ASA insurance... cost rising again!

[geojet707]

This has got to be the stupidest pissing contest in flightinfo history.

you r right... how about this....bump..bump...

 

[PCL_128]

WHATEVER!!!!!!!(In my best valley girl impersenation.)

Au contrair, mosieur! This goes to the heart of all arguements. Benefits are just that, benefits. And when you let the government get involved in it, it turns into a goat fvck.

Some people want to live in America, and turn it into France. Not me!

You can move to Gay ole' Pariee if you like, just leave it over on the other side of the pond when you get tired of the great big social experiment.

Dick Gozinya

Dick, I wasn't talking about the health care debate. I was talking about the ridiculous pissing match that Gator started with John P. about who flies the better airplane, and who works in a better segment of the industry.

But for the record, I agree somewhat with John P. about the health care issue. The government either needs to require all employers to pay for health insurance for their employees, or the government needs to create a universal system. I personally prefer the first method, but the second might have to do. With the cost of health care skyrocketing, and with the constantly shrinking middle class, something has to be done about health care in this country.

 

[Richard Gozinya]

OH Tay! I gotcha.

More to follow on the health care debate though.

Dick Gozinya

 

[Gator1999]

Dick, I wasn't talking about the health care debate. I was talking about the ridiculous pissing match that Gator started with John P. about who flies the better airplane, and who works in a better segment of the industry.

But for the record, I agree somewhat with John P. about the health care issue. The government either needs to require all employers to pay for health insurance for their employees, or the government needs to create a universal system. I personally prefer the first method, but the second might have to do. With the cost of health care skyrocketing, and with the constantly shrinking middle class, something has to be done about health care in this country.

Awww, c'mon man. It's been entertaining and enlightening and it's just a matter of time before CFI2766 and JP get so pissed off that they storm off back into the hole from which they emerged.

Seriously, do you really expect all the conversations to be of serious debate, if so, you need to search for another message board. Like I said, this is flightinfo.com. It's a website that was born of the weary and down trodden airline pilots of this country. It has the sole purpose for those to spew their hated or profess their love for how much they hate Gulfstream or how wonderful FedEx is. It is a gatering place so that all of us can exercise our First Amendment rights to tell the rest of the community that J. Orenstein is a scum bag. So that General Lee can hold the record for pissing the most pilots off with his viewpoint. It's been a rocky road and there have been some casualites along the way...we miss you Tina Fey's Scar! We've supported the slow and hanicapped pilots...we miss you too The Guat. But we will survive, we will persevere through all the needless flame and banter that has made this website what it is today. After all, this is America...the greatest country in the world and we should have the right to speak up and voice our opinions no matter how wrong they may sound or whoever they may insult.

U S A, U S A, U S A, U S A!

 

[Richard Gozinya]

a website that was born of the weary and down trodden airline pilots of this country.

Well, this describes 99% of the pilots out there. The rest are the management types.

Dick

 

[JoeMerchant]

Govt. run health care is not the answer. Ask yourself how many govt. agencies you enjoy dealing with and how many of them run efficiently..... Look at Veteran health care.... There have been some terrible cases of poor health care in the VA hospitals....

The health care in Canada isn't as good as it is here....

Better solutions...

More Health Savings Accounts with high deductible catastrophic insurance policies.... Makes us more of a consumer....

Ala Carte insurance policies.... You want Chiropratic, Maternity, Vision, etc.... you pay more..... If you don't want it, you pay less.....

If your healthy, you pay less..... If you aren't, you pay more

Tort reform..... that will reduce some of the CYA tests and care.... You can pay for the tests if you want them, but don't give them simply to CYA in the case of a lawsuit.... That costs everyone......

Make health care coverage mandatory.... like auto insurance.... You have to have it unless you fall below a certain income level.... For some that will mean giving up their daily Starbucks and the 35,000 new car every 4 years......

The free market can solve this better than Hillary can....

 

[PCL_128]

Sorry Joe, but those things won't solve the problem. People simply can't afford health insurance in this country. The costs are going up at astronomical rates. High deductible HSAs don't help people that can't afford to pay the high deductible. Unhealthy pay more = lots of unhealthy people that need insurance who can't afford it. Reasonable tort reform is always a good idea, but it won't solve this problem. Everyone needs to be insured, and you can't force the poor and lower middle classes to spend what little money they have on health insurance. It needs to either be covered by the employers or by the government.

 

[CFI2766]

Govt. run health care is not the answer. Ask yourself how many govt. agencies you enjoy dealing with and how many of them run efficiently..... Look at Veteran health care.... There have been some terrible cases of poor health care in the VA hospitals....

The health care in Canada isn't as good as it is here....

Better solutions...

