Airnet challengers

[$$$4nothin]

Just to let everybody know the Jet Ride part of airnet is getting 2 Challenger 601's. Just thought someone might want to know.

 

[HAZ-MAT]

Putting one in Kansas City (MKC)

 

[wings421]

I've heard that it is one 601 and one 604.

 

[payton]

last i heard the 601 in kc fell apart, the 604 should be on line in columbus any day

 

[starchkr]

Why CMH?!?!?!?!? I would think about going over if it were anywhere but CMH. MAybe APA or Somewhere out west...but who knows.

 

[wings421]

Why CMH?!?!?!?!? I would think about going over if it were anywhere but CMH. MAybe APA or Somewhere out west...but who knows.

I see in my crystal ball - none of our current pilots getting to fly the thing. Hiring off the street to begin. Hopefully in the future we'll get to fly em.

 

[starchkr]

we should be able to slip into the SIC spot. Same way prop guys get to do the SIC in the Lear. We just cannot go directly to the PIC position. There are no restrictions on that, we will just need to go through Simuflite/ Flightsafety for it.

 

[wings421]

From what I've heard (from reliable sources), I'd be suprised to see us in the right seat, in the begining at least.

 

[DirkkDiggler]

When Airnet got the Lear 60's and I worked there as a prop PIC, I called Craig Washka and asked him what I needed to do to get one of the Lear 60 slots that they were hiring for at the time. He told me that they were only hiring outside the company or from the right seat of the lear 35 because it was too big of a jump to change from a Baron to a Lear 60. This was after I had worked for the company in the freight side of things for over a year and a half. This seemed really strange to me for a couple reasons: 1. Regional airlines consistently hire flight instructors and place them directly into Regional Jets after only flying 172's and Seminoles. If the regionals can do it then Airnet should be able to take a company pilot with a hell of a lot more experience in weather and much higher performance pistons and place him or her in the right seat of a Lear 60. 2. Airnet would hire a guy off the street who they know nothing about rather than take someone who has a proven track record with the company for the past year and a half. How does that make any sense? It seemed to me that Craig (or the company) just wanted to hire from outside instead of honoring the seniority list that was in place. Oh well, that's why I don't work there any more.

 

[starchkr]

Got some more info on the Challengers...

They are not taking people from our list yet because none of us have the higher insurance mins to do it. Something like a few hundred hours in type with lots of time in jets or something like that. Eventually they will hire from our list to the right seat as a few of our guys build time and are able to upgrade into the 601/4. The CMH jet is in place, with one of our guys flying it and we are hiring 2 off the street is what i heard. The owner of the jet requested that the current airnet capt that flew his lear 60 come over and fly his new jet. None of this has to do with wanting to hire off the street and ignore our seniority list or anything, it has to do with the program we are part of for our charters and the insurance req's that go along with it. We will be able to get a shot though, just give it some time...just like the 60, which started out just the same.

 

[TaxiDriver]

Not trying to start a fight here, however.....

Once you have the opportunity to fly passengers, you will understand why management would rather hire pilots off the street with passenger flying experience. I have a feeling that the JetRide operation is a new venture for Airnet and is something they want to be successful. The only way this will happen is for JetRide to be different and operated at a higher level than all other Part 135 passenger operations. This could be why they are hiring experienced pilots with solid in-flight customer service skills to crew these airplanes.

It's not about who is better suited to fly the airplane. It's about anticipating the customers needs. They don't care if you can fly an airplane to minimums, the customer only cares about if their catering order is correct, the limos are where they need to be, the cabin temperature is exactly where they want it, and the diet orange soda only found in certain areas of the US in the icebox. That's the level of service given by successful charter operators. That's what is involved in keeping customers.

I am sure there will be much disagreement on this by current AirNet cargo pilots. However, trust me on this one. If you want to get into these JetRide aircraft in the future, the JetRide operation must have the ability to estabilish is presence as a leader in Part 135 passenger operations and build a large client base. For this to happen, as they are currently doing, AirNet is required to hire experienced pilots who are familiar with the needs of the customers you will be flying in the years to come.

....just my 1 cent

 

[freightdoggie]

I beg to differ. I think customer service can be taught just as flying techniques are taught. It takes some time sure, but the PIC with the experience is there to back up the SIC. If they are promoting within, it wouldnt be directly to captain anyways. I think your point would be valid if they were taking an all cargo crew, and throwing them in the same airplane with passengers, that would be a nightmere for the customers.

 

[DirkkDiggler]

Freightdoggy,


I disagree with your assesment to a point. I agree that customer service can be taught but let's not be ridiculous here. Just because you took a job with a freight company doesn't mean you have no people skills. Many people have taken freight jobs because there weren't any regional or corporate jobs available. You all are making it seem like you are either BORN a freight pilot or a people pilot. Just because you fly freight doesn't mean that you aren't capable of catering to people and just having an overall sense of awareness of people's needs. Also, if you're talking about flying smoothly and not just being a chauffer to your clients, I know a lot of freight pilots who are much smoother stick and rudder guys than guys I now fly with at the regionals. I don't see any reason why Airnet couldn't take two freight pilots, put them in a passenger Lear, and wind up with some very happy passengers. Airnet has hired some quality people in the last two years (the only two years I am qualified to comment on) and I don't think that any two of them would have any problems dealing with people and making them happy. Now if it's an insurance reason for not hiring within, fine. But I still think it's a bit of Airnet politics and frankly, B.S.

