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ASA flight 529

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Loss of the aircraft during most overspeed situations is pilot error. While The overspeed may not be pilot error, failure to contain the overspeed certainly can be. In any event, one can only make the best of a situation that hopefully he does not create.

I recall a C-119 crash some time ago, which occured on a training flight. An overspeed occured, and the crew fought to controll it, while losing altitude. After 1/2 hour of struggling with the airplane, they crashed. The scenario involved in this case an engine that was developing good power, but had a prop overspeed.

Power was pulled, airspeed lost, altitude lost, and the RPM brought under control. As the aircraft slowed and became hairy, power was added, altitude and airspeed gained (or maintained), and a cycle was formed.

What the crew failed to grasp was that the RPM of the propeller, whenever not under positive torque, was dependent on airspeed. Had they slowed the aircraft and then used available power on the engine, they could have returned and landed normally...instead of dying.

If the engine isn't driving the prop, then the slipstream is. Reducing the relative wind that's driving the prop will reduce the prop velocity. This seems somewhat counterintuitive, as it brings the airplane to a state of reduced lift and potential controllability, however, it's what must happen. (Much like pulling aft and pulling power off during a tailplane stall in ice).

In the event that the engine can be controlled by reducing to a very slow airspeed, then very often power can be added and used. If it can't be, then the engine should be shut down, feather or not.

The ham standard prop on the brasillia and other modern aircraft is nothing like the hydromatics found on the P-61, and virtually every other aircraft of it's era. However, the principle remains the same. Ham standard props are well designed, tough, and reliable. I've rested my life on them, earned a living from them, and have handled them in all states from flawless function to destroyed. I've worked on them, overhauled them, and think the world of them. Don't blame the prop...it's nothing more than a mechanical device. The key is what is done with it when something does go wrong.

In the case of 529, it would appear the crew did it right. Unfortunately, it's very possible to do everything right...and still lose.
 
The Brasilia's a special case avbug. Read the report on the ASA Brunswick crash. It oversped on base-to-final at ~120 knots. The resulting torque roll threw them on their backs before they could try anything, much less slow down. The captain was the first American typed in the EMB120 and the head of the training department.

Ham Standard also blamed the crew, until Embraer actually recreated the torque tube failure on a test aircraft. From stable at 8000', it basically did a split S onto the runway - I believe the pilot (flying solo) was named Schittini.

The 14RF9 is a scimitar-shaped blade that acts like a pinwheel when the torque tube is cut. You're right, not comparable to older straight props.
 
Hey Bean et al.,

If you want to get a copy of the book, check your local library. I did on a whim and was surprised to find that they had four copies of the book. I was also surprised to find a lot of the books mentioned on the thread about what everyone is reading, including Fate is the Hunter. Just a thought to save some $$$.

Aceshigh
 
ms6073 said:


Although my search of the NTSB archives could hardly be considered conclusive, I guess the company 'really' did sweep this under the rug. I was unable to find any accident synopsis that was similar in nature to the events you described between 01/01/97 to present for all events in North Carolina much less the U.S.???

It happened in '95... here's a link to the synopsis: http://www.ntsb.gov/ntsb/brief.asp?ev_id=20001207X04223&key=1
but the final report you have to order from them in hardcopy.
 
avbug said:
Loss of the aircraft during most overspeed situations is pilot error.

Come hop in a Brasilia sim for a while, then talk to me about not blaming the prop. I've seen people with 5,000 hours in the '120 who know exactly when the failure is going to happen, and they still lose it. A catastrophic overspeed of the left prop at V1 and max. gross takes full right rudder and about twenty pounds of right aileron just to keep the wings level...and you still might settle back to the ground. Don't forget, the guy in Brunswick was (at the time) ASA'a most experienced Brasilia captain.

Most FAA examiners will tell you that the toughest check rides are the 727 F/E and the Brasilia type-rating...and it's largely because of that marvel of engineering, the Hamilton Standard 14RF9.

Don't get me wrong, I liked flying the '120. But after a year in each seat of the Brakillya, I'm happy to be flying something with nice quiet ducted fans! (And ACM's that actually cool.)
 
demo said:


It happened in '95... here's a link to the synopsis: http://www.ntsb.gov/ntsb/brief.asp?ev_id=20001207X04223&key=1
but the final report you have to order from them in hardcopy.

Thanks,

That is the synopsis for Matts crash which, having attended Flight Safety for my CFI jsut after that time, I am already rather familiar with. The one I was referring to, involves the incident/accident that everyone is currently discussing concerning the prop-overspeed at 8000 feet 1 mile outside the OM! Or am I confused and they are one in the same?
 

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