Anyone else turned down by UPS?

[2LT]

%

During basic indoc recently, PD came in and talked w/ our class. He said they would interview approximately 900 to get right around 300 'new hires.' So, even though that seems a bit on the low side to me, that's the info that's being put out. Perhaps those numbers have changed/will change for '07? In any case, what we were told last year.

 

[174037]

For those that have interviewed recently, how long does it take to hear back from UPS after your interview, good, bad or otherwise? If you get the thumbs up is it a phone call?

 

[Iron Man]

Thanks to the internet and any number of commercial databases, a company can compile quite a bit of information on you using nothing more than your name, address, and DOB. The information is just a mouse-click away, has nothing to do with the PRIA, and they are not required to get your permission to access it, nor to notify you that they have done so.

I'm not saying this applies to you specifically, but I don't know anybody who's ever been hired at UPS that had a DUI, a bankruptcy, an FAA violation, or a criminal conviction of any kind, ever. You have to be lily-clean...cleaner than their trucks, and certainly cleaner than many pilots I know...just to get a job driving a delivery route for them.

Whistlin Dan,
Would it not be fair for UPS then to state clearly in their minimum requirements : Positively no DUI's, Accidents, Convictions, Violations, etc.

 

[Waborita]

For those that have interviewed recently, how long does it take to hear back from UPS after your interview, good, bad or otherwise? If you get the thumbs up is it a phone call?

They notify you by the United States Postal Service. It took 11 days for me to get the "GREAT" news! My postman will never forget me. hehe Many have posted here any where from 2 days up to 30 days.

When I interviewed 02/07 they said it averaged 4 weeks for a pool notification, but they were trying to reduce that to 2 weeks. Hope this helps?

 

[ACL65PILOT]

Call them. They will tell you if you can re-interview. I got shot down a few years ago.
They had my first name wrong on the letter. IE they pulled the wrong NDR. I told them that. I was then told that they would let me reapply in six months. I have not heard anything in two years.
Fact is that no one that they have turned down in recent history has gotten another interview.

 

[Whistlin' Dan]

Would it not be fair for UPS then to state clearly in their minimum requirements : Positively no DUI's, Accidents, Convictions, Violations, etc.

I don't know what the legalities would be regarding that, but most companies have 2 sets of rules by which they hire...the ones they publish, and the ones it really takes to be competitive. For example, Delta Airlines never specifically said that one had to be an ex-military pilot to be considered for employment, but I don't know of anybody hired prior to 1990 or so who wasn't.

Look at the so-called "stanine test" that United Airlines used to administer to prospective applicants. How many good pilots (many ex-military) didn't get hired there because they didn't know the temperature at which Brie cheese should be served, or who the Prime Minister of Canada was?

As long as there are many more well-qualified candidates for a job than there are actual positions available, hiring will be in large part subjective. That's why it's always a good idea to have "more than one iron in the fire" (preferably 3 or 4) when looking for a flying job.

 

[bravodude]

whats the upgrade time

 

[b19]

Congrats on getting the interview, and I can't really imagine how bad it must have felt to not get a dream job worth millions, retirement, benefits, security etc. All I can say in response to a lot of the very good advice you have recieved is that eventually good things happen to good people. So hopefully your time is coming.

 

[Whistlin' Dan]

I can't really imagine how bad it must have felt to not get a dream job worth millions, retirement, benefits, security etc.

Whew! I had to go back and look at the title of this thread. I thought for a minute you were talking about Delta, United, Braniff, Eastern, Pan Am, TWA, USAir, Continental (the old one, not the new one) or even DHL.

I had lunch a while back with an acquaintance who spoke of how burned he was at not being hired at United some years back. It was his dream job, the one he really wanted, and he figured that being a somewhat distinguished ex-military jock he would be a shoe-in.

Except it didn't happen. His buddy got hired and he didn't. So after a period of "mourning" he accepted a position with another, "lesser" airline.

At the time of our meeting, he was an F/O, flying International wide-body with that "lesser" carrier, while his buddy was still on furlough from United. His airline had taken some pay hits, but he was still making well into six-figures, while his buddy was tarring roofs in Chicago. Where each of them will be in 10 years is anybody's guess, but I'd say the future looks better for him than it does for his buddy at United.

As for cargo, the volume of domestic overnight express shipments is leveling off, and the margin on those shipments is shrinking. The real growth in domestic shipments has been in those that are trucked, not flown. The increase in International traffic has certainly fueled the need for more pilots at UPS and FedEx. But with that growth comes some very stiff competition from ACMI and foreign carriers. There's a lot of speculation in the Ivory Towers of Memphis and Atlanta about what the next 10 years are going to be like in this industry...speculation that's starting to be reflected in the stock prices of the major players. Most agree that the glory days are behind us, and that the real work is about to begin.

Missing out on this "million dollar job" may still turn out to be the best thing that ever happens to this guy...

 

[capt. megadeth]

Missing out on this "million dollar job" may still turn out to be the best thing that ever happens to this guy...

Very true.

 

[AV80R]

Fact is that no one that they have turned down in recent history has gotten another interview.

I don't think that's true, I believe there was a new-hire in the early spring of 2006 (can't remember which month) who was hired on a second trial. His previous interview was 1 1/2 years earlier. I was told he tanked his simride first time around. Also, he had civilian background. Unfortunately, that’s all I know/heard.

 

[L'il J.Seinfeld]

Whew! I had to go back and look at the title of this thread. I thought for a minute you were talking about Delta, United, Braniff, Eastern, Pan Am, TWA, USAir, Continental (the old one, not the new one) or even DHL.

