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Airline Biz Blog Reports on SWAPA/ALPA Process Agreement

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What's the matter Vix, can't get the AirTran guys to gulp down the company Kool-aid??
 
PCL_128 said:
That's not what actually happened. Don't believe everything you read.
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I had a SWA Negotiating Committee member on my jumpseat just this past Monday and I asked him about ALPA deciding to reneg on the Process Agreement. He backed up what Captain Chase said.

AAI AirTran wanted some transitional language in the Process Agreement since they knew they were not going to be party to a Transition Agreement. They put the language in the Process Agreement in December and SWAPA agreed to some of it.

However, now AAI ALPA has decided that it doesn't like the VERY language that they put in the Process Agreement themselves.

So, that being said what is your explanation for it? Stating "Don't believe everything you read" holds no water.
 
LeeRoyJenkins said:
I had a SWA Negotiating Committee member on my jumpseat just this past Monday and I asked him about ALPA deciding to reneg on the Process Agreement. He backed up what Captain Chase said.

AAI AirTran wanted some transitional language in the Process Agreement since they knew they were not going to be party to a Transition Agreement. They put the language in the Process Agreement in December and SWAPA agreed to some of it.

However, now AAI ALPA has decided that it doesn't like the VERY language that they put in the Process Agreement themselves.

So, that being said what is your explanation for it? Stating "Don't believe everything you read" holds no water.
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Ok... AAI put the language in - why is it such a big deal for Prez. Chase to take it out????? I smell a rat.
 
Max Powers said:
Ok... AAI put the language in - why is it such a big deal for Prez. Chase to take it out????? I smell a rat.
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I don't know. Call Captain Chase and ask him.

Better yet call the AAI M&A Committee and ask them why their attention span is worse than a 6 year old on a sugar high.
 
LeeRoyJenkins said:
I had a SWA Negotiating Committee member on my jumpseat just this past Monday and I asked him about ALPA deciding to reneg on the Process Agreement. He backed up what Captain Chase said.

AAI AirTran wanted some transitional language in the Process Agreement since they knew they were not going to be party to a Transition Agreement. They put the language in the Process Agreement in December and SWAPA agreed to some of it.

However, now AAI ALPA has decided that it doesn't like the VERY language that they put in the Process Agreement themselves.

So, that being said what is your explanation for it? Stating "Don't believe everything you read" holds no water.
Click to expand...

You are telling me that a SWAPA Negotiating Committee member backed up what CA Chase said? WOW that's odd. Did he tell you they added language after ALPA requested the change and thats where we are now. Let the Chest thumping begin. Our guys say this, your guys say that. If SWAPA wont agree to the language then it was something that could really screw ATN guys. The lawyers did there job.
 
Complex agreements have many moving parts. A change here and there can have unforeseen consequences. One part may contradict another, or rely on a part that is modified or removed entirely, thus negating or modifying an important part.

I'm not saying that it what happened, because I don't know the specifics, but why don't we let the people who we have chosen to work on our behalf do their job?

Additionally, if an AAI guy came on here and started second-guessing SWAPA, your negotiators, or your President, you would be spitting mad, "Leeroy". Why do you think it's OK to treat your AAI future coworkers with such little respect? Are you really that small, angry and bitter? Apparently, you've caught the microphallus bug, too. Maybe you should find a shrink instead of a message board. :rolleyes:
 
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Max Powers said:
Ok... AAI put the language in - why is it such a big deal for Prez. Chase to take it out????? I smell a rat.
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I'll bet it's like a Vegas wedding. What sounded like a good idea on Friday doesn't look so good on Monday.

Our unions will get together in a month or so to resume the meetings and they'll work it out. In the meantime life goes on.

Gup
 
We should ignore them for a month or two or in fact a year or two let them keep making RJ wages. I can hold out for another 20 years or so.

ALPA will kill this deal in the end........I'm just saying
 
flynvixen said:
We should ignore them for a month or two or in fact a year or two let them keep making RJ wages. I can hold out for another 20 years or so.

ALPA will kill this deal in the end........I'm just saying
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Yawn...........
 
stalker said:
Talking about money I keep hearing you guys are already five million in the hole to alpa. Just curious where does the money come from to repay them, and the ongoing legal bill that will be run up over the next few years?
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As a Legacy dues paying ALPA member, I feel this battle is a worthy and good allocation of our dues. I support the AirTran pilots and wish them a fair and even handed SLI, that will be our payback.
 
It will be a fair even handed SLI. One side will not see it that way when It is over though.

This won't be a case of everyone being pissed when it is done. The cards are squarely in one sides corner and that will count for more than anything else in the end.

