ASA Ant March coming up

[av8tor4239]

March 15 and March 17 2005 at the ATL airport.. We are doing informational picketing, and we need your help! Log onto the MEC website

www.alpa.org

and sign up!

 

[Ted Striker]

Bump!!

March 15 and March 17 2005 at the ATL airport.. We are doing informational picketing, and we need your help! Log onto the MEC website

www.alpa.org

and sign up!

Spread the word!!

 

[Sinca3]

Put Up Or Shut Up!!!

Fellow ASA pilots.......
This is our chance to show our leaders, on both sides of the fence, that we are ready to "get this party started"!
Let's show our MEC and our managment that we are tired of the pace of these neg. Let's show them that we are emotionally and financially prepared to do whatever it takes to get a fair contract.
It's time to put up or shut up. For every complaint on ops or in the crew lounges there should be hundreds of pilots willing to get off their a$$es.
Get the word out and show your support.....

 

[captain caveman]

It's amazing what walking in circles for three hours non stop will do for your motivation to acquire a fair contract. When you go back to the line and think about what you did on your last day off, you will unlikely feel the need to limp that aircraft back to ATL, like MC asks, or go that extra round trip without taking a break to eat. If everyone did this, we would have a new contract in no time. This is not to mention the effect it has on management who have to watch their passengers walk by their pilots who are potentially unhappy.

Just do it. Besides, there is food provided by your union dues.

 

[FmrFreightDog]

Why aren't we spacing it out a little more like we did last time?? I'm working Tues-Thurs. this month, so I can't participate. Any chance of adding a day?

 

[letthebigdogeat]

See you guys and gals on the 15th.

 

[180ToTheMarker]

I want to walk too but am working mon-thurs. Give 'em hell for me boys.

 

[av8tor4239]

I wanted to get this thread back to the top for those of you just joining the forum. If your happen to be in ATL on the 15 or 17, and you dont work for ASA.. feel free to put your ALPA pin on and come support us.

The better we do in our contract, the better you all will do in yours..

 

[Realyman]

Heck with that, organize a sick out! More effective! Works good, lasts a long time.


Just lose it!!!!!!! hahahahahahahahaha.......go crazy....oh baby....
12 people are about to get a pay raise today!!!!

 

[Ted Striker]

Heck with that, organize a sick out! More effective! Works good, lasts a long time.


Just lose it!!!!!!! hahahahahahahahaha.......go crazy....oh baby....
12 people are about to get a pay raise today!!!!

Realyman, you're clueless. Care to guess how much the APA got fined for doing that. It's illegal and would do us more harm than good.

On the original topic...everyone get in line and march. Spread the word.

 

[MetroSheriff]

Heck with that, organize a sick out! More effective! Works good, lasts a long time.


Just lose it!!!!!!! hahahahahahahahaha.......go crazy....oh baby....
12 people are about to get a pay raise today!!!!

A mind is a terrible thing to waste...

 

[Sinca3]

bump....... to the top you go

 

[av8tor4239]

thanks sinca...

 

[exeagle]

bump..

 

[flap operator]

Good luck ASA... hey - at least it is MArch in ATL instead of November in MSP!! Just don't let your MEC blink and screw you over with a "virtual" strike.


FO

 

[av8tor4239]

Need more views...

 

[VABB]

March 15 and March 17 2005 at the ATL airport.. We are doing informational picketing, and we need your help! Log onto the MEC website

www.alpa.org

and sign up!

This ought to be really funny. In addition to carrying picket signs, are you guys going to also carry a stack of resumes to hand out to every UPS and FedEx pilot you see walk by?

The general public doesen't care about the cause of the regionals. Their only concern when they buy a ticket on Delta is "am I flying on Delta or one of those little planes painted up like Delta?"

What are you going to be picketing for, higher wages? Better work rules?

I hate to point out the obvious, but you have nobody to blame but yourselves. All those years of people willing to fly for peanuts, pay-for-training, and soon to be pay-for-fleet (i.e., Comair) just to walk through the terminal in a pilot's uniform fresh out of Riddle.

You crapped in your own playpen, now live with it.

