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Alaska Class 06-03
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AK737FO
Well-known member
- Joined
- Nov 25, 2001
- Posts
- 368
The silver bullet was CP Paul Major's creation. The program officially died when he left the office. The new CP Rob Spero has said that he will honor the list of silver bullets that were in the system prior to his taking office. Now the question is, what is honoring? I think he means that they will look at each silver bullet, thumbs up- give them a phone call, or thumbs down and no phone call (and silver bullet is deposited in the round file). I don't think it will take them long to go through the list. The ANC base CP told me that there were only about 175 on the list a little over a month ago.
Now what will CP Spero do next? He didn't know when he was up north to talk to us. He believes that the old silver bullet program did not serve us well because some guys on the line did not take it seriously - they would recommend anybody at anytime. I don't necessarily agree with him - I think it has served the ANC base well, but I can see his point "outside".
Paul Major hired some furloughed pilots once, who then left us and went back to their first job once the recall came. This really ticked him off and he decided to never hire furloughed pilots again. Rob Spero does not agree with this. He believes that the HR folks can crawl into your mind deep enough to KNOW for sure if a furloughed pilot is serious about never leaving us. So you can expect more furloughed pilots to get phone calls in the future. Since Finan, Forrest and Spero are all X-Navy desk jockeys, I would expect to see more Navy boys and girls getting the call as well.
In the Jan class (I think), there were 3 new hires. Yes a class of three. After the first week one of them left. She was from Texas and had a B737 type rating. Where do you think she went? Now Spero said he wished her well as she cried in his office about how horrible she felt about leaving. He showed her to the door and resisted the urge to smack her in the back of the head with a shovel. It really ticks these guys off when pilots leave... My question is why did she ever even get an interview - from Texas, B737 typed - hello!!! I could fill a class with ANC boys by tomorrow who would love to work the rest of their careers here, but we go to Texas to find this southern bell instead. So much for Mr. Spero's idea that the HR department can get the truth out of folks during an interview...
Stay tuned, more info is probably on the way in the next month or two.
AK737FO
Now what will CP Spero do next? He didn't know when he was up north to talk to us. He believes that the old silver bullet program did not serve us well because some guys on the line did not take it seriously - they would recommend anybody at anytime. I don't necessarily agree with him - I think it has served the ANC base well, but I can see his point "outside".
Paul Major hired some furloughed pilots once, who then left us and went back to their first job once the recall came. This really ticked him off and he decided to never hire furloughed pilots again. Rob Spero does not agree with this. He believes that the HR folks can crawl into your mind deep enough to KNOW for sure if a furloughed pilot is serious about never leaving us. So you can expect more furloughed pilots to get phone calls in the future. Since Finan, Forrest and Spero are all X-Navy desk jockeys, I would expect to see more Navy boys and girls getting the call as well.
In the Jan class (I think), there were 3 new hires. Yes a class of three. After the first week one of them left. She was from Texas and had a B737 type rating. Where do you think she went? Now Spero said he wished her well as she cried in his office about how horrible she felt about leaving. He showed her to the door and resisted the urge to smack her in the back of the head with a shovel. It really ticks these guys off when pilots leave... My question is why did she ever even get an interview - from Texas, B737 typed - hello!!! I could fill a class with ANC boys by tomorrow who would love to work the rest of their careers here, but we go to Texas to find this southern bell instead. So much for Mr. Spero's idea that the HR department can get the truth out of folks during an interview...
Stay tuned, more info is probably on the way in the next month or two.
AK737FO
Last edited:
ferlo
mohammed is the BOMB!!!!
- Joined
- Nov 30, 2002
- Posts
- 539
AK,
Not to offend you or anything but I've been here a few years and I will leave this place in a nano second if a better deal presents itself. Loyalty is a two way street. They have none for us, I have none for them. It's about money. I say Good Luck to anybody who comes here and stays/leaves, whatever. If they wanted SWA level loyalty, they shouldn't have made the conscience desicion to cut our throats. F--- what Rob Spero or anybody else thinks about a personal career choice.
