ASA Classes

[General Lee]

Sleepy,

I don't think Delta would have a choice. If they really want more, they would have to spend a little money and it could happen. They still wouldn't be allowed to give any 70 seaters to Skywest or Chataqua without Dalpa's permission. That wouldn't change.
Yes, I want you guys to grow again too, I do. But, I want us to grow with 100 seaters and get some of those furloughs back into cockpits. If Delta only wants to do it with 70 seaters, then I would want them to go there.


ASAPILOT,

I agree it might be alittle expensive, but I am sure Delta would allow our guys to be trained in Flight Safety's sims. They own the contracts, not ASA/COMAIR---because Delta owns them. If they really want ONLY 70 seaters, and not new 100 seaters, then I would want our furloughs to go to the new ones, not the current 57. But, I do not have a say in the matter---at all. As normal, I am just thinking about the guys on the street. I hope we all grow eventually.

Bye Bye--General Lee

 

[asapilot]

Torey-

I don't believe we still do preferential hiring at FSI. I think our minimums are now 1500TT, but I don't know for sure offhand. I came from FSI, but I think now that the "Delta Connection Academy" exists, that's the route they look for new-hires. Again, I don't know for sure that we're not still hiring low-time guys, but I haven't flown with any in a long time.

General-

I'd like to see everyone off the street as well. It would seem like CR7 flying and DAL's plan for mainline operatiosn don't seem to marry up though. Like you said, it seems the focus is more on the 100-seat operation. Did you happen to see the ERJ-170/190 demo in ATL this week? I haven't heard anything about it, I'm wondering what the company's view of it was. Perhpas that will provide a means to put people back into airplanes without compromising anyone else currently working. I know DAL is pulling planes out of storgae, but I also know that the attrition rate is pretty high right now and yet we don't see any more recalls on the horizon. I'm not convinced that DAL isn't just waiting to put the shaft to whichever group it benefits them to do so. DAL announced today that it has arranged to sell 11 737-800s which were scheduled for delivery next year. In addition, the have optioned to sell 10 more aircraft scheduled for delivery in 06-07. In addition to that, they're deferring 8 deliverys scheduled for next year until 2008. That leaves two 777s for delivery next year. I guess the planes coming out of the desert are filling in some of this gap, but considering all they money they've cut out by these sales, I don't know if that makes it more worthwile to go and buy a bunch of 70-100 seaters. Perhaps that exactly what they have in mind.

 

[General Lee]

ASApilot,

Those 737-800s might be going to a lessor, namely GECAS, for a sale-and lease-back arrangement. That means that we get $500 million to do other things, like pay of some debt or put a down payment on some 100 seaters, and maybe get to lease those 737-800s back after a paycut. It is unclear who is buying them, but lessors do that all of the time. It might be another airline, but I don't know. Also, we are starting to utilize our own fleet better---like the Song 757s. The mainline 757s now average something like 11.2 hrs of use a day, and Song will now use them 13.2 hours a day---which means you need more pilots if the cap stays at 75 hours. Also, a lot of our other airplanes are under utilized, and Delta probably recognizes that. I think we still have some MD-88s in the desert, and most of the other planes are coming out, with the MD-11s rumored to come out too eventually.

We did have a demo of the EMB-170 in ATL last week I believe, and I think they did look it over. But, I don't know which one they will pick, if any. It sounds like they had a falling out with Boeing if they had to sell these 737-800s----and Boeing probably wouldn't let them push the planes back anymore. So, I guess you can count the 737-700s or -600s out??? Who knows?? But, something is brewing....If Delta wants more 70 seaters and doesn't order 100 seaters, I just can't see Dalpa doing it--especially with over 1000 furloughs watching. They are the future constituents at Dalpa---and they wouldn't be very happy.

Bye Bye--General Lee

 

[asapilot]

General-

I don't see DALPA doing it either. They're basically the fulcrum for this teeter-totter. I can't imagine a scenario where DALPA is going to say "yes, we'll allow more CR7s at DCI", but it looks like the company's going to try to make it happen just the same. I don't know if this will be some sort of concessionary deal a la every other airline right now or what. "Concessions" is the new buzzword it seems. If you can find a way to get some small jets and fill them with furloughees, that'd be great. I see problems with DAL operating their own CR7s though. Even if you did operate them on the same pay scale, that would add a whole new dimension to our current negotiations at ASA. I'm guessing that most of our guys would want all other things to be equal as well. I'm not saying it couldn't happen, but I forsee lots of bumps along the way.