 

[Palerider957]

This ought to be really funny. In addition to carrying picket signs, are you guys going to also carry a stack of resumes to hand out to every UPS and FedEx pilot you see walk by?

The general public doesen't care about the cause of the regionals. Their only concern when they buy a ticket on Delta is "am I flying on Delta or one of those little planes painted up like Delta?"

What are you going to be picketing for, higher wages? Better work rules?

I hate to point out the obvious, but you have nobody to blame but yourselves. All those years of people willing to fly for peanuts, pay-for-training, and soon to be pay-for-fleet (i.e., Comair) just to walk through the terminal in a pilot's uniform fresh out of Riddle.

You crapped in your own playpen, now live with it.

As much as I'd like to shove VAAB's visceral tone up his a$$--complete with my boot, he does make some valid points. Regionals have willingly put up with shi.tty contracts for years, and the public does NOT care one bit about us.

Having said all that, I WILL be there to march. And I am MORE than willing to STRIKE...Christ, an 89 day strike would be a welcomed vacation.

 

[CF34-3B1]

Personally, I'd love to put to the test the theory that since ASA only accounts for 4% of DAL's revenue, a strike here wouldn't really impact Mother D.

 

[av8tor4239]

Vabb, your outlook on things disappoints me.. I dont know if you fly for a regional or not, but how do you expect things to get better if you dont fight for them? Are you content in just letting the past practices of the regional pilots eat away at our quality of life and pay scales...

Whether you work for a regional or not you should know that these jobs are not stepping stones to majors anymore. Unless you are connected, or just retired from NASA we will be at our regional airlines for a while.

You must also understand that the "regionals" are not what they used to be when PFT was in effect. We are now flying outside the boarders of the USA and from coast to coast with Pilot domiciles in many cities as opposed to one place.

Comments like yours dumbfound me because you/we are paying union dues to protect and enhance our lives... One of the steps in this process is to negotiate fair contracts.. When management decides to act in BAD FAITH BARGAINING and prolong negotiations for years and years and years and years, we must step up to the plate and represent ourselves and INFORMATIONAL PICKETING is a very effective way to do several things:

First is to inform the public that the carrier they are flying on is underpaid, overworked, and being treated unfairly..

Most importantly it is to show managment both ASA and Mother D that we are a UNIFIED pilot group and sick of the delayed bullsh!t. It rallies the troops and has a psycological effect on pilots flying the line.. Like Cptn caveman mentioned in an earlier post.. When you spend your day off walking in cirlcles it motivates you to fly the contract and FARS.. NOTHING MORE, NOTHING LESS. (none of this limping airplanes to the mx base, or using your cellphone to call dispatch, etc.)

 

[captain caveman]

Vabb, you're a class act. I hope I can grow up one day and graduate from the commuters and be a better pilot like you are. I hope I'm good enough to fly with the likes of you even though I stooped to the commuter trash level at one point and you didn't have to. Thanks for your support and I'll be there marching with my resume in hand just in case you grace our presence with your holier than thou little weewee.

 

[US Flyer]

This ought to be really funny. In addition to carrying picket signs, are you guys going to also carry a stack of resumes to hand out to every UPS and FedEx pilot you see walk by?

What are you going to be picketing for, higher wages? Better work rules?

I hate to point out the obvious, but you have nobody to blame but yourselves. All those years of people willing to fly for peanuts, pay-for-training, and soon to be pay-for-fleet (i.e., Comair) just to walk through the terminal in a pilot's uniform fresh out of Riddle.

You crapped in your own playpen, now live with it.

VABB, From reading your previous posts and all the trash talk of many other airlines, you seem to have an opinion and/or crystal ball about everything.

1) I didn't crap in the playpen where I work, someone else did years before I came here. I have never paid for training anywhere I have worked, and never will.

2) YES, we want better work rules, doesn't everyone?

3) YES we want higher wages. Our pay scales are designed to have an FO upgrade in approximately 18-24 months, not seven years. DAL may be losing money but we certainly aren't.

If you don't work for ASA and have anything to really contribute to the debate, then mind your own business.

 

[captain caveman]

Concerned about being stapled to the bottom of Skywest's list?

Show up and show potential investors about ASA's unresolved labor mismanagment.