More Health Savings Accounts with high deductible catastrophic insurance policies.... Makes us more of a consumer....

Ala Carte insurance policies.... You want Chiropratic, Maternity, Vision, etc.... you pay more..... If you don't want it, you pay less.....

If your healthy, you pay less..... If you aren't, you pay more

Tort reform..... that will reduce some of the CYA tests and care.... You can pay for the tests if you want them, but don't give them simply to CYA in the case of a lawsuit.... That costs everyone......

Make health care coverage mandatory.... like auto insurance.... You have to have it unless you fall below a certain income level.... For some that will mean giving up their daily Starbucks and the 35,000 new car every 4 years......

The free market can solve this better than Hillary can....

Wow, this is the most logical thing that has been said on this whole post. Who knew there would be a day I'd agree with Mr. Merchant on something?

Let's add one more piece to the puzzle of American health care: Abolish the AMA. Here's the logic: The certification standards to become a physician are incredibly difficult to obtain. Allow more physicians in the market. More physicians mean more of a supply of the services that physicians provide. This means a lower cost for those of us who are consumers of health care. This is, by the way, the exact same logic behind the airline deregulation act of 1978.

 

[hmmurdock]

Govt. run health care is not the answer. Ask yourself how many govt. agencies you enjoy dealing with and how many of them run efficiently..... Look at Veteran health care.... There have been some terrible cases of poor health care in the VA hospitals....

The health care in Canada isn't as good as it is here....

Better solutions...

More Health Savings Accounts with high deductible catastrophic insurance policies.... Makes us more of a consumer....

Ala Carte insurance policies.... You want Chiropratic, Maternity, Vision, etc.... you pay more..... If you don't want it, you pay less.....

If your healthy, you pay less..... If you aren't, you pay more

Tort reform..... that will reduce some of the CYA tests and care.... You can pay for the tests if you want them, but don't give them simply to CYA in the case of a lawsuit.... That costs everyone......

Make health care coverage mandatory.... like auto insurance.... You have to have it unless you fall below a certain income level.... For some that will mean giving up their daily Starbucks and the 35,000 new car every 4 years......

The free market can solve this better than Hillary can....

Greetings..Do you think that health care should be a for profit business? In other words, after insurance companies pay all of their expenses, pay the CEO a fat salary, the employees and other expenses, then they could put any profits towards allowing more people to be able to afford health care. I think this could possibly work.

 

[CFI2766]

Greetings..Do you think that health care should be a for profit business? In other words, after insurance companies pay all of their expenses, pay the CEO a fat salary, the employees and other expenses, then they could put any profits towards allowing more people to be able to afford health care. I think this could possibly work.

YES! Health care should be a for profit business. However, it should be a business that is completely controlled by the free market, not one that is artifically constrained by limiting the number of physicians practicing medicine.

 

[PCL_128]

Let's add one more piece to the puzzle of American health care: Abolish the AMA. Here's the logic: The certification standards to become a physician are incredibly difficult to obtain. Allow more physicians in the market. More physicians mean more of a supply of the services that physicians provide. This means a lower cost for those of us who are consumers of health care. This is, by the way, the exact same logic behind the airline deregulation act of 1978.

This is one of the scariest things I've ever heard. I don't want my health entrusted to some reject who couldn't get make the cut in today's medical school, but suddenly is able to get in tomorrow because of the "free market." God bless the AMA.

 

[John Pennekamp]

YES! Health care should be a for profit business. However, it should be a business that is completely controlled by the free market, not one that is artifically constrained by limiting the number of physicians practicing medicine.

Well, for what its worth, the AMA is onto something. We as a pilot union could learn a lot from the AMA's practice of controlling entry into the profession to boost our value and compensation.

But I don't think the high salaries doctors get it the problem. The problem is that every medical bill, especially hospital bills, is padded to compensate for care of the uninsured. My wife recently had an emergency room visit (food poisoning). She was there about two hours. According to the bill, they charged our insurance $208.80 for 1000cc of basic IV solution, $508.50 for a hydration IV (1 hour), $19.97 for the plastic IV tubing, and $7.00 to $82.50 PER DOSE for the meds they gave her.Now you can't tell me that this is cost. It's well documented that hospitals inflate bills to pass along these costs.

This is why we have the insurance mess with rising premiums and deductibles that the middle class can't afford. If everyone had an insurance program, this wouldn't be as much of a problem. Medicaid covers the very poor. There is nothing for the lower middle class, and these are the highest percentage of the uninsured.

Fix this with a national insurance program and you've fixed a lot of the mess in our system.

 

[CFI2766]

This is one of the scariest things I've ever heard. I don't want my health entrusted to some reject who couldn't get make the cut in today's medical school, but suddenly is able to get in tomorrow because of the "free market." God bless the AMA.