 

[BlueCanoe]

Blue-

Sorry 'bout that. I thought I read on another CHQ post that it was CQH, but perhaps my eyes had blurred from reading too many posts. You shall be referred to as CHQ from now on.

No problem. You probably did read that. That guy didn't know what he was talking about in the post. Glad to hear ya'll are getting more jets. See ya in DFW.

 

[bailout]

>>Does ASA still take the 300 hour, PFT pilot from FlightSafety, Vero Beach??? What happened to those poor saps who were caught in the post 9-11 world, 3/4 of the way through their training and out a cool 30 grand?? Hope all you swimmers get there soon. I feel your pain.<<

Since when is the FSI program considered PFT?

Yes the program still exists, although greatly reduced, with the grads going into the pool. All the ones who were in training at the time of 9/11 have been here for over a year.

 

[Tim47SIP]

General

Delta can have as many RJs as they want, especially 70 seaters---as long as they fly the NEW ones with Delta furloughs. Drew doesn't want to admit that, he just wants them on his side. I am sure our guys at the bottom would love to fly at your rates too. (That is not under bidding you---the same rates) Just set up a new subsidiary and fly all of the ones you want Delta---go ahead.

A few weeks back I posted some info that your MEC stated and you did not respond, so I will try again. Two friends of mine (both furloughed Delta guys) went to the Peach Tree meeting several weeks back. These two individuals do not know each other but told me identical things. They stated that this exact subject was brought up to try and get some sort of feeling of what DALPA was doing in regards to the furloughed guys. One of the MEC reps stated that:
1) DALPA did not want any aircraft smaller that 110 seats (100 is probably close enough for this goal) on the property because there is concern that smaller low pay aircraft would be widely used by Delta, thus decreasing the number of higher paying jobs and increasing the lower paying jobs.
2) DALPA would in no way go for an additional subsidiary to place the 70+ seaters because of the Express seniority/pay issue. Different pay rates for Express while being on the same seniority list.

Additionaly, I would guess that Operational Integration issues would become a major hedache for DALPA. Something they want to keep a tight grip on. The addition of 100+ seat aircraft on the Delta propery seems to be the only real hope for the furloughed guys and I hope it happens. Any thoughts?

 

[flyboy24]

asa/fsi program

Torey15,
Word I hear from Vero Beach is that the asa/fsi direct track program is running only to "inhouse" fsi students. I understand the doors will be back open to the "outsiders" once ASA starts hiring again which should be shortly after the new year. I came from outside fsi for the direct track program myself a little over 2 years ago, just in time to sit in a pool for 10 months but found my way onto the property.
Call Jay Elder at 1-800-800-1411 for more information about the fsi direct track possibilities. Good Luck. Keep the Dream. ASA is a great place to be.

 

[General Lee]

TIM47SIP,

I have always said that my ideas do not necessarily equal Dalpa's. And, I have no say whatsoever. I was just expressing my views and probably the average Delta pilot in the ATL crew lounge. I do talk to the MEC members often, and they say that the 100 seater will not go to DCI, and that productivity will not increase until all furloughs are back. As far as extra 70 seaters for DCI, I just can't see Dalpa agreeing to anymore until some of our issues are addressed---namely our furloughs. Without helping our furloughs with set recalls, I can't see Dalpa giving the green light for your expansion while our guys sit on the street. Yes, ASA has been nice to our furloughs, and we appreciate that. But, not many want to delay their return to a Delta cockpit any longer than they have to. A 100 seater order would help. If there isn't a 100 seater order, I think the Dalpa guys will pause and think about what options are available to our 1000 guys on the street. Think about that----1000 guys on the street. That is huge, and a lot have kids and mortgages and are struggling. Dalpa has gone to bat for these furloughs, and helped return the latest 250, and is still fighting to get them back pay. They aren't going to forget them.