 

[capt.snitch]

Are you guy's crazy? Just because it is no longer the industry that mommy sent you off to in your BMW is no reason to destroy our company. The problem with our rapid growth is that we have had to hire a lot of people who didn't "earn" it. You, or your parents,bought you a license and the first job you ever held was as a jet pilot with "Delta." (I hear you telling people that you are "a Delta pilot."

Get a grip, the world changes and with it, the airline industry. The world has finally figured out that we are button pushing mid-level managers, not sky gods. We had better realize that we are LABOR. Blue collar. We practice a trade, not a profession. If your ego can't accept that, get out of the bus driving business.

Bob Arnold is probably nearing 60 and doesn't care about your future. He is bitter, not at ASA, but at Ronald Reagan. He followed his union leader out on strike and challenged Reagan. Reagan did not blink and fired all of the controllers who walked, including Bob. Why do you believe that Delta won't send THEIR AIRCRAFT to a lower bidder if we walk out or even drive our costs up and our performance down with some sort of a job action.

Take a deep breath. If you don't want to be here, exercise your liberty and depart. If youwant to fly with a company that may have a future, get on board. I read a lot of complaining on this forum, but I remember that less than ten of us showed up at the first LEC following the commencement of negotiations. Why should the company negotiate, we don't seem to care!

 

[av8tor4239]

Are you guy's crazy? Just because it is no longer the industry that mommy sent you off to in your BMW is no reason to destroy our company. The problem with our rapid growth is that we have had to hire a lot of people who didn't "earn" it. You, or your parents,bought you a license and the first job you ever held was as a jet pilot with "Delta." (I hear you telling people that you are "a Delta pilot."

How do you figure the pilots will destroy our company? It is a double edge sword.. I also can assure you that everyone that is flying at ASA has earned it.. Some have worked harder than others to get where they are but everyone has earned it.

Do you really think that the people in the GO care about you or your family? Do you think that they are looking out for you best interests? (Frank Lorenzo)

Get a grip, the world changes and with it, the airline industry. The world has finally figured out that we are button pushing mid-level managers, not sky gods. We had better realize that we are LABOR. Blue collar. We practice a trade, not a profession. If your ego can't accept that, get out of the bus driving business.

Your right about the bus driver thing.. If we dont represent ourselves we will be bus drivers.. No one is asking to be a "sky god", but we do ask for a fair contract with a decent QOL. As pilots, i feel that we are both skilled labor and professional labor.

cptn snitch.. thank you for your union dues we all appreciate your financial support!

 

[US Flyer]

Are you guy's crazy? Just because it is no longer the industry that mommy sent you off to in your BMW is no reason to destroy our company. The problem with our rapid growth is that we have had to hire a lot of people who didn't "earn" it. You, or your parents,bought you a license and the first job you ever held was as a jet pilot with "Delta." (I hear you telling people that you are "a Delta pilot."

I love being reminded periodically that things at ASA were even worse in the past and I don't know how good I have it. That inspires me to really feel good about all of my monthly bills I can barely pay.

I personally have only flown with a few guys that fit your description, and never heard them mention that they were Delta pilots. Excellent point about the LEC meeting - I agree that this company has the potential to be great. But I also came here with a much better attitude than I have over four years later. (And yes, I flight instructed for two years, flew freight, flew bush planes and worked crappy part 135 jobs before coming here- no silver spoon in my mouth).

I would consider myself a mid-level manager (with low level pay) given the amount of pay to level of responsibility. I personally believe ASA has grown to its level of incompetence. Without a massive shake-up and cleanout of most of the mid and upper level managers, it will be a slow and painful next twenty + years of tiny, incremental changes.

I've been actively looking for a really good corporate job, and WILL happily leave if I have to for a better quality of life.

 

[CandlerWun]

We practice a trade, not a profession.

What, in your opinion, is the difference, and why is one "better" than the other? Sounds to me like you have diminished our vocation in your mind by attaching a "negative" label to it. Any job, when practiced long enough and when everything is going normally, starts to look easy to outsiders, and it actually becomes so for the practitioner. The aspect of what we do that demands a higher level of committment is the requirement to have the self-discipline to remain always prepared for the times when things do not proceed normally.

