Anyone hear NY app yell at 888BW last night?

[Yank McCobb]

Besides that, Jet Blue 182 was one traffic call, Jet Blue 29 another. It was Jet Blue 29 that was the object of his evasive maneuver.

Bernoulli...at least get your fact straight (Jet Blue 182 "heavy", wrong Jet Blue, etc...) if you want to be taken at least partly seriously.

 

[Valkyrie]

Another emergency landed on 4R @ JFK 10 minutes ago.

 

[Yank McCobb]

Moral of the story...avoid NY like your life depended on it.

 

[apcooper]

I synked the animation and audio within 10 sec and am going to give some constructive criticism to ATC! When JB 29 was on what looked like a 150 hdg out of JFK, ATC cleared him up to 7000 while 8BW was on a 060 hdg at 7500. I think I would have had JB 29 stop at 5000 on the same heading since there would have been no conflicting traffic at all below 7000 looking at the animation. The controller should have picked up on many cues several minutes before the incident that 8BW wasn't really sharp on the radio time after time and seemed a bit overwhelmed. That would have made it seem prudent to give 2500 ft seperation instead of 500. This just isn't a lot of breathing room since if both pilots are 150 off their assigned altitude (perfectly legal) then there would only be 200 ft between each of them. You'd think ATC in a radar environment unless absolutly necessary would not put a VFR and an IFR aircraft 500ft apart. This would have been illegal for 2 IFR's and that to me is a safer bet than an IFR and a VFR.


I don't want to monday morning QB too much but rather have pilots and controllers learn from mistakes. I wholeheartedly believe ATCers deserve every dime of their pay for the stress they endure and of course everyone here knows the bottom 80% of pilots are criminally underpaid as well.

 

[FlyChicaga]

Seriously, do you fly in NYC? Do you have any idea just how many airplanes (and helos) are flying around there? It's insane. But I wouldn't trade it for the world. Those NY controllers are some of the best in the world. Same could be said for the Chicago controllers at ORD and MDW.

Well if you'd like to tell them, you do have the number up there.

 

[apcooper]

Seriously, do you fly in NYC? Do you have any idea just how many airplanes (and helos) are flying around there? It's insane. But I wouldn't trade it for the world. Those NY controllers are some of the best in the world. Same could be said for the Chicago controllers at ORD and MDW.

Well if you'd like to tell them, you do have the number up there.

I am not second guessing ATC at all. When making my assesment of how they seperated the traffic I had one luxury that they did not have. Hindsight. I probably could fly a lot better than most of them but they would kick my butt anytime, anyday in terms of not only seperating all that metal but also keeping delays to the minimum possible! As you rightly pointed out, 99% are find folks deserving of every dime they make. I can't think of a single profession that requires being responsible for more lives every hour that is so demanding. Being a pilot is not far behind ATC IMHO. Don't get me started down this road though!!!!!!!!!!!!

 

[FlyChicaga]

I am not second guessing ATC at all.

Wait. What is this?

I synked the animation and audio within 10 sec and am going to give some constructive criticism to ATC! When JB 29 was on what looked like a 150 hdg out of JFK, ATC cleared him up to 7000 while 8BW was on a 060 hdg at 7500. I think I would have had JB 29 stop at 5000 on the same heading since there would have been no conflicting traffic at all below 7000 looking at the animation. The controller should have picked up on many cues several minutes before the incident that 8BW wasn't really sharp on the radio time after time and seemed a bit overwhelmed. That would have made it seem prudent to give 2500 ft seperation instead of 500. This just isn't a lot of breathing room since if both pilots are 150 off their assigned altitude (perfectly legal) then there would only be 200 ft between each of them. You'd think ATC in a radar environment unless absolutly necessary would not put a VFR and an IFR aircraft 500ft apart. This would have been illegal for 2 IFR's and that to me is a safer bet than an IFR and a VFR.

Just curious.

 

[Metro752]

Aww come on man. We should talk about your avatar, which film does she appear in? Disney produced?

 

[FlyChicaga]

It's aviation related, is it not?

 

[ISaidRightTurns]

I think I would have had JB 29 stop at 5000 on the same heading since there would have been no conflicting traffic at all below 7000 looking at the animation. The controller should have picked up on many cues several minutes before the incident that 8BW wasn't really sharp on the radio time after time and seemed a bit overwhelmed.

Here's the thing. If you start giving 1500' both sides of every pilot behind the power curve, especially a flying road block like a cherokee, you will run outta airspace real quick.