I had lunch a while back with an acquaintance who spoke of how burned he was at not being hired at United some years back. It was his dream job, the one he really wanted, and he figured that being a somewhat distinguished ex-military jock he would be a shoe-in.

Except it didn't happen. His buddy got hired and he didn't. So after a period of "mourning" he accepted a position with another, "lesser" airline.

At the time of our meeting, he was an F/O, flying International wide-body with that "lesser" carrier, while his buddy was still on furlough from United. His airline had taken some pay hits, but he was still making well into six-figures, while his buddy was tarring roofs in Chicago. Where each of them will be in 10 years is anybody's guess, but I'd say the future looks better for him than it does for his buddy at United.

As for cargo, the volume of domestic overnight express shipments is leveling off, and the margin on those shipments is shrinking. The real growth in domestic shipments has been in those that are trucked, not flown. The increase in International traffic has certainly fueled the need for more pilots at UPS and FedEx. But with that growth comes some very stiff competition from ACMI and foreign carriers. There's a lot of speculation in the Ivory Towers of Memphis and Atlanta about what the next 10 years are going to be like in this industry...speculation that's starting to be reflected in the stock prices of the major players. Most agree that the glory days are behind us, and that the real work is about to begin.

Missing out on this "million dollar job" may still turn out to be the best thing that ever happens to this guy...

I can respect this post very much. It's much better to be conservative and then enjoy it when expectations are exceeded. However, I totally disagree with it.

The majority of UPS and FDX profits still come from the domestic market. The domestic market is still growing, but very modestly and there is intense competition. FDX has been taking market share from UPS ever since the Teamsters strike nearly 10 years ago. The domestic margins are narrow. That means that it may cost UPS $5.00 to move a box of nails and they can only charge $6 due to competition. The international market is where the money is because UPS can charge $50 to move the same box of nails that costs them only a few dollars more to move than if it was domestic. The intl margins are huge and there are few players.

If you are an American company who manufactures a product in China and you want to get it to the marketplace as quickly as possible the ACMIs are not an option. To get it from the factory to the store shelf you only have 3 options; UPS, FDX, and DHL. These are the only companies capable of factory to front door delivery. The barriers to entering this industry are so high that it's almost impossible to get into it.

The other thing that makes the futures so bright for UPS/FDX is India. The remarkable growth of China over the last few years may be nothing compared to what may be coming from the Indians. China is still a communist state, but India is a democracy and has a much better infrastructure than China in terms of education and entrpreneurship. China and INdia are advancing 350 million people per year into the middle class. Theoretically in 10 years all of the MD-11s at UPS/FDX will be going to Asia full of goods manufactured in Central America. That would effectively DOUBLE to intl profits of the cargo carriers.

Many UPS guys have always said that UPS is a trucking company with airplanes. That was probably true in 1988, but today it's not. UPS has its hands in a lot of cookie jars. UPS Supply Chain Solutions and UPS Capital have truly made Brown a global provider of logistics services and not just a trucking company.

I could see our pilot force double in 10 years. We JA on an almost daily basis on the intl side already. Many accurately thought that the US was a sleeping industrial giant prior to WWII. The same is true for India and China and they both could have larger economies that the US in the next 20 years. If that happens UPS and FDX pilots would be in Fat City. Just my opinion but I think I am right.

 

[jhflyhi]

As to the violation question posted. I interviewed 8 months ago, and never received a response for 6 weeks. I finally called them and they had lost my paperwork. They took down my name and address then sent me a rejection letter that arrived 4 days later. They said the letter was already mailed before my phone call. There are other people being hired with violations, failed check rides and letters of investigation. The key is to have someone on the inside tacking your paperwork and putting in good words for you. If I had that my paperwork wouldn't have been displaced. I'll keep trying.

Good Luck!

 

[174037]

Anyone interviewed in the last couple of weeks heard anything back from UPS?

 

[captch11]

Some of us do know Timetoquit, and he is a great guy. Luck has a significant amount to do with getting a job at this level of the biz. I hope Timetoquit gets another shot next year. He'd be a great addition to the UPS ranks.

Whatever happens, good people will make the best of any situation. Every interview is a crap-shoot. Over the last 13 years, I've been hired at 11 airlines including UA, ATA, World and UPS. Chances are the Brown Hat will carry me through the next 24 (or 29) years, but I've been wrong about the "sure thing" before and been furloughed enough times to fill a closet with uniforms. I've also got more great friends, mentors, good jokes, incredible experiences and fond memories than anyone my age deserves. This is the greatest job in the world... it ain't what it used to be, but it still beats working for a living.

I've also been shot down at AS, FDX and SWA. There are always things that you'd like to say/do different, but even with the deck stacked in your favor (1,100 in type w/737 type, 10,000TT, 5,000 PIC turbine, checkairman, 15 recs, etc when I got the no thanx from SWA) sometimes it's your day and sometimes it's not. If I had gotten the job at SWA, I wouldn't have had nearly 2 great years at World with some of the greatest folks in the biz, and some of the best flying around, then ended up at UPS. Keep trying. Sometimes the best jobs are the ones you least expect. Enjoy the journey. There is no destination. Worry about the things you can control, and take the things you can't in stride. An unexpected change in course can lead to undiscovered treasure.

Happy Contrails, and good luck to everyone.

"Hey Peter, man. Watch out for da' cornhole"
-Office Space