To me, professionalism is all about the attitude that one takes toward his work, and that does not necessarily correlate to any particular level of compensation. We should never feel apologetic or embarassed about the job we do. It is a great responsibility; bear it with pride! Josh M.

 

[capt.snitch]

How do you figure the pilots will destroy our company? It is a double edge sword.. I also can assure you that everyone that is flying at ASA has earned it.. Some have worked harder than others to get where they are but everyone has earned it.

Do you really think that the people in the GO care about you or your family? Do you think that they are looking out for you best interests? (Frank Lorenzo)

The pilots have the capacity to close the company because they are uninvolved in our union. ALPA doesn't give a darn about any of us. Their job in this fight is to protect the Delta pilots. After they encourage us to do informational picketing and some of our fellow pilots start engaging in their individual job actions, ALPA will walk into Ginstein's office and point out the problems that he is having with the wholly owned and push for Delta pilots to fly at least the 70 seaters. They may ignore the 50 seaters because with oil at $55/barrel, they may soon become too expensive to operate. Remember, we only make money because Delta wants us to. My understanding is that we get paid on a fee per departure basis and that ASA makes money on every flight no matter how many people are on it. I doubt that that program will continue if our performance doesn't improve.

I don't believe that the GO has any responsibility for my family any more than the government does. That is my responsibility and I will continue to bear it. The company says that they are offering a "cost neutral" contract at a time when other companies are extracting concessions and I for one don't have a problem with that. I'll take a little bit more pay in exchange for working a little bit more.

Some of us are blustering and trumpeting that we have to raise the bar and I don't see how we can today. The revenue is just not there and if I were younger, I would look to get out. Should have gone to business school rather than learn to fly. The future seems to be for the doctors, dentists, accountants and pharmacists among us who fly for fun.

 

[BlackCoffee]

Wow Capt. Snatch. Great post. You should really check out this site. It could help people like you! www.fda.gov/fdac/features/396_yst.html

 

[av8tor4239]

cptn snitch:

Our load factors on Delta and the delta connection carriers are at pre 9/11 levels.. The problem is not the Labor force, but rather the problem is whith the pricing structure and the competition from the Low Cost Carriers..

You have obviously been sucking on the KOOL AID nipple for a long time to belive that labor (pilots, agents, rampers, etc.) are the root of the financial problems.. Your thought process is in my opinion completely off, and is the reason pilot groups like comair have fallen into the "we make too much to survive" mind set.

cptn snitch.. Let me ask you this: Do you know that there are many ways to improve our work rules in our contract while at the same time increasing the productivity of our workforce in a fair contract.

If the FAA would allow our managment to train monkeys to fly CRJ's and ATR's they would rush to opportunity to do so. Why are you so willing to lay down and let management walk on you and what you have worked so hard to attain?

ASA is a critical part of the Delta network... Both sides of the table are going to request their "christmas list" from the other, and that then gets negotiated down to a fair and workable contract. Please remember that not everyone at ASA is a Senior 700 captain.. We have First Officers that have been on reserve for 3 and more years and are struggling to support thier families on the pay and work rules that are in place. These First Officers are also looking at 5-10 year upgrades. Our Current contract that was signed in 1998 was not designed to be in place for 6 or more years.. It was negotiated to be in place for 4 years. We are now in year the 6th year of operating under this agreement. Under the 1998 agreement, First officers were upgrading before they finished IOE.. That is not the case now.

Remember also our managment team approached us in 2003 and asked us to suspend section 6 negotiations for new shiny airplanes.. That tells you right there, they have no desire or intent to bargin in good faith. There is a reason the Railway Labor Act was put into place. History tells us it is managements goal to get there employees to do as much work for as little compensation under the worst working conditions possible.

In closing, You have every right to represent your opinion on the matter of contract negotiations. Although we disagree on the integrity of our representation, I respect your right to not participate in the bettering of our lives.. I will be out there fighting to improve the pay and quality of life of all of our ASA pilots (INCLUDING YOURS).

PS.. your last statement about wanting to leave, but being too old to leave makes me laugh.. The only people that do not want to particitpate to better our working environment are ONLY the people that dont want to be here in the first place.. Maybe you should take your own advice... Free up a seat.