Bye Bye--General Lee

 

[wil]

General- I think the furloughs will be a while with the contract carriers growing. If we kept the flying to Comair, ASA and mainline there would be no furloughs. Let the Delta pilots keep DOH for benefits and bring them on till the situation at mainline improves. I don't think we should be hiring outside until all the furloughees have had an opportunity to get a slot if they want one. All the best- Wil

 

[Torey15]

Sic 'em bears-No thanks man. I had Jay try and talk me into that three years ago. I am happily swimming in the pool at another DCI carrier. I was at FSI when they started that program and saw several of my buddies who were buck private pilots in January of 00' be the first to complete the training, and be in the RJ by late October.

I had to slug it out watching various morons do Vmc demos for the last three years! At any rate, the program is good for those who could/can afford it. Neither one of those was me. Thanks anyway.....

 

[DrunkIrishman]

General-

Careful what you ask for. If Delta operates another subsidiary of CR700's using Delta furlough's, then what would be the difference between them and us at ASA or Comair. Especially since Delta could whipsaw its own Delta pilots against themselves. I.E., furloughed 70 seat pilots get "awarded" more mainline flying to circumvent DALPA's 88's and up. Is this really the solution you support?

Also, I heard Embraer was merely showing off the E-170 to all, not specifically Delta. Do you have any other info on this?

 

[General Lee]

DrunkIrishman,


Yeah, I think EMB was just showing Delta the Emb-170---and I honestly haven't heard much more about the 100 seaters or an order. That rumor might just float away. As far as the 70 seater issue, this is all just my opinion--not Dalpa's. As far as them "whipsawing" us against ourselves, that can all be handled with a strict number of extra 70 seaters allowed, and a ratio with mainline aircraft---not to be exceeded... I personally don't think that Dalpa wants to give more up on scope with all of our furloughs out, but who knows? The MEC members I have personally talked to assured me that they would fight for the furloughs and try to help them. The 70 seater issue is not really tops on their agenda, but I think they would like to see a new 100 seater eventually, and that would help our guys/gals to return sooner. If Delta was ONLY going to order 70 seaters, I think Dalpa might consider a deal with the furloughs involved. That just makes sense.

Bye Bye--General Lee

 

[Medeco]

Question

Is ASA scoped on the number of 50/40 seaters or just the RJ700?

If yes, then how many?

Medeco

 

[sleepy]

Re: Question

Is ASA scoped on the number of 50/40 seaters or just the RJ700?

If yes, then how many?

Medeco

There is no DAL scope that pertains to ASA or Comair directly. It only limits the number of CR7's that may be operated by DCI. As it stands now, only ASA and Comair operate the CR7 for DCI. DCI may operate 57 of the CR7 aircraft

As far as total DCI Flying goes, it is a percentage of DAL mainline flying (around 48%). ASA and Comair do the majority of that flying, but some is contracted to Chit, Skywest and ACA.

 

[AFELLOWAVIATOR]

I think it goes a little deeper than that. There is language that restricts Comair and ASA from bidding on and flying code for any one but Delta. We are extremely restricted by the mainline contracT, although we do have our own. Funny how that works. Skywest can go after all the flying they want, but the Delta pilots decided we could not do the same. And some wonder where the RJDC came from.

 

[sleepy]

At a meeting last week at the GO, it was stated that ASA will begin hiring 24 pilots per month starting in March 2004. They will hire 24 per month for the rest of 2004.

That should be about 240 pilots in 2004!

 

[Wacopilot]

Gen,

Exactly how many furloughed Delta pilots did ASA hire?
and......How many are still there?

Waco

 

[General Lee]

Wacopilot,

I don't know the exact number, but it wasn't much---maybe 15?? I do know two of them, and they are very thankful.

Bye Bye--General Lee

 

[Tim47SIP]

Waco and Gen

19 is the number as of 4 months ago. There is a pool of Delta guys and they will get priority, but in a ratio. I have seen the stack (I walked in two resume's for Delta furloughee's), and it is fairly thick. The thinking here is that if we take on all Delta guys for new hires and a massive recall takes place, ASA will have serious manning problems. Although I dought that will occur, I can understand. I have flown with a few of these guys (Jump seated; they were FO's) and they were great. Outstanding individuals, even when sitting next to that proverbial "snot nose captain". Anyway, I hope that they all get to come here soon.