Not to offend you or anything but I've been here a few years and I will leave this place in a nano second if a better deal presents itself. Loyalty is a two way street. They have none for us, I have none for them. It's about money. I say Good Luck to anybody who comes here and stays/leaves, whatever. If they wanted SWA level loyalty, they shouldn't have made the conscience desicion to cut our throats. F--- what Rob Spero or anybody else thinks about a personal career choice.
mach none
wishin I was on a boat
- Joined
- Jan 5, 2002
- Posts
- 669
The ANC Kool-Aid must taste good. Were you the guy on the alpa web board the other day stating how great our management is and you were going to sit back and watch the show? The avatar was similar. I am glad you are sooo happy up there. You do realize your base will be joining the rest of the airline when the mud hen leaves.
Ignorance is bliss.
Ignorance is bliss.
av8instyle
Above Average Member
- Joined
- Jan 8, 2002
- Posts
- 427
It IS different.
Coming from SEA to ANC I can safely say I can understand why one would be a company guy up here. It's bred into the base and the job rocks. Home every night is a touchdown and the flying is fun. But I am not looking forward to going back to work - ie: Trips down south. It's a completely different job, and one that we don't get paid enough for.
Coming from SEA to ANC I can safely say I can understand why one would be a company guy up here. It's bred into the base and the job rocks. Home every night is a touchdown and the flying is fun. But I am not looking forward to going back to work - ie: Trips down south. It's a completely different job, and one that we don't get paid enough for.
AK737FO
Well-known member
- Joined
- Nov 25, 2001
- Posts
- 368
Angry white men.
Man-O-Man am I glad that I am a LOOOONG ways away from SEA. You guys do know that this is an interview board and that all I was doing was giving out some info to guys who are sitting at home waiting for the phone to ring - like we all were a few years ago. Spero was right when he told the ANC pilot group that if he could clone our base, his problems would be solved. Interesting how I took the same pay cut as you, but I can still be a professional and take the high road. There seems to be a batch of guys in SEA that are lost and I am fearful of the damage they will do to this company for years to come. If money is all that matters to a guy - what a shame. I would like to suggest a good book that can put things into perspective if you read it with an open mind - The Purpose Driven Life by Rick Warren.
Ferlo, I wish you well and hope that you find success in your search for the big bucks. I also hope that you are senior to me! What will you do if you go to SWA or someplace else that pays more than Alaska, only to endure a pay cut there? Do you just keep jumping ship and starting over with a new airline every few years chasing the top dollar? SWA will not be king of the hill forever in payrates, there will always be cycles in this industry.
Mach, I don't participate in the ALPA board because it is so negative and vulgar - I find it pretty offensive. When I have looked at it from time to time, there was a large amount of profanity, and it seemed to be the same small batch of guys saying the same negative stuff over and over and over again. In other words, there was no useful information, and a lot of it was offensive, so I don't do the ALPA web board.
Yes, when the MudHen leaves, we will be doing some different flying, but I doubt it will change the base much. It looks like the ANC capt seat should go junior - most guys are unwilling to move up north due to the weather. So as long as we can keep our core group of people (and crew schedulers) up here we will be just fine. Those than do come in from outside can be "assimilated" into the ANC base
Yes Mach, I am pretty darn happy up here. Thanks for caring. Of course I would like a few more dollars at the end of the month - but that will come back someday - maybe even as soon as next year. One thing I know for sure though - if we want to see a pay raise next year, we have to be profitable. To be profitable we need to do our jobs to the best of or individual abilities. I would ask you to give 100% and lets look forward to getting some money back for our families next year.
AK737FO
Man-O-Man am I glad that I am a LOOOONG ways away from SEA. You guys do know that this is an interview board and that all I was doing was giving out some info to guys who are sitting at home waiting for the phone to ring - like we all were a few years ago. Spero was right when he told the ANC pilot group that if he could clone our base, his problems would be solved. Interesting how I took the same pay cut as you, but I can still be a professional and take the high road. There seems to be a batch of guys in SEA that are lost and I am fearful of the damage they will do to this company for years to come. If money is all that matters to a guy - what a shame. I would like to suggest a good book that can put things into perspective if you read it with an open mind - The Purpose Driven Life by Rick Warren.