One thing is for sure and that is the AirTran pilots will be treated fairly and no matter the SLI result it will have been handled equitably as far as they are concerned.

The SWA pilots will be pleased when it is finished but we need to thrash in the meantime.
 
GuppyWN said:
Our unions will get together in a month or so to resume the meetings and they'll work it out. In the meantime life goes on.
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Would be surprised if they've haven't at *LEAST* been passing emails back and forth on proposals since the whole issue came up, much less had some telephone or video meetings about it.

The fact that it's taken over a week to hammer out one small change tells me that, as was mentioned before, the lawyers likely caught something in the new language that was T.A.'d in the final hours of talks (just like our update from the MEC said last Friday) that contradicted something that had been previously agreed to back in Dec (like Chase said in his update). The truth is always somewhere in the middle...

Like Ty said, sometimes when pilots are crafting complex documents, our linear thinking doesn't go back and remember something we did two months ago and prompt us to say "Hey wait a second, that won't work with this sentence on page 27 that we worked on back before Christmas." Works the same with contract negotiations, and that's why both sides have lawyers.

It'll get worked out... obviously it was something important or it would have been solved by now. Like Gup said,,, life goes on. :beer:
 
Or the lawyers know how to get a billable hour out of a client that's going away...
 
Bill Nelson said:
It will be a fair even handed SLI. One side will not see it that way when It is over though.

This won't be a case of everyone being pissed when it is done. The cards are squarely in one sides corner and that will count for more than anything else in the end.

One thing is for sure and that is the AirTran pilots will be treated fairly and no matter the SLI result it will have been handled equitably as far as they are concerned.

The SWA pilots will be pleased when it is finished but we need to thrash in the meantime.
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Well sorry, but you will be disappointed, but you will be more realistic about your next SLI expectations after you buy AS. You all will be past the steep part of the learning curve by then.

Cheers
 
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flynvixen said:
We should ignore them for a month or two or in fact a year or two let them keep making RJ wages. I can hold out for another 20 years or so.

ALPA will kill this deal in the end........I'm just saying
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That's what I see happening also. The AirTran boys will never take their heads out of their butts. What a shame. I don't think a staple is even on the table anymore. Likely they will offer preferential interviews to some of the Guadaloupe pilots - the ones that actually want to be at Southwest will get an interview.
 
bob dylan said:
that's what i see happening also. The airtran boys will never take their heads out of their butts. What a shame. I don't think a staple is even on the table anymore. Likely they will offer preferential interviews to some of the guadaloupe pilots - the ones that actually want to be at southwest will get an interview.
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tool!
 
three
 
livintheredream said:
tool!
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Just don't feed the trolls (responding to their posts) and they'll eventually go away.

Been dozens of them during the time this board has been running, they come, and eventually, after everyone realizes they're not here to offer anything constructive and they just start ignoring them, they go away (or create a new screen name).

Nothing to see here... moving along... ;)
 
Lear70 said:
after everyone realizes they're not here to offer anything constructive and they just start ignoring them, they go away (or create a new screen name) ;)
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Hey, I'm doing my part!

This message is hidden because flynvixen is on your ignore list.

This message is hidden because Bob Dylan is on your ignore list.

This message is hidden because roughneck is on your ignore list.

This message is hidden because orangebellyav8r is on your ignore list.
 
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Lear70 said:
Just don't feed the trolls (responding to their posts) and they'll eventually go away.

Been dozens of them during the time this board has been running, they come, and eventually, after everyone realizes they're not here to offer anything constructive and they just start ignoring them, they go away (or create a new screen name).

Nothing to see here... moving along... ;)
Click to expand...

Great in theory, but the practical application leaves something to be desired ... OYS and GL are still here ...
 
Vixen is an embarrassment to real SWA pilots. Flame-baiter extraordinaire, in fact the Master Baiter.
 
Jetjockey said:
Vixen is an embarrassment to real SWA pilots. Flame-baiter extraordinaire, in fact the Master Baiter.
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Oh please MR. Jetjockey,

are the opposing view points, other than the complete BS that comes from ALPA so offensive to you ???

WTFO man up and stand your ground. You cant because you know you are on the losing side of this one and it burns you up that ALPA is not going to save you on this one and you guys are not going to get everything ALPA hase promised.

Learn to live with it and stop dragging your feet and paying the lawyers.

Descent Check
 
vixen perhaps if you had something constructive to bring to the conversation then you would not be considered an embarrassment to swa pilots. All you seem to have to say is variations of alpa sucks, airtran sucks and of course hoping all the aai guys get fenced off until they are out of work. You may or may not be a tool, but you sure do act like one.
 

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