American Eagle

[siucavflight]

LGA can be a very aggravating place to fly in and out of. I have hear lines there take a little longer to get, about 6-8 months.
But if you live there and can make a two hour call out RSV is not bad at all.

 

[shroomwell]

Again, I'll have been here 3 years in July, and at this time next year, barring nuclear war/$200 a barrell oil/the invention of flying cars etc. I FULLY expect to be close to upgrade, if not already there.

I'm just a guy who wants to get PIC time and get on with my life. AE's a great place to visit, just wouldn't wanna live there.

Call me a pessimist, but you are dreaming. Do some math on the senlist, and don't use unrealistic numbers like 40 upgrades a month.

 

[Starscream]

Before 9/11 they were upgrading 50 a month. The company has gotten well behind the power curve on upgrades because they were reluctant to take FOs off line and put them in the schoolhouse for two months. Then consider the fact that every flowback will have returned to AA at this time next year (summer at the latest I would imagine), and 40 upgrades a month is not urealistic at all. We're talking at LEAST 350 CA off the property in the next year, and that does not include normal attrition like retirements and upward movements to the larger carriers. Even though the 50 yr old + crowd might not wanna go anywhere, we've got a lot of guys here recently upgraded who are 32-40 years old. I can't see most of them committing the rest of their careers to this place. Although there are some CAs I've flown with (mid thirties types) who wouldn't go to CAL and upgrade to 737 CA in 4 years just because they don't wanna go to $35,000 a year for the first year. (Are you serious??????)

Back to my point, with the flowbacks leaving, normal attrition, and possibly an additional 10 SF340s coming back on line, 40 upgrades a month might not be enough this year. And don't forget, the CQFO program, if it works as intended (we'll see about that one though -- I can envision a scenario where it gives us another pounding in the rear) SF340/ATR CA will be going even more junior. Upgrade to jet CA will probably take just as long as it otherwise would have, though.

Conclusion: By the time every flowback is gone, junior TP CA WILL hit 2004 hires. I was 07/2004. Am I dreaming? Maybe, I dunno. And I certainly can't promise it, but based on the math, the upgrade time will drop to 4 years. Maybe lower. We'll see.

 

[siucavflight]

Call me a pessimist, but you are dreaming. Do some math on the senlist, and don't use unrealistic numbers like 40 upgrades a month.

Well last month there was 45 upgrades, and 50 for next month, do you think that we should a higher or lower number then 40?

 

[Starscream]

I interviewed and requested LGA, I seem to be the only person crazy enough to choose LGA, what gives? Is it that bad at LGA, and any word on how it takes to hold a line? I live in that area, which was the basis of my choice.

Pros of LGA

1. KILLER view of NYC just about every time you fly here. I'm a native NY'er and the view has yet to get "old."

2. This place will really sharpen your communications and flying skills. Runway use is more determined by airspace constraints than wind direction. Unlike the other bases, our flying is primarily to some of the other busiest airports in the country (BOS, JFK, EWR, DCA, CLT, DTW, CLE, ATL till next month, YYZ) so you will be flying into busy places every day, which, again, is great practice.

3. It's not as senior as LAX or DFW, but it's more senior than BOS or ORD (mid senior base). A little longer to hold a hard line (and I do mean just a little)

4. Better flying in general than most of the other bases, although I can't speak for SJU or LAX. (Our flying is virtually identical to BOS, we fly to the same destinations).

5. Manhattan is a great place to hang out. Again I've lived my whole life here and I still feel like a tourist. The capitol of the world in some people's opinion.
Unlimited nightlife options just about everywhere in Manhattan.

Cons of LGA

1. NY is one f#ckin expensive city. Crashpads I hear run around $250ish a month. I'm 27 and still live with my parents (subject to change this year when I go to 4th year pay).

2. Winter sucks (but it's just as bad in ORD and BOS)

3. #2 most most delayed airport in the country. This can be very frustrating at times, although things have improved here lately. Not many ground stops anymore on perfectly clear days with no wind.

4. NYC can be very intimidating for those who aren't used to city life. It is a very safe place as long as you don't do anything stupid. The areas around LGA are safe and decent. Some areas around JFK can be kinda rough.

5. Our FAs don't offer as much "eye candy" as the other bases. But for the most part they are cool to fly with, we just don't have many "attractive" ones. For those to whom this matters............

 

[Starscream]

Well last month there was 45 upgrades, and 50 for next month, do you think that we should a higher or lower number then 40?

Errrr........it's 29 this month (13 DFW/EMJ, 1 DFW/CRJ, 9 ORD/EMJ, 2 MIA/ATR, 3 DFW/SF3, 1 LAX/SF3). And they're not backfilling the first 2 LGA/EMJ, the first 2 BOS/EMJ, or the first SJU/ATR, so it could be slightly less than 29, depending on who bids what.

50 woulda be sweet, though.

 

[siucavflight]

I will have to go back and count, I came up with 51, hum, maybe I am just stupid.
45 last month right? Or did I mis count that also?

 

[Starscream]

Yep 45 last month. But only 29 this month. It's on jetnet on the AE pilots page.

 

[siucavflight]

Yep 45 last month. But only 29 this month. It's on jetnet on the AE pilots page.

Yep, just saw it, mis read it, thank you. That sucks, but I guess still an improvement.

 

[Starscream]

Anything's better than the 10-12 per month they were running just a couple months ago. I'm hoping the May bid will be another monster (40+).

 

[shroomwell]

You can probably get away with 30 upgrades a month until all the flowbacks are gone, however after that you will be lucky to see 10 a month.

 

[Swaayze]

Unfortunately Shroom's correct. The difference in pre 9/11 needs and current needs is night and day. Pre 9/11 was significant growth, attrition, and training bubble. Now we have temporary significant attrition but very little growth (whenever they can finally staff the additional Saabs). It will come down temporarily here but then right back to where we are now when the FBs are gone and age 65 takes effect. Very good place to work (relatively - speaking of the regionals), not so good place to look for PIC in the near future.

 

[Flybet3]

well like many FO's I can understand as to why some stay even if the upgrade will take time. Job security when you have a family is vital. I know for a fact that if I ever go back to a regional IE American Eagle, it will be because of the job security. The upgrade will come at some point eventually. The thing is that everyone is still thinking and is expecting things to be like they were 10, 15 or even 20 years ago. You went to a regional, fly a prop, upgrade fast and then get on with a major and make money. Well, as we all know that isnt really the case anymore. Yeah, you can go to a regional, upgrade and get your 1000 PIC turbine. But the competition is very high and now a days it's not much about your Turbine PIC but of who you know (CAL for example), look at Fed Ex and even southwest! to get an interview is nearly impossible unless you have someone recommend you. But then again, if you know people and you can get your PIC turb and have a something guaranteed. Then by all means got to skywest. The benefits, and job security at eagle are very very tempting.

 

[PilotChapin]

well like many FO's I can understand as to why some stay even if the upgrade will take time. Job security when you have a family is vital. I know for a fact that if I ever go back to a regional IE American Eagle, it will be because of the job security. The upgrade will come at some point eventually. The thing is that everyone is still thinking and is expecting things to be like they were 10, 15 or even 20 years ago. You went to a regional, fly a prop, upgrade fast and then get on with a major and make money. Well, as we all know that isnt really the case anymore. Yeah, you can go to a regional, upgrade and get your 1000 PIC turbine. But the competition is very high and now a days it's not much about your Turbine PIC but of who you know (CAL for example), look at Fed Ex and even southwest! to get an interview is nearly impossible unless you have someone recommend you. But then again, if you know people and you can get your PIC turb and have a something guaranteed. Then by all means got to skywest. The benefits, and job security at eagle are very very tempting.

For married folks that's what it's al about. Job security and being able to have a secure future for the little ones.

 

[Starscream]

You can probably get away with 30 upgrades a month until all the flowbacks are gone, however after that you will be lucky to see 10 a month.

That's ok. You have your projectection of where things are headed (I'm sure others share your view), and the rest of us have ours. Again, I'm figuring for myself and others hired in 2004 that it'll be between 4 and 4 1/2 years from DOH to hold TP captain. It won't be 7 1/2 years either, that I can almost guarantee (barring catastrophe). I could certainly be wrong. I hope I'm not. I hope you are, and if you're at AE, I'm sure you hope it doesn't play out the way you see it. I'm not saying that flowbacks alone leaving will bring upgrade times down to under 4 years. That will help a lot, as right now, if every flowback were gone, the junior CA would be a mid 2001 hire. Small SF340 growth, an increase in CA attrition due to more and more legacies hiring, and the new CQFO program (let's all pray it's not another screw!ng) should really get this thing under control. And you know management is just aching to bring longevity down any way they can. All these factors should bring upgrade time to something reasonable in the not too distant future.

And if we do upgrade 30 a month from here on, I don't know about any one else, but I'd be upgrading in 17 months from now, making it a 4 year 1 month upgrade. Not great, but not as bad as it could've been.

 

[siucavflight]

Dont forget also that there was an almost two year hiring freeze from Sept 2001 to July 2003, so once the last guy from 01 upgrades the upgrade time will drop two years over night because the next upgrade will be a 2003 hire.

 

[Starscream]

2 years 4 month hiring freeze and it will go to a 1/19/2004 hire to be exact :beer:

 

[Flybet3]

We also dont know what the future holds. The industry might experience another hiring boom, or take another hit and no one will hire again. My advice is this, get a job now not based on upgrade (maybe a little) but one based on if the industry gets hit hard again and no one hires for 3,4 or even 5 years you will be able to stand it and not put a bullet in your brain. What would you prefer? being a 5 year FO at Eagle? have good job security, benefits and good QOL? or being a 5 year FO at Ameriflight/Cherry Air/Grand air or some crappy 135 operator? might have a bit more pay, but lame bennies, crappy equipment and the worst QOL! think about that

 

[NWaviator]

What is it like flying out of LAX? Are the loads ussually full? Are they thinking about bringing PSP back or any expansion? I saw the lines and they look pretty good for a commuter.
I was suppose to interview today but the loads are too full and they put me on standby. I called Eagle to tell them that I wasn't going to make it and HR put me on hold. It lasted about 2 minutes, they picked up and appoligized and said i should have been positive space. I am going next week, now.

 

[Flyer1015]

On an unrelated subject, why does Eagle even bother with a new hire medical exam? Why not just be like any other regional airline, and just require a current 1st class medical? No other regional but Eagle does a new hire medical exam. I'm sure Eagle could save a buck by getting rid of the med exam process. Again, no one else does it.