 

[freightdoggie]

Dirk, I agree with you more than I came off in my last post. I dont think it would be that difficult for some one on the freight side to service the customers. I think the real reason for them not taking a captain on the lear and making them a captain on the challenger is insurance. But as far as moving some one into the right seat, right away, that is definetly airnet politics at its finest.

Freight crews can fly smoothly if they so desire, to say otherwise is a stereotype. With a few exceptions as always...

 

[350DRIVER]

I guess those Lear captains who have recently been hired at SWA have no people skills?. Get fukcing real folks, this is a complete disgrace with regards to not taking people from within the Airnet senority list and allowing them to upgrade into these airplanes. The whole argument that I have read thus far is comical at best and has no bearing on these guys being able to get the job done first class. First dibs should be given to those who are already on the senority list and who have paid their dues.

The insurance reqt's. can be "massaged" and worked with through negotiations. I was a King Air and 421 captain right at 1200TT. It has been done and will continue to be done. The insurance company wanted a minimum of 3000TT, 500 make and model, etc, so don't say this decision is based solely on what the insurance company is mandating and/or requiring. There is absolutely no reason why these guys are not given the chance to move up and better themselves. If I were an Airnet pilot present day I would be just a tad outraged.


Why have a senority list in the first place then?. This is insane in my opinion. You have guys who have busted their asses for 2 years who are being overlooked for "new hires". Something has to give.....

3 5 0

 

[FL717]

I guess those Lear captains who have recently been hired at SWA have no people skills?. Get fukcing real folks, this is a complete disgrace with regards to not taking people from within the Airnet senority list and allowing them to upgrade into these airplanes. The whole argument that I have read thus far is comical at best and has no bearing on these guys being able to get the job done first class. First dibs should be given to those who are already on the senority list and who have paid their dues.
.....

3 5 0

There is two completely different arguments here, and you attempt to justify both by lumping them together, and in fact they are completely opposing and unrelated.

First... I agree that if I were a current pilot at AirNet I would be p!ssed as well. I naturally would not be happy that off-the-street pilots were filling a positon in a company that I would like to have.

Second... that being said, your comparison to a Lear Driver being hired at SWA as proof to your lumped argument is a complete irrelevant point. If you truely believe that comparison, then I believe there is a lack of understanding you have in regards to 121 "Bus Drivers" versus a 135 "Limo/Taxi Drivers".

Because a frieght dawg can go to a Pax 121 Airline, and successfully wave hello/goodbye to passengers, gives absolutely no creedance whether they will be able to effectively interact face-to-face with direct "clients". It also says nothing about ones "customer service skills". If you have never flown as a "full service" on demand charter, you may not get this. If you have then this should be a "no-brainer" discussion for you.

Big difference, and many pilots of all backgrounds will make that jump easily, others cannot and never will. Its all about people, social, and catering skills... not pilot skills. Some of these skills cannot be effectively taught or accomplished. I'm sure you've flown with pilots of all backgrounds that you know fit this picture I paint.

So.... back at AirNet, they start this new On-Demand project that everyone wants to grow and be successful. How do you sort them (Pilots) out?

I believe that this is a AirNet/Pilots problem and a fleet transfer referral program should be implemented so that those that have that ability can... and do. I hope they get this done, as it is a waste of some real talent and experience they have in their pilot ranks.

 

[DirkkDiggler]

Big difference, and many pilots of all backgrounds will make that jump easily, others cannot and never will. Its all about people, social, and catering skills... not pilot skills. Some of these skills cannot be effectively taught or accomplished. I'm sure you've flown with pilots of all backgrounds that you know fit this picture I paint.

So.... back at AirNet, they start this new On-Demand project that everyone wants to grow and be successful. How do you sort them (Pilots) out?

You don't think a simple interview process would work? That's what they currently have but they only interview outsiders. As a former Airnet pilot I can tell you that there are at least 100 pilots on the freight side of things that would have fine customer service skill in a charter operation. And Airnet already knows that they can fly the aircraft! It's B.S. politics plain and simple.

 

[FL717]

You don't think a simple interview process would work? That's what they currently have but they only interview outsiders. As a former Airnet pilot I can tell you that there are at least 100 pilots on the freight side of things that would have fine customer service skill in a charter operation. And Airnet already knows that they can fly the aircraft! It's B.S. politics plain and simple.

Did you read my post??

Please re-read my last two sentences. I'm on your side... I just disagree with the post of the person I quoted earlier.

 

[DirkkDiggler]

No harm done.

 

[Guillotine007]

If I were an Airnet pilot present day I would be just a tad outraged. 3 5 0

if you were an airnet pilot, that would be towards the bottom of your list of things upsetting you.