ATC expected descent rate

[2ndGenPSA]

It would be nice to hear from a controller on this. We pilots do have to guess what the controller wants in most cases. This, however, is part of what makes a good pilot. Pay attention to your surroundings. If you're descending over the Plains into Kansas from FL400, the expected descent rate may be a bit different than if you were descending into JFK, with tons of radio chatter, TCAS screen alive and chirping, weather deviations, etc. In the latter case, I think it prudent to dial in more than 500fpm!
Are there any controllers to offer guidance?
I remember during the prop days as an FO, we were descending into PHL from the west. My captain ALWAYS used 500fpm to gain some airspeed. One day, the controller asked for our descent rate. I replied "500fpm," while my cheeks burned red as I prepared for the controller's bark. Sure enough, he said to increase our descent rate, followed by "have you ever flown into PHL before?!!?"
The argument could be made that 500fpm WAS optimum for our aircraft, as it saved fuel and added airspeed, but we are also expected to use common sense.

 

[Headwind]

If in RVSM airspace the last 1000' up or down must be 1000 fpm or less.

 

[BEfly]

Yes, you figured me out.

That chik is hott

 

[ultrarunner]

The point was that he didn't have to be a jerk about it.

He might be stressed with facing a furlough...

 

[Way2Broke]

Can any controllers please tell me what the decent rates given in 7110.65R are for. For example, it cites that a Boeing 737's decent rate is 3500 fpm. Does this mean that ATC views this as the maximum rate of descent.

Just on a side bar, it also lists the climb for the 737 at 5500 fpm.

How do they determine these numbers?

 

[BillJBrake]

Google is your friend...


http://www.aopa.org/whatsnew/acdesig.html

 

[THE Flying Ace]

Whoa! That says the mighty Citation 550 (II) will climb at 5300 fpm. I don't think I have ever gone up that fast and there have been some days where it has been extremely cold and we have been really light. Makes me wonder where these numbers have come from.

 

[kf4amu]

Whoa! That says the mighty Citation 550 (II) will climb at 5300 fpm. I don't think I have ever gone up that fast and there have been some days where it has been extremely cold and we have been really light. Makes me wonder where these numbers have come from.

Yea it says the Dash is 1500fpm in a descent. HA!

 

[BrownStreak]

Google is your friend...


http://www.aopa.org/whatsnew/acdesig.html

And here I thought all of your aviation wisdom had been gained driving the low lead truck to the bulk plant. Let the pilots talk about pilot stuff...you should be on the board about which cleaner works the best for getting bugs and bird sh!t off the airplanes.

Before any of you get all fired up, I fueled for almost 8 years before I flew for money...and I know now like I knew then that I didn't know SH!T about doing the pilots' jobs then.

Hey, Bill...are they still making everyone suffer through 8 hours of videos yearly about how fuel is to be filtered/measured/pumped/maintained/whatever?

 

[BillJBrake]

*yawn*

 

[DOVPILOT]

Sorry Mr. Fedex god. We can't all be incredible super-pilots like you.

That's why he's a God and you are a stupid pilot:laugh:

 

[stillaboo]

Are there any controllers to offer guidance?

I am NOT a controller. That being said, controllers must abide by the JO 7110.65S. It's the FAR's for ATC.

The answer is here, FAA order JO 7110.65S Appendix A, for those who want to read the real thing.

CLIMB AND DESCENT RATES

Climb and descent rates based on average en route climb/descent profiles at median weight between maximum gross takeoff and landing weights.

It then goes on to list each aircraft, and both the climb and descent rate applicable to it. For example:

• all Airbus are 3500 fpm for both climb and descent
• Boeings range from 3000-4500 in descent (though the 737-400 is rated for a 6500 fpm climb )
• a Citation is 3-4000 fpm descent
• a Dash-8 is 1500 fpm descent (except the Q, that's 2500)
• a GIV or GV is 4000 fpm descent

Just for reference, a C-172 is 1000 fpm in the descent and a F-14 is 4000 fpm. The highest descent rate goes to the U2, tied with a variety of other fighters and attack aircraft . . . 6000 fpm. The fastest climb? That's the A7, T-38, F-5, F-2, F-4, FA-18, F-15, and F-16 @ 8000 fpm.

As for the original poster, flying a Purple MD-11 - there's no rate for the MD-11 listed, but the DC-10/MD-10 is rated for a 2400 fpm climb, and a 2000 fpm descent.