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ATA to go to Europe by next Summer

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General Lee

Well-known member
Joined
Aug 24, 2002
Posts
20,442
ATA To Add Scheduled European Flights By Summer 2006
Monday February 23, 3:31 pm ET
By Elizabeth Souder, Of DOW JONES NEWSWIRES


NEW YORK (Dow Jones)--ATA Holdings Corp. (NasdaqNM:ATAH - News) plans to begin operating scheduled flights to Europe in the next two years, a move that would make it the first U.S. low-cost carrier to offer such service across the Atlantic.


ATA Chief Executive George Mikelsons said Monday in an interview with Dow Jones Newswires that the Indianapolis carrier could enter the transatlantic market as early as 2005, and "not later than summer '06."

In the airline industry, "domestic revenue in general is down quite a lot, but the overseas traffic, carried almost exclusively by legacy carriers, is recovering, and we are looking on that with envy," Mikelsons said.

ATA, which operates scheduled low-cost flights throughout the U.S., to Mexico and to the Caribbean using Chicago as a hub, isn't a typical low-cost airline. It is also among the largest providers of charter airline service for the U.S. military, operating flights to destinations around the globe.

In fact, ATA flies nearly 20% of its total capacity to international destinations. Mikelsons pointed out that ATA already operates several weekly flights to Ireland. And ATA used to operate international charter flights for civilian tour operators, though that business dried up as international air fares dropped.

"The cost of this would be negligible," Mikelsons said, because of ATA's international presence and because the airline already has planes that can make long-distance flights, like the ones it uses to operate a scheduled service to Hawaii.

Low air fares across the Atlantic, prompted by capacity increases among major carriers, will keep ATA from flying to Europe this summer. The situation will also keep ATA from flying the most popular routes, like New York to London.

"If we entered that market this summer, we'd be dead," Mikelsons said. He added: "We're not going to go New York to Paris or New York to London. We'd get killed."

Instead, ATA would fly routes between popular tourist destinations, such as Orlando and small European cities. And he plans to wait until major carriers cut back on transatlantic capacity.

"Once excess capacity has dried up, there's going to be room for us to do on a scheduled basis what we used to do on a charter basis," Mikelsons said.

The airline is interested in talking to European carriers about code sharing, but hasn't yet had such talks. Code sharing is a practice in which each airline sells seats on its partner's flights as if they were its own.

Those talks would most likely be with an individual airline, as opposed to an alliance. That's because some alliances require member airlines to offer a particular level of first-class service, including first-class seats and separate airport lounges, among other amenities.

But adding business class later this year could be a step toward European code-sharing for ATA. Mikelsons said most European carriers have business class, and would want code-sharing partners to offer the upgraded service.

ATA plans to begin offering business class by the end of this year, boosting revenue by $30 million a year, Mikelsons said. In 2003, the airline's total operating revenue was $1.52 billion.

Earlier this month, ATA said it would slow its capacity growth in 2004 to 9% from last year's 20% growth, because increased competition has pushed some fares down. Still, Mikelsons said, he is considering adding new destinations this year in Mexico and the Caribbean.


Bye Bye--General Lee


PS--I would like to point out that the article said they would go to Europe from Orlando and places like that--avoiding the larger cities---which would be smart. Sounds like a good strategy overall. We used to fly from Orlando to Frankfurt and Paris (??)---let me stress again USED TO.:rolleyes:


"Instead, ATA would fly routes between popular tourist destinations, such as Orlando and small European cities. And he plans to wait until major carriers cut back on transatlantic capacity."

Didn't Medflyer say we wouldn't be able to do as well with our Transatlantic flying? I thought I pointed out to him that our INTL flying saves our a$$.
 
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General Lee said:
Didn't Medflyer say we wouldn't be able to do as well with our Transatlantic flying? I thought I pointed out to him that our INTL flying saves our a$$.


Sorry General, but I never said that. I'm sure DL is very profitable to Europe in the summer (although a good chunk of that is lost during the winter.....Moscow in January ain't nice).

However, what I have said is that International is not enough. DL can't run and hide from the domestic market and rely on the international markets to carry them. There simply aren't enough money making routes in the international arena to offset DL's losses in the domestic market.

The international markets are also extremely volatile and can go from money making to money losing in the blink of an eye. Look at how many international routes DL has abandoned over the past years...JFK-NRT, LAX-NRT, PDX-NRT, PDX-NGO, ATL-BJX, ATL-CUR, ATL-VIE, ATL-HAM, ATL-GIG, JFK-ARN, JFK-DUB/SNN, JFK-MUC, JFK-ZRH, JFK-LYS, JFK-WAW, JFK-STR, JFK-MAN, BOS-YUL, BOS-LGW and the list goes on. If international is so good for DL, why has DL failed out of so many routes?

And as this article indicates, your a$$ is in a lot of trouble if the LCC's (like ATA) start expanding internationally (assuming they can pull it off). Where's DL going to run to once the LCC's invade Europe?? Or the Caribbean??
 
Medflyer,

Well, if you read the article again you will see that ATA won't be going head to head with the Majors, but rather flying to Europe from tourist spots like Orlando---which will more likey affect the likes of Virgin Atlantic, British Airways, etc.... Here it is for you:


"The situation will also keep ATA from flying the most popular routes, like New York to London.

"If we entered that market this summer, we'd be dead," Mikelsons said. He added: "We're not going to go New York to Paris or New York to London. We'd get killed."