Ferlo, I wish you well and hope that you find success in your search for the big bucks. I also hope that you are senior to me! What will you do if you go to SWA or someplace else that pays more than Alaska, only to endure a pay cut there? Do you just keep jumping ship and starting over with a new airline every few years chasing the top dollar? SWA will not be king of the hill forever in payrates, there will always be cycles in this industry.
Mach, I don't participate in the ALPA board because it is so negative and vulgar - I find it pretty offensive. When I have looked at it from time to time, there was a large amount of profanity, and it seemed to be the same small batch of guys saying the same negative stuff over and over and over again. In other words, there was no useful information, and a lot of it was offensive, so I don't do the ALPA web board.
Yes, when the MudHen leaves, we will be doing some different flying, but I doubt it will change the base much. It looks like the ANC capt seat should go junior - most guys are unwilling to move up north due to the weather. So as long as we can keep our core group of people (and crew schedulers) up here we will be just fine. Those than do come in from outside can be "assimilated" into the ANC base
Yes Mach, I am pretty darn happy up here. Thanks for caring. Of course I would like a few more dollars at the end of the month - but that will come back someday - maybe even as soon as next year. One thing I know for sure though - if we want to see a pay raise next year, we have to be profitable. To be profitable we need to do our jobs to the best of or individual abilities. I would ask you to give 100% and lets look forward to getting some money back for our families next year.
AK737FO
Ih8AFYesmen
Well-known member
- Joined
- Sep 24, 2003
- Posts
- 227
Management and certain upper crust management pilots at Alaska have no leg to stand on as to being upset at why new hires/FOs are looking to leave for greener pastures. I'm certain that they know the reason, but they just don't give a $hit IMHO.
Hmmmm, let me chime in with a few reasons: raping the pilot group, kicking them when they were down (continuing to do so at the moment), abuse by screw scheduling, lies of growth (ie. 2,000 by 2,000, Vision 2010-WTFO), continuation of various a$$ beatings(ie. unsuitable hotels, sick leave issues, threats), etc. etc. etc.
This company has a serious inferiority complex if they get roused up due to people leaving. They need to just fix the problem and not act like that they are through these gay problem solving "working groups" by hiring more middle managers. Reminds me of the rediculous "problem solving" exercises we used to do during ROTC summer field training.
As for the new hire who left for SWA.... ask a group of FOs if they'd leave for SWA,FedEx, etc. if given a chance. I'm willing to bet the majority would. I know I would.
The koolaid only tastes good until your bank account drys up. Yeah, yeah, yeah.... no one put a gun to my head to work here. And thank God, no one is putting a gun to my head to stay neither.
Hmmmm, let me chime in with a few reasons: raping the pilot group, kicking them when they were down (continuing to do so at the moment), abuse by screw scheduling, lies of growth (ie. 2,000 by 2,000, Vision 2010-WTFO), continuation of various a$$ beatings(ie. unsuitable hotels, sick leave issues, threats), etc. etc. etc.
This company has a serious inferiority complex if they get roused up due to people leaving. They need to just fix the problem and not act like that they are through these gay problem solving "working groups" by hiring more middle managers. Reminds me of the rediculous "problem solving" exercises we used to do during ROTC summer field training.
As for the new hire who left for SWA.... ask a group of FOs if they'd leave for SWA,FedEx, etc. if given a chance. I'm willing to bet the majority would. I know I would.
The koolaid only tastes good until your bank account drys up. Yeah, yeah, yeah.... no one put a gun to my head to work here. And thank God, no one is putting a gun to my head to stay neither.