DING!! DING!! DING!!

Now that you've bit on my Swiftian logic, ISN'T THIS EXACTLY WHAT'S HAPPENING WITH THE AIRLINES NOW?!?!?!? Reference the requirements posessed by the current crop of new FO's at the regional level.

"I don't want my <life> entrusted to some reject who couldn't get make the cut in today's <regional airline hiring environment>, but suddenly is able to get in tomorrow because of the "free market.""

Sound familiar?

[For reference, I'm a relatively new hire]

It's also true that the airlines are in one of the safest periods that there has ever been. However, average airfare is lower than it has ever been.

 

[JoeMerchant]

DING!! DING!! DING!!

Now that you've bit on my Swiftian logic, ISN'T THIS EXACTLY WHAT'S HAPPENING WITH THE AIRLINES NOW?!?!?!? Reference the requirements posessed by the current crop of new FO's at the regional level.

"I don't want my <life> entrusted to some reject who couldn't get make the cut in today's <regional airline hiring environment>, but suddenly is able to get in tomorrow because of the "free market.""

Sound familiar?

[For reference, I'm a relatively new hire]

It's also true that the airlines are in one of the safest periods that there has ever been. However, average airfare is lower than it has ever been.

You got him.... hook line and sinker....

As JP said, we could learn a lot from the AMA.... You can't pay $30,000 dollars and become a doctor in 11 months..... Why do we allow it for it pilots......

AMA has protected it's profession more than we have.....

 

[JoeMerchant]

Sorry Joe, but those things won't solve the problem. People simply can't afford health insurance in this country. The costs are going up at astronomical rates. High deductible HSAs don't help people that can't afford to pay the high deductible. Unhealthy pay more = lots of unhealthy people that need insurance who can't afford it. Reasonable tort reform is always a good idea, but it won't solve this problem. Everyone needs to be insured, and you can't force the poor and lower middle classes to spend what little money they have on health insurance. It needs to either be covered by the employers or by the government.

As Boortz would say.... what a load of horsesqueeze...

You are sounding more like a socialist every day....

Somehow health care became an "entitlement".... You want those of us who work hard to subsidize those who choose to not work as hard, or who choose to spend their money on other things....

Someone has to pay one way or the other..... You just want the "haves" to pay for the "have nots"..... That's called redistribution of wealth...... Hillary is your dream come true....

 

[John Pennekamp]

DING!! DING!! DING!!

Now that you've bit on my Swiftian logic, ISN'T THIS EXACTLY WHAT'S HAPPENING WITH THE AIRLINES NOW?!?!?!? Reference the requirements posessed by the current crop of new FO's at the regional level.

"I don't want my <life> entrusted to some reject who couldn't get make the cut in today's <regional airline hiring environment>, but suddenly is able to get in tomorrow because of the "free market.""

Sound familiar?

[For reference, I'm a relatively new hire]

It's also true that the airlines are in one of the safest periods that there has ever been. However, average airfare is lower than it has ever been.

Nice....!

 

[JoeMerchant]

Can't wait to watch PCL128 try and dig his way out of this trap he fell into..... Time to make some popcorn.....

 

[PCL_128]

What's there to dig out of? I think it would be great if we could set up a system similar to what the AMA has to limit entry to this profession. The AMA has the right idea.

 

[Medeco]

As Boortz would say.... what a load of horsesqueeze...

You are sounding more like a socialist every day....

Somehow health care became an "entitlement".... You want those of us who work hard to subsidize those who choose to not work as hard, or who choose to spend their money on other things....

Someone has to pay one way or the other..... You just want the "haves" to pay for the "have nots"..... That's called redistribution of wealth...... Hillary is your dream come true....

Wow, you listen to Boortz so much you sound just like him and his words.

Now, I agree with this statement, but you should really give credit to BOORTZ for your statement since those are exactly what he has said many times before.

Give credit were credit is due.

Now, PCL and JP, have you ever heard of anyone being turned down for health care in this country?

Have you ever heard of anyone not being able to get credit because they had unpaid hospital bills?

The system is expensive because of many factors, one of which is lawsuits and malpractice insurance cost to the doctors.

Universal health care is far from the answer.

Recently in the news, its been noted that high risk mothers to be are flying/driving to Washington state because the health care in British columbia cannot provide these women with the required care, how do you explain this, if socialized med is so good?
By the way those are Boortz statements too.

Medeco

 

[JoeMerchant]

What's there to dig out of? I think it would be great if we could set up a system similar to what the AMA has to limit entry to this profession. The AMA has the right idea.

So why hasn't ALPA pursued this? You are the ALPA cheerleader here.... what is the problem? Controlling entry requirements is key to the problem, but I don't see any leadership from Herndon..... Why not?