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American the place to be in a few years?

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Green said:
Contrast that with a RyanAir pilot in Europe. They spend 50k to get their type, then get hired by RyanAir at 23 years old with 250 hours total time. Pay is 85 Euros per hour for the right seat and 130 Euros for the left with a 5 year or so upgrade. These guys are making over 100k from the moment they join the airline industry. They have already earned approximately 1.5-2 million dollars by the time they reach the average age of an AA newhire. This is the carrier that is the supposed bottom feeder of the industry.
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Don't forget that the cost of living in Europe is WELL above that in the US. You can barely buy a park bench in the UK for what you can buy a 2,000 ft2 4bed house in most places in the US.

If you were living on $ and spending it in the US, flying for RyanAir would be a great deal.
 
Mud Eagle said:
Don't forget that the cost of living in Europe is WELL above that in the US. You can barely buy a park bench in the UK for what you can buy a 2,000 ft2 4bed house in most places in the US.

If you were living on $ and spending it in the US, flying for RyanAir would be a great deal.
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I love it how someone always find an excuse for the US pilots to be the lowest paid pilots in the civilized world. The Ryanair pilots are some of the lowest paid in Europe and they make as much on their first year captain pay as some of our 12 year seniority legacy captains, but since we have walmart I guess that is ok
 
Since you guys keep bringing up RyanAir maybe you should spend some time on pprune and check out what people have to say about them. Do they make decent money, some (captains) even quite good? They sure do. BUT, there are SO many things making one not wanting to work for RyanAir.

Not saying things are rosy at US carriers, but RyanAir takes the cake in my, and many other's, book.

I have JAR and the right to live in the EU and I'd honestly rather work at Walmart than RyanAir. I'd be more proud to work for Wally than O'Leary.
 
Dumb Pilot said:
I love it how someone always find an excuse for the US pilots to be the lowest paid pilots in the civilized world. The Ryanair pilots are some of the lowest paid in Europe and they make as much on their first year captain pay as some of our 12 year seniority legacy captains, but since we have walmart I guess that is ok
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It's not an excuse for anything. People frequently throw around Euro payscales as a comparison, but rarely grasp the serious economic differences between the cost of living in Europe vs the US.

This goes for jobs outside of aviation as well: the average wage for the "same" job pays higher than in the US. You are paid more, sure, but it costs a lot more, too. It has absolutely nothing to do with Europeans having fairer compensation -- it has everything to do with differences in economies and values of currency that have existed for many decades.

Again, look at the costs of housing -- I was recently living in the UK in an 1,100 ft2 house with 3 bedrooms that rented for $2500 a month, and that was one of the biggest houses in the neighborhood. Others were paying a similar mortgage (or rent) for even smaller, older houses.

It's not some panacea over there.
 
AAflyer said:
No, but probably better than Usairways.:eek:
AA
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Sorry but I gotta differ with you. We may be locking horns in labor battles but our relations with management is still far superior than the labor/management relations at AA. Unless my furlough is imminent I'll take a deferment if/when AA offers me recall. I don't need to leave the frying pan for the fire.
 
IFLYASA said:
I've been going over the numbers at AAI. They roughly have 11,000 pilots with over 1000 on furlough. They haven't hired since 2000-2001. Assuming most majors avg age for a new hire pilot is 35, their avg age for the last new hires is around 44ish.

With the age 65 rule kicking in, it will be much longer before they hire. Plus with the 1000 furloughs, I would say it may take at least 5 years for them to hire again. Now, that avg age new hire is around 49 years old. So in theory if these guys/gals go until 65, they will have to replace 11000 pilots within 15 years.

Talking about movement!
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Sounds eerily like what we all heard in 1999 about UAL regarding the people that were turning 60...looked how that turned out. Your assumption is a perfect world situation based on no other events like acts of terrorism or oil prices/shortages or airline mergers that may take place within the next 15 years that may affect air travel in some way. My point being, don't waste too many brain cells on it because it will all change and not work out the way you thought it would in the end.
 
Mud Eagle said:
I was recently living in the UK in an 1,100 ft2 house with 3 bedrooms that rented for $2500 a month, and that was one of the biggest houses in the neighborhood. Others were paying a similar mortgage (or rent) for even smaller, older houses.
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Where in the UK? you can't compare shallow gene pool USA with London, you have to compare it with a world class city like New York to be apples to apples. What can you rent for $2,500 in Manhattan?
 
Dumb Pilot said:
Where in the UK? you can't compare shallow gene pool USA with London, you have to compare it with a world class city like New York to be apples to apples. What can you rent for $2,500 in Manhattan?
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Out in the middle of nowhere in East Anglia. About 30 minutes from Cambridge.

I'm in the USAF, so it can't be too difficult to figure out what potential locations that might have been.
 
Does AA have unlimited recall rights????

jmreii said:
US airways may not be a good place to work but at least they don't have thousands of pilots on furlough hoping they never come back.
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Do AA furloughees have unlimited recall rights, or is there some sort of 10 year limit? Otherwise, would it not seem that soon the company may just run out the clock before hiring any more than absolutely necessary?
 
jmreii said:
US airways may not be a good place to work but at least they don't have thousands of pilots on furlough hoping they never come back.
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Why do you guys argue over who has the 'better' airline? They all suck, and it is no fault of anyone on this board (assuming airline management doesn't post here).

Pride in one's airline is like having pride over a prostitute. No airline or US company for that matter, feels any sense of loyalty or obligation to any of it's non-upper management employees, present and especially retired. So why would anyone get fired up about being Delta, Cal, Ual, Swa, or whatever?

Of course if you want to be a sucker and play management's game and go that extra mile (while you are operating under a concessionary or reduced pay and benefit contract) for the sake of getting a CEO's son or daughter a new $50,000 car or get them into a nice university, more power to you.
 
"Pride in one's airline is like having pride over a prostitute."

LMAO! I've flown with guys who brag about both.
 
If this industry is ever going to be a destination with any future then the RLA must be abolished.
 

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