K. Marx
Active member
- Joined
- Nov 16, 2005
- Posts
- 42
AK737FO said:
Profitable or not, they will find a way to show a loss. They will want more, regardless. I agree that we will get some of it back. However, because of people like you it will not be as much as it should be. I am sick of people at this company believing that being able to live in Alaska or the Pac NW is added compensation. We will never get what we deserve as long as their are many like you here.
ferlo
mohammed is the BOMB!!!!
- Joined
- Nov 30, 2002
- Posts
- 539
Never said a better offer would come from ANY airline...I Don't mind leaving the industry.
If you understand the inclination to hit a girl in the back of her head with a shovel because she left basic indoc to go to a better paying, more stable, non A-hole managed, airline, I'd say you're better off in the arctic playing with snowballs far away from true professionals who understand their worth.
If you understand the inclination to hit a girl in the back of her head with a shovel because she left basic indoc to go to a better paying, more stable, non A-hole managed, airline, I'd say you're better off in the arctic playing with snowballs far away from true professionals who understand their worth.
alaskaplt
Well-known member
- Joined
- Jan 22, 2005
- Posts
- 138
AK737FO said:
Unbelievable. Glad to see you anger is directed where it should be. It seems to be directly pointed at the very people that will fight to get your pay back. After we do get something back I bet you will be one of the ones saying, "see I told you it is a great place to be". Just remember any progress will be in spite of the Kool-aid drinking "Arctic Eagle" types.
AK737FO
Well-known member
- Joined
- Nov 25, 2001
- Posts
- 368
Sad situation
It is very sad to see many of you SEA guys so down and out. Your life stinks, your job sucks, everything is a mess. My heart goes out to you - there is a better way to live.
Actually, I believe there is one person who is most responsible for our current situation. When he was MEC chair, he told new hire classes that they were idiots for coming to work here and that they should have gone to UAL or DAL. After he left the MEC, he then took our negotiating committee down the path of destruction. The MEC chair at the time as well as the ANC Capt rep both quit because they could see what was coming, felt they could not stop it, and did not want their names attached to it. This fellow then cut two negotiators out of the team, leaving just him and one other croney to run the show. And here we are. I flew with the ANC capt rep shortly after he quit - I will never forget it. He told me point blank that we were going to arbitration and that we were going to get killed. He even said it would probably be in the 30% range. I blew him off that day, I didn't call my reps, I didn't believe him - but he knew the direction we were being forced down. I decided to get involved, to stay plugged in and to never get blindsided again.
Next week our new MEC will pick new people for the negitiating committee - have you called your rep and voiced your opinion on who you would like to see on or off the comittee? Have you stayed plugged in? Have you volunteered for your union? Have you tried to make it a better place or will you just sit on the sidelines like a chearleader and continually tell yourself how bad it is?
I couldn't disagree with you more. Any progress we make will be because of the ANC base mentality (can do, gitterdone) which I believe is held by the majority of our pilots, who will overcome the vocal, negitive, militant minority that resides in SEA. Our new MEC members have been described by most as "moderates". In other words, militant does not work, so lets get this thing back on track with moderates and real negotiations. Welcome to your future - believe it or not, it will be bright, even when you try to make it otherwise.
It is very sad to see many of you SEA guys so down and out. Your life stinks, your job sucks, everything is a mess. My heart goes out to you - there is a better way to live.
Actually, I believe there is one person who is most responsible for our current situation. When he was MEC chair, he told new hire classes that they were idiots for coming to work here and that they should have gone to UAL or DAL. After he left the MEC, he then took our negotiating committee down the path of destruction. The MEC chair at the time as well as the ANC Capt rep both quit because they could see what was coming, felt they could not stop it, and did not want their names attached to it. This fellow then cut two negotiators out of the team, leaving just him and one other croney to run the show. And here we are. I flew with the ANC capt rep shortly after he quit - I will never forget it. He told me point blank that we were going to arbitration and that we were going to get killed. He even said it would probably be in the 30% range. I blew him off that day, I didn't call my reps, I didn't believe him - but he knew the direction we were being forced down. I decided to get involved, to stay plugged in and to never get blindsided again.
