT AGAIN BUCKAROO. AFTER THE 2004 DEAL.(after we gave $1 billion a year) You seemed to oversee this part. That is the same as asking for our last 14% pay cut back that we just handed them Dec 15th of 2005. We actually have a pre-bankruptcy letter signed by Grinstein that stated if we go to bankruptcy, they would not ask for X X X X etc. He also said "Do it once, do it right." Remember that? Does that mean we are back on the gravy train? No. You also seemed to forget the other part I also posted with that....about the 85% RASM we are getting compared to other Majors. We charge less, but the new guy incharge of revenue management said we will reclaim some of that lost $2.5 BILLION a year in 2006 and 2007. So, do you think we could have some of the 47% pay cut we have taken back when times are better? We didn't say right now, we said at a later date? Is that hard to do when your revenue guy says we will reclaim a bunch of the money we are losing? What about the huge pension default and what that will mean to DL's bottom line? They will save $800 or more million a year. Can we get a little credit for that? United pilots did. And what is that "certain period" they are talking about? I do think any of us think we will get back to those wages anytime soon. How about in 10 years? It is funny the company guy never gave a date. I would like to have those huge buck again too, someday. AND BUCKAROO, I WANT AN APOLOGY.

Bye Bye--General Lee

 

[General Lee]

AAflyer,

I think they are talking, but I don't know if anything will come out of it. Maybe they are talking about our eventual merger?


Bye Bye--General Lee

 

[Going2Baja]

I just hope they don't forget about the guys on the street.....Even a 15 year recall to the biggest airline ever would be ok with me.

Baja.

 

[cosmotheassman]

Cant believe you guys fell for the bait and valued what I said. Unbelievable.....

 

[Going2Baja]

Cant believe you guys fell for the bait and valued what I said. Unbelievable.....

Why even type that kind of trash? Do you enjoy knowing people see your name and think bad thoughts? Strange dude....Strange.....