Instead, ATA would fly routes between popular tourist destinations, such as Orlando and small European cities. And he plans to wait until major carriers cut back on transatlantic capacity."


With the weaker dollar more and more Europeans will choose American airlines---over the more expensive European Airlines taking a hit. Give me another LCC that wants to invest now in larger widebodies (ATA already has them---with 757s and maybe upcoming 767s). I doubt many more will try---and not many will go up against the Majors. If you think so you are smokin something. Also, our Domestic flying is really picking up--and I also told you that the best was yet to come for the Spring (FLA flying is 25% of our revenue--and we are PACKED for Spring Break) and Summer. Hopefully it will help our bottom line---but it is all probably our fault--the pilots'.

Moscow---even in the Winter---is very profitable. Sure, it is cold, but the alternative is flying Aeroflot, and Russia is a very large country and there are a lot of Russians in the New York Area. I can't explain why Delta left the PDX base and most of the Asia flying---that was a management decision. The other European markets (Copenhagen, Berlin, Oslo) were all supposedly full (heard from the NY based flight attendants)---another management decision. Why did we invest in so many RJs? You know the answer.

Bye Bye--General Lee;)
 
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Maybe we, the wholly owned step children, can help out. Can we do a fuel stop in the Azores or Greenland?:D
 
Wil,

No offense, but if we started putting RJs on Europe routes---with 2 or 3 stops enroute---there might be mass riots---from our pilots and the passengers. Most of our citizens are overweight, and love to "super size" their fries. Anything more than 2 hours will cause most people to get restless on those planes. Yes, it is also uncomfortable to sit in the middle seat on a 737 or MD-88---but atleast you can get up and stretch and not have to bend over so you don't hit your head. Don't get me wrong Wil----I know RJs have their purpose and they have helped us keep marketshare.....But....

Bye Bye---General Lee:rolleyes: ;)
 
The rumor was strong, with a lot of supporting evidence, but I wasn't going to believe it until I saw it in print. Of course there is nothing on the employee site on it.

Our 738's are set up for ETOPs and the pilots have had RVSM training. I thought it was for something else, but it may be for this.

The 738's are amazing, I hope we get to fly international. I'm sure they'll use the 757 instead. Darn it!

I predict success since European flying will keep more of our operation out of JetBlue's, Southwest's and Airtran's backyard.
 
Let me rephrase that, I PRAY that the European flying will be a success.

For those of you new to watching every penny when profits are down, ATA has been doing it for 30 yrs. Welcome to the game.
 
if the 73's go international, i sure hope they put some better seats in there, or else the manufacturer of preparation-h should see a rise in profits.
 
Yeah, I was gonna say... As much as I hate sitting in the back of airplanes, the seats and seat pitch in our 737's is pretty dang good. I can't stand sitting in the cockpit seats for more than a couple of hours at a time, though. Thank Ja I have been able to bid away from our 06:30 block EWR - SFO flights so far.
 
Originally posted by njcapt

. Thank Ja I have been able to bid away from our 06:30 block EWR - SFO flights so far.

I on the other hand have NOT been able to bid away from these...so it's been multiple trips to the lav for us (much to the chagrin of the senior).



Originally posted by CREOBED17

if the 73's go international, i sure hope they put some better seats in there, or else the manufacturer of preparation-h should see a rise in profits.

I don't think we are in any danger of flying these routes in the 738. This will be 767 maybe 757 domain.

Mach Zero
 
Johann...

I hear you and feel your pain...literally (sp?)!

After 2 hours in those torture devices they call cockpit chairs...my a$$ is so freakin sore.

I had one of those 6+ hour EWR-SFO flights and it was like sitting on 3/4 plywood covered with a pillow case.

You and I gotta get our delicate backside on the 75 and enjoy those Barco-Loungers
 
Pain no more.

EWR-SFO trips will be cancelled March 01. I sure wish we would have advertised and let people know we flew that route.

Oh well, what else is new.
 
Hey every time your rear gets sore just think of your predecessors that flew mail over the Andes, in ice, with an open cockpit and no autopilot.
 
excellent point.....however there are some might argue they'd rather hand-fly with the cockpit a bit drafty rather than have permanent back problems or regular visits to their proctologist.
 
ATA73Pilot said:
Johann...

I hear you and feel your pain...literally (sp?)!

After 2 hours in those torture devices they call cockpit chairs...my a$$ is so freakin sore.

I had one of those 6+ hour EWR-SFO flights and it was like sitting on 3/4 plywood covered with a pillow case.

You and I gotta get our delicate backside on the 75 and enjoy those Barco-Loungers

Naw, I just flash back to my 2 1/2 years flying the guddamd Shorts 360. That beast had two longitudinal pieces of 1" OD pipe with a nylon sling between them, covered by that shltty 2" open cell foam they made old hide-a-bed mattresses out of. I spent, easily, a couple of thousand bucks in Chiropractor bills trying to get straight again, only to be miraculously cured about two weeks after getting furloughed. Musta been all the drinking and surfing I was doing.

P.S. Ed, if you bid 757 FO again I'm gonna organize a little party for you out in the parking lot.

Capiche'?
 
Just a quick note for all those with back probs.

I started doing some back exercises on my bowflex and it has made all of the difference in the world. Getting a little stonger and more flexible might help quite a few folks out there, and the exercises are easy.

I still get a little stiff, but it doesn't last when I'm out of the plane.
 
Freddy Laker
 
Twice a failure on LCC across the Atlantic. Sad but true.

Bye Bye--General Lee:rolleyes:
 

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