Next week our new MEC will pick new people for the negitiating committee - have you called your rep and voiced your opinion on who you would like to see on or off the comittee? Have you stayed plugged in? Have you volunteered for your union? Have you tried to make it a better place or will you just sit on the sidelines like a chearleader and continually tell yourself how bad it is?
I couldn't disagree with you more. Any progress we make will be because of the ANC base mentality (can do, gitterdone) which I believe is held by the majority of our pilots, who will overcome the vocal, negitive, militant minority that resides in SEA. Our new MEC members have been described by most as "moderates". In other words, militant does not work, so lets get this thing back on track with moderates and real negotiations. Welcome to your future - believe it or not, it will be bright, even when you try to make it otherwise.
ferlo
mohammed is the BOMB!!!!
- Joined
- Nov 30, 2002
- Posts
- 539
I agree, the union made very serious mistakes. But hindsight is 20/20 and at the time, I wouldn't have voted for anything the company proposed. Now it looks like a good deal, again with the hindsight thing.
Another thing, if you think it's "sad" I feel it's all about the money, remember to this company the only, and I mean ONLY thing that matters is the dollars, quarters, dimes, nickles and pennies. They would destroy you if it meant more of it...despite the christian prayer cards. As distasteful as this notion may be for you, it's reality, Welcome.
Another thing, if you think it's "sad" I feel it's all about the money, remember to this company the only, and I mean ONLY thing that matters is the dollars, quarters, dimes, nickles and pennies. They would destroy you if it meant more of it...despite the christian prayer cards. As distasteful as this notion may be for you, it's reality, Welcome.
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alaskaplt
Well-known member
- Joined
- Jan 22, 2005
- Posts
- 138
Sluys did not take your money away from you. No, make no mistake about it, it was the company. I do not understand how anyone in this entire industry right now (SWA excluded) can not see who the enemy is. Obviously the MEC and negotiating committee made some mistakes. Hindsight is 20/20. Moving forward, is Sluys going to come after more of your money, No. Is the company? You can bet your life on it. Not one of us has said our life is so horrible, as you like to say. We are just not blind. We can see the company for what it is now and are ready for a big fight.
mach none
wishin I was on a boat
- Joined
- Jan 5, 2002
- Posts
- 669
AK737FO said:
Yes, I have called my rep. Yes, I am volunteering and am very active in the union. Yes, I am plugged in. Yes, I am attempting to make this a better place so you can sit on your high horse and throw grenades at me and the committee members because I am a loud mouth Seattle pilot that has taken your job to heart.
I am sure Spero would love to clone the ANC base. Your get r dun attitude violates the CBA and has helped foster management's attitude and state of affairs. Management loves the CBA is just a guideline attitude.
I wish things would have turned out better from the negotiations. But I am doing something to help the cause...Are you AKFO?
AK737FO
Well-known member
- Joined
- Nov 25, 2001
- Posts
- 368
Mach,
To the best of my knowledge, I have never violated the CBA. I do enjoy the notion, that a lot of guys down south hold, that the ANC base is full of a bunch of rule breaking cowboys. It makes for fun conversations with my SEA friends! My faithful old horse is tired and will be retired soon, but it has been a heck of a good ride! I hear that the 4/7/8/9 is a more stable grenade platform anyhow.
Last time I checked I volunteer on three different committees for our union. Matter of fact I spent most of this morning working on stuff. I'm glad to hear that you are involved, even if we see things differently. Lets hope that all our work pays off in 2007.
To the best of my knowledge, I have never violated the CBA. I do enjoy the notion, that a lot of guys down south hold, that the ANC base is full of a bunch of rule breaking cowboys. It makes for fun conversations with my SEA friends! My faithful old horse is tired and will be retired soon, but it has been a heck of a good ride! I hear that the 4/7/8/9 is a more stable grenade platform anyhow.
Last time I checked I volunteer on three different committees for our union. Matter of fact I spent most of this morning working on stuff. I'm glad to hear that you are involved, even if we see things differently. Lets hope that all our work pays